Who makes whats where?

nawty

Slightly left field but I find it interesting:

Olive oil doesn't have to be grown and pressed in Italy for it to be called Italian Olive Oil, it only has to be bottled there. So, most "Italian olive oil" you get in supermarkets(think brands like Bertoli etc) isn't Italian at all (or at least in whole) and Italy is the only country where this is permitted.

rolf_f

Neale1978 wrote:

Who makes whats where?

Who cares? GET OVER IT. The right companies still control how frames are made even if they are constructed in the east

Lots of people care thankfully. Caring about supporting local or relatively local industry isn't something 'to be got over' - it is something that helps the local economy and ultimately your own personal comfort. Personally, I'd rather purchase a product that directly or indirectly benefits me rather than someone else.

If you don't care, that's fine - but don't go using your caps lock on those of us who do.

My Ribble Gran Fondo says 'Handcrafted in Italy' on it. In its original form, I'm pretty sure it had never been anywhere near Italy!

MattC59

YIMan

MattC59 wrote:

Great stuff, better get saving up so the Orange 5 gets a British road-brother.

the playing mantis

you obviously care neale, otherwise you wouldnt waste your time making a post castigating others as to why they care, on a thread that you apparently have no interest in, if you dont think people should care, when the easiest thing would be to ignore the thread and not read it, let alone comment on it if you have no interest in it. maybe you should get over it... maybe we shouldnt care about anything, not care where our cars come from, where our food is grown, where our tax money goes...

methinks the lady doth protest too much!!!

Careca

smidsy wrote:

Careca wrote:

Reminds me of a brand that used to have 'hand built in Britain' stickers on them, but they forgot to add that

That is WHY it said hand built in Britain, other wise it would have said hand made in Britain. Nothing wrong with their statement merely your understanding


My Cannondale is handmade in USA and my Basso is Hand Made in Italy. 8)

I know there's nothing wrong with it Mr Winker, but such stickers are there to deliberately mislead people into thinking the product was manufactured in Britain, safe in the knowledge that they actually make no such claim.

MattC59

Careca wrote:

smidsy wrote:

Careca wrote:

Reminds me of a brand that used to have 'hand built in Britain' stickers on them, but they forgot to add that

That is WHY it said hand built in Britain, other wise it would have said hand made in Britain. Nothing wrong with their statement merely your understanding


My Cannondale is handmade in USA and my Basso is Hand Made in Italy. 8)

I know there's nothing wrong with it Mr Winker, but such stickers are there to deliberately mislead people into thinking the product was manufactured in Britain, safe in the knowledge that they actually make no such claim.

Not true.

Bozman

My Look was rolled between Eva Green's thighs........ Apparently

Careca

MattC59 wrote:

Careca wrote:

smidsy wrote:

Careca wrote:

Reminds me of a brand that used to have 'hand built in Britain' stickers on them, but they forgot to add that

That is WHY it said hand built in Britain, other wise it would have said hand made in Britain. Nothing wrong with their statement merely your understanding


My Cannondale is handmade in USA and my Basso is Hand Made in Italy. 8)

I know there's nothing wrong with it Mr Winker, but such stickers are there to deliberately mislead people into thinking the product was manufactured in Britain, safe in the knowledge that they actually make no such claim.

Not true.

So you don't think the stickers are there to mislead? Each to their own, but I do. Having a Union flag sticker and 'hand built in Britain' sticker to me is very suggestive that it was made in Britain. My first BMX, a Puch (don't laugh), was hand built in Britain. It came in a box and I had to build it myself!

MattC59

Careca wrote:

MattC59 wrote:

Careca wrote:

smidsy wrote:

Careca wrote:

Reminds me of a brand that used to have 'hand built in Britain' stickers on them, but they forgot to add that

That is WHY it said hand built in Britain, other wise it would have said hand made in Britain. Nothing wrong with their statement merely your understanding


My Cannondale is handmade in USA and my Basso is Hand Made in Italy. 8)

I know there's nothing wrong with it Mr Winker, but such stickers are there to deliberately mislead people into thinking the product was manufactured in Britain, safe in the knowledge that they actually make no such claim.

Not true.

So you don't think the stickers are there to mislead? Each to their own, but I do. Having a Union flag sticker and 'hand built in Britain' sticker to me is very suggestive that it was made in Britain. My first BMX, a Puch (don't laugh), was hand built in Britain. It came in a box and I had to build it myself!

Not at all. My frame was made in England. Only the English made frames have such a sticker on them, and Enigma are very clear about that. There's no deception or intent to deceive.

smidsy

So I think I am OK.

