How competitive is 4th cat racing?
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Cheers guys, indeed it makes sense, just apparently most of the guys who ride at Ilton use 53/11. I'm more of a spinner anyway and can't imagine ever needing a bigger gear on the flat. Will have a go at a training session in April anyway:)0
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65km/hr (40.4mph) is the top speed I hit in 4 Ilton races last year (down the back of the course). You definitely don't need a 53/11 for the sprint at the end either.0
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cojones wrote:The 4th Cat I'm racing in next month (my first) is a mix of able-bodied and paracyclists. What does that mean for the race (dynamics, speed, danger) as I'm assuming (perhaps unfairly) that the paracyclists may not be able to maintain as fast a pace as the able-bodied guys?
There is a guy with one leg who I have seen in the E123 races at hillingdon this winter. He is awesome. You have made a very unfair assumption...0 -
Scotsken wrote:cojones wrote:The 4th Cat I'm racing in next month (my first) is a mix of able-bodied and paracyclists. What does that mean for the race (dynamics, speed, danger) as I'm assuming (perhaps unfairly) that the paracyclists may not be able to maintain as fast a pace as the able-bodied guys?
There is a guy with one leg who I have seen in the E123 races at hillingdon this winter. He is awesome. You have made a very unfair assumption...
Agreed - I know one paracyclist who races on a 2nd cat licence. Awesome rider.0 -
Imposter wrote:Scotsken wrote:cojones wrote:The 4th Cat I'm racing in next month (my first) is a mix of able-bodied and paracyclists. What does that mean for the race (dynamics, speed, danger) as I'm assuming (perhaps unfairly) that the paracyclists may not be able to maintain as fast a pace as the able-bodied guys?
There is a guy with one leg who I have seen in the E123 races at hillingdon this winter. He is awesome. You have made a very unfair assumption...
Agreed - I know one paracyclist who races on a 2nd cat licence. Awesome rider.
I don't think this guy's too shabby either! http://app.strava.com/athletes/269248 Even got Gold in Bejing I believe
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Thanks guys...I did caveat my assumption :-p
I'm a C5 paracyclist and there's no way out on the standard road that I can maintain a 24-25mph average over 50-60 minutes. I'm lucky if I get 20mph. I just wanted to get an idea of whether the 4th cats would naturally break up into able-bodied and paras, that's all.0 -
cojones wrote:Thanks guys...I did caveat my assumption :-p
I'm a C5 paracyclist and there's no way out on the standard road that I can maintain a 24-25mph average over 50-60 minutes. I'm lucky if I get 20mph. I just wanted to get an idea of whether the 4th cats would naturally break up into able-bodied and paras, that's all.
If the race breaks up, it will break up into those who can hold whatever pace is being set and those who can't. Don't confuse the average speed you can maintain on your own over 60mins to the average speed of a 60min circuit race. The two are very different. Most of the circuits I ride run off at between 24-26mph avge - but I struggle to maintain 19mph avge if I'm pushing hard on a 1hr training ride on my own.0 -
Imposter wrote:Don't confuse the average speed you can maintain on your own over 60mins to the average speed of a 60min circuit race. The two are very different. Most of the circuits I ride run off at between 24-26mph avge - but I struggle to maintain 19mph avge if I'm pushing hard on a 1hr training ride on my own.
*Facepalm* duh...of course...thanks for pointing out the obvious, seems I was having a blonde moment*
Cheers,
Coj
* now I've probably offended blondes as well as paracyclists
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peejay78 wrote:it's competitive because it's a race.
my main advice would be to try to stay alive. i strongly suspect the sport will be taking a substantial new influx of riders this year, emboldened by the wiggo effect, very few of whom will have come through the traditional club route. the growth in cycling is on an exponential curve. this is all well and good but it's going to make for some crashy-boom-bashy moments on circuits up and down the land.
So true! Maybe I'll fit some tri-bars and have a crack at time trials...any contact with the ground will be purely my fault then!0 -
Lycraboy_Andy wrote:peejay78 wrote:it's competitive because it's a race.
my main advice would be to try to stay alive. i strongly suspect the sport will be taking a substantial new influx of riders this year, emboldened by the wiggo effect, very few of whom will have come through the traditional club route. the growth in cycling is on an exponential curve. this is all well and good but it's going to make for some crashy-boom-bashy moments on circuits up and down the land.
So true! Maybe I'll fit some tri-bars and have a crack at time trials...any contact with the ground will be purely my fault then!
Bah, what's life if you don't take risks.0 -
i did my first race the other week, and although i trained hard over winter and to be honest expected to win, found it much harder than i expected.
it all depends on how much work you choose to do at the front really, i stayed towards the front as i didn't wanna get tangled up in the bunch.
whatever you decide to do, im sure you will love it. racing has a buzz about it that no other situation can replicate!
good luck.0 -
joe.90 wrote:i did my first race the other week, and although i trained hard over winter and to be honest expected to win, found it much harder than i expected.
it all depends on how much work you choose to do at the front really, i stayed towards the front as i didn't wanna get tangled up in the bunch.
whatever you decide to do, im sure you will love it. racing has a buzz about it that no other situation can replicate!
good luck.
I think everyone expects to win on their first time and 99.5% don't
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i think a lot of people turn up expecting to win, when perhaps they haven't earned it...there are a lot of people out there training hard, and a lot of new racers...so never under estimate your competition!
having put in the work through winter, i was confident i deserved the result i achieved... which is what i love about cycling in general: the work gets results!0 -
I am the total opposite.