Neale1978

My De rosa was not actually made in italy. OH the horror! I wont lose any sleep over that though tbh as its the same for other Italian frames and MANY others. The location of production does not matter at all as long as the right people are involved in the process.

Ride more, Think about this crap less IMO

Careca

MattC59 wrote:

Careca wrote:

MattC59 wrote:

Careca wrote:

smidsy wrote:

Careca wrote:

Reminds me of a brand that used to have 'hand built in Britain' stickers on them, but they forgot to add that

That is WHY it said hand built in Britain, other wise it would have said hand made in Britain. Nothing wrong with their statement merely your understanding


My Cannondale is handmade in USA and my Basso is Hand Made in Italy. 8)

I know there's nothing wrong with it Mr Winker, but such stickers are there to deliberately mislead people into thinking the product was manufactured in Britain, safe in the knowledge that they actually make no such claim.

Not true.

So you don't think the stickers are there to mislead? Each to their own, but I do. Having a Union flag sticker and 'hand built in Britain' sticker to me is very suggestive that it was made in Britain. My first BMX, a Puch (don't laugh), was hand built in Britain. It came in a box and I had to build it myself!

Not at all. My frame was made in England. Only the English made frames have such a sticker on them, and Enigma are very clear about that. There's no deception or intent to deceive.

Matt, I think you're talking about something totally different to me. I'm talking about a sticker that said 'hand built', as in the bike was put together in Britain, but made from parts that were made elsewhere, a subtle difference. I am not making any claims about your bike.

MattC59

Careca wrote:

MattC59 wrote:

Careca wrote:

MattC59 wrote:

Careca wrote:

smidsy wrote:

Careca wrote:

Reminds me of a brand that used to have 'hand built in Britain' stickers on them, but they forgot to add that

That is WHY it said hand built in Britain, other wise it would have said hand made in Britain. Nothing wrong with their statement merely your understanding


My Cannondale is handmade in USA and my Basso is Hand Made in Italy. 8)

I know there's nothing wrong with it Mr Winker, but such stickers are there to deliberately mislead people into thinking the product was manufactured in Britain, safe in the knowledge that they actually make no such claim.

Not true.

So you don't think the stickers are there to mislead? Each to their own, but I do. Having a Union flag sticker and 'hand built in Britain' sticker to me is very suggestive that it was made in Britain. My first BMX, a Puch (don't laugh), was hand built in Britain. It came in a box and I had to build it myself!

Not at all. My frame was made in England. Only the English made frames have such a sticker on them, and Enigma are very clear about that. There's no deception or intent to deceive.

Matt, I think you're talking about something totally different to me. I'm talking about a sticker that said 'hand built', as in the bike was put together in Britain, but made from parts that were made elsewhere, a subtle difference. I am not making any claims about your bike.

Eeeerm......

Careca

Dawes are made in the far east but put together in a factory in this country!

neeb

My Trigon RQC29 has a "Made in Taiwan" sticker on it. Do you reckon I could have been conned and the frame might actually have been made in a faceless Mafia sweatshop in Italy?

Seriously though, apparently Trigon make a lot of bikes for other people, I'd be interested to know which ones. I've always thought that my frame looks a little like a Dogma without the melted/curly bits...

the playing mantis

sh*t not allowed to be curious are we on here. have i said it matters? have i said i will lose sleep over where bikes are made, have i said the location matters

good attitude to take though i think,

eat more, who cares about the provenance of the food. just eat it and stop thinking about this cr*p

just drive more, who gives a shit if your merc was put together in eastern europe or the far east, or your marcos was hand built in someones shed in the midlands, or your ssanyong in korea. its just a car.

it seems quite a few others are interested and its created a bit of interesting debate. the simple option if your not interested is to simply ignore the thread, rather than trying to impart your views on other people about how they should also not be interested in such a matter. indeed why even waste your time commenting on something you have no interest in?!

thegreatdivide

Made in Italy can mean cheap carbon and expensive labour, just as Made in Taiwan can mean expensive carbon and cheap labour. Where your bike was made does not mean it's better.

simona75

Careca wrote:

But yeah, Orbea are made in China!

http://www.bicyclingnewsasia.com/en/fea ... ur-kunshan

I always wondered why Google wouldn't work when I was riding mine

Careca

thegreatdivide wrote:

Made in Italy can mean cheap carbon and expensive labour, just as Made in Taiwan can mean expensive carbon and cheap labour. Where your bike was made does not mean it's better.

Tell that to someone with a 'Friday' Ducati

My preference for European made is more about keeping the European economy stronger and not sourcing all production out to the far east. It would be nice if we still had more things manufactured here and it is good that some manufacturers still do. I have no worries about the quality of far eastern made bikes or European ones. Both my bikes are made in the far east and I'm happy with them.

the playing mantis

i would probably say the standards of production in many places in the far east are better than if they were here or in certain parts of europe, considering the the sloppy couldnt give a sh*t attitude of lots of people in this country as an example, wheras i imagine its 'slightly' more stringent in the far east and people value there jobs however menial, a damn site more.

ben@31

Once had some Yorkshire puddings that were made in Lancashire!

Me and t' farther inlaw's racing pigeons were mortified. I took off me flat cap and bowed my head in sorrow.

Careca

the playing mantis wrote:

i would probably say the standards of production in many places in the far east are better than if they were here or in certain parts of europe, considering the the sloppy couldnt give a sh*t attitude of lots of people in this country as an example, wheras i imagine its 'slightly' more stringent in the far east and people value there jobs however menial, a damn site more.

So is that why Orange make their high end stuff here and there lower end stuff in the far east? If your generalisation were true then surely it would be the other way round. Whilst many people may have a bad attitude, there are many more who don't. However, if you were right then I'm sure we'd get plenty of Portuguese, or other EU nationals with a good work ethic, to staff our factories.

I think UK made stuff has a decent reputation these days, and it is good to see that companies such as Hope are still based in the UK.

SwainsL

They make them in the far east because labor is cheaper. You want it made here, you pay more. I don't see why anyone sensible would want to pay twice the price for the exact same thing.

You'd rather go out of pocket and say, "oh, at least I made a 'difference' to our economy". So much bullshit here it's unbelievable.

nicklouse

Careca wrote:

the playing mantis wrote:

i would probably say the standards of production in many places in the far east are better than if they were here or in certain parts of europe, considering the the sloppy couldnt give a sh*t attitude of lots of people in this country as an example, wheras i imagine its 'slightly' more stringent in the far east and people value there jobs however menial, a damn site more.

So is that why Orange make their high end stuff here and there lower end stuff in the far east? If your generalisation were true then surely it would be the other way round. Whilst many people may have a bad attitude, there are many more who don't. However, if you were right then I'm sure we'd get plenty of Portuguese, or other EU nationals with a good work ethic, to staff our factories.

I think UK made stuff has a decent reputation these days, and it is good to see that companies such as Hope are still based in the UK.

seen the welding on a "top line" orange?

the reason Orange have the work done out there is it is so cheap and fast.

it is cheaper to ship English tubesets to Taiwan and have them welded and finished and shipped back that it is to have it done in the UK.

itboffin

NapoleonD wrote:

My Cervelo was hand made by French speaking Canadians in a secret Winnipeg bunker.

In China according to the masshoof text on the side of my R5 box

My trek however is one of the made is USA models, and we all know that must be the real deal ....

Get me with the whole Oprah-boffin

Careca

SwainsL wrote:

They make them in the far east because labor is cheaper. You want it made here, you pay more. I don't see why anyone sensible would want to pay twice the price for the exact same thing.

You'd rather go out of pocket and say, "oh, at least I made a 'difference' to our economy". So much bullshit here it's unbelievable.

Tends to be more profit for the company rather than cheaper prices for the customers though. It always amazed me that far eastern made running shoes, made by the usual suspects, were no cheaper than UK made New Balance ones. Rapha make their stuff in China and charge huge prices, whereas Finisterre make their stuff in Europe and charge similar prices. I'm sure Rapha have stuff made in China to make more money, not to pass on savings to their customers.

And just because someone doesn't share your view it doesn't mean it's bullshit x

the playing mantis

must confess im basing my view on the many many feckless idiots and morons who work in financial services that i have to deal with. so perhaps a sweeping statement, not necessarily with a good to make a judgement!

YIMan

SwainsL wrote:

They make them in the far east because labor is cheaper. You want it made here, you pay more. I don't see why anyone sensible would want to pay twice the price for the exact same thing.

You'd rather go out of pocket and say, "oh, at least I made a 'difference' to our economy". So much bullshit here it's unbelievable.

Naaah....I'd rather not give two hoots, save my two bob now and then wonder why the country has a huge trade deficit and economy problems later. But as long as I've got something cheaper because people in the far-east get paid less for making the same thing, that's the main thing.

YIMan

Oh...and then come on a forum and stick the boot into UK companies claiming the welding's rubbish or the products are overpriced.

And then complain that my taxes are going up, that I'm not getting child benefit any more, that the country is going to the dogs.

And so it goes on.