I have been training hard, riding with elites, 1st's & 2nd's through the winter, proper training program etc etc, and feel quite strong and "ready".. BUT.. i am noway in any form looking to win for the first time, I will be happy just to get round and not cause any panic! (or crashes). I am looking to build my expereince of riding in groups, the pace and how to move around in the peleton safely. I will concentrate on getting in postions to win later in the year.
Having said all that, I bet i get red mist and go for the line though! 0 -
Staying upright, enjoying yourself and learning as much as possible are good goals to start with!0
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joe.90 wrote:i think a lot of people turn up expecting to win, when perhaps they haven't earned it...there are a lot of people out there training hard, and a lot of new racers...so never under estimate your competition!
having put in the work through winter, i was confident i deserved the result i achieved... which is what i love about cycling in general: the work gets results!
If it was just about fitness then maybe. But racing isn't just about who's the strongest. That's why people turn up with big balls expecting to smash the field, sit on the front showing how strong they are all race and come 19th. I did it and I'm sure most of the others here did it in their first race.
Edit: And most people 'train hard' it doesn't mean they train right.0 -
Of course. There is a learning curve to racing I agree.
But If your fit enough you can still do the majority of work in a 4th cat race and still win...as long as you dont literally spend the entire time at the front!0 -
Completed the coaching session at Hillingdon at the weekend which was interesting and hopefully a little bit towards confidence. I am planning to have a few more sessions of coaching and a few fast laps round the circuit with my club.
On a totally different topic, but related to racing, how the hell do the event organisers keep a track of the rider positions?? Lets say in a 4th cat race, three riders who are maybe Cat 2 ability make a break away and stay out, then after 30 minutes catch the peleton to lap it and ride with them, and then some people drop.. and person crashes and gets back up, the break away press on, I cant work out how these marshalls know when to ring the bell for last lap, or who has done what, especially if there is 30 odd riders??0 -
saprkzz wrote:Completed the coaching session at Hillingdon at the weekend which was interesting and hopefully a little bit towards confidence. I am planning to have a few more sessions of coaching and a few fast laps round the circuit with my club.
On a totally different topic, but related to racing, how the hell do the event organisers keep a track of the rider positions?? Lets say in a 4th cat race, three riders who are maybe Cat 2 ability make a break away and stay out, then after 30 minutes catch the peloton to lap it and ride with them, and then some people drop.. and person crashes and gets back up, the break away press on, I cant work out how these marshalls know when to ring the bell for last lap, or who has done what, especially if there is 30 odd riders??
Officials will be keeping a note of the rider numbers in a break, or dropped from the bunch, If a rider needs a lap out for a mechanical etc then the onus is on them to report to the commissaire or be placed a lap down.
If the bunch is lapped then technically they should finish on the same lap as the leaders. Photo finish is used to determine positions, so ensure your number is positioned correctly.0 -
Numbers of dropped riders are taken and lapped riders should not take part in the sprint. Digital cameras make photo finishes easier as well as voice recorders.Make mine an Italian, with Campagnolo on the side..0
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4th cat racing is so competative that riders will risk their life and yours for one BC point! :roll:
BTW ex 1st cat if anyone gets upset by my opinion!
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Did my first race down at Elveden this weekend and reading this thread beforehand was very useful. The comment that rang most true was 'if you're not moving forward, you're going backwards'. I noticed if I lost concentration for a minute or so I was very quickly boxed in and back into the middle of the pack. I wasn't constantly switching but just constantly looking for spaces to move into. The other advice I got was to stay in the top 8 as much as you can. Obviously this is everyones aim, especially when the weather is as bad as it was and most people are riding blind due to the spray. Anyway, the advice worked and I stayed out of trouble and did better than I could reasonably have expected so thanks all for the advice!0
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A slight sub topic to the original discussion...
What tends to be the age range of cat 4 riders? I'm 39 in July and don't want to be the Oldest Swinger in Town! 0 -
Don't worry, you won't be. Age range is from up and coming Juniors to eternal 4th cats in their 60s.0
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Thank you MajorMantra, I feel better now.
I'm not naive enough to think I'm going to be any good this season, and not too bothered about scoring points (hence I went for Race Bronze membership). Just want to stay out of trouble, soak up the experience and have fun!0 -
andi1363 wrote:4th cat racing is so competative that riders will risk their life and yours for one BC point! :roll:
BTW ex 1st cat if anyone gets upset by my opinion!
Ex 4th cat as well presumably...0 -
Give it another year and you'll be able to join the League of Veteran Racing Cyclists and then you will be one of the youngsters. Your only problem then will be that you'll struggle to keep up with the over-50s and over-60s.Lycraboy_Andy wrote:What tends to be the age range of cat 4 riders? I'm 39 in July and don't want to be the Oldest Swinger in Town!
Ruth0 -
Do many people race on day licences or bronze memberships? Just wondering following Andy's and another guys comments who finished 3rd but got 10 points due to the other 2 guys not having a full licence.0
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I thought that Ruth!
Although I have read you shouldn't be fooled by the term Veteran....you probably get ex-pros and Olympians racing and by the very definition of the word veteran, it suggests someone who is experienced and highly skilled at something.
Oh and Lance Armstrong is eligible! 0
