Building strength for hilly rides

vespario

When out with club I can keep up on flat and on steep climbs but as the ride goes on I get dropped if the ride is lumpy and this is worse on the way back after coffee stop to the point where I really struggle.

I am ok for first 2 hours but run out of strength in my legs. Am 42 and weigh 11 stone. Took up cyling a year ago after running half marathons for years at very respectable times.

Any training tips to build strength and fitness? Thanks.

lucan2

Ride more and you'll get better and stronger. Ride more hills especially, but it's the miles you ride that will make you quicker on the hills. A year isn't a long time to have been cycling, so keep at it and it will come.

joe.90

Ride as many miles as you like, it won't make you faster on hills...what it will do is build your base fitness up, meaning your legs are far less likely to start giving up so early.

Stopping for coffee is a funny one, I never do it as my legs would start to shut down and it would be a major struggle. You may find starting up again always hard work.

To build up strength for hills, do hills intervals in a high gear with low cadence... Works for me!

Slack

If you are struggling later on in the ride, it's because you have taken too much out of the reserves at the start of the ride. Improving your aerobic fitness will improve your core engine efficiency. You don't need strength for hills, just aerobic fitness and use of the correct gearing!

cyco2

So, how many miles a week/year ? Just because you have ridden for a year doesn't mean much.

vespario

Tend to ride about 100 + miles a week in winter. One 70 club run plus one or two shorter rides in the week.

During school holidays this goes up to about 150 a week to 170 depending on weather.

Tend to average around 17mph on most rides or so my garmin tells me.

vespario

Slack wrote:

If you are struggling later on in the ride, it's because you have taken too much out of the reserves at the start of the ride. Improving your aerobic fitness will improve your core engine efficiency. You don't need strength for hills, just aerobic fitness and use of the correct gearing!

I tend to find on the later climbs that I can't push the bigger gears as I seem to ack the strength. My club mates tell me I am spinning in too lower gear but I just can't push the pedals in a bigger one!

amaferanga

It's fitness you lack, not strength. You can't keep on on the later climbs because you're fatigued from pushing harder than your mates earlier in the ride.

If you're just banging out the same rides week after week then you've probably plateaued and now need to do something difference to further improve your fitness.

vespario

Thanks for the advice. Will work on general fitness and vary rides. May invest in a vo2 test and get one training plans from a local trainer.

Herbsman

vespario wrote:

Thanks for the advice. Will work on general fitness and vary rides. May invest in a vo2 test and get one training plans from a local trainer.

Woah, hang on. Save your money and just ride more often. You can easily improve lots without having to resort to anything like that - just figure out how much time you're willing to spend cycling each week and how hard to work in each session.

Maybe try making the shorter rides a bit harder without killing yourself, so you increase your fitness, and at the weekend stay sheltered (i.e. ride mid-pack) for the first half of the club run so you save energy for the second half.

vespario

Herbsman wrote:

vespario wrote:

Thanks for the advice. Will work on general fitness and vary rides. May invest in a vo2 test and get one training plans from a local trainer.

Woah, hang on. Save your money and just ride more often. You can easily improve lots without having to resort to anything like that - just figure out how much time you're willing to spend cycling each week and how hard to work in each session.

Maybe try making the shorter rides a bit harder without killing yourself, so you increase your fitness, and at the weekend stay sheltered (i.e. ride mid-pack) for the first half of the club run so you save energy for the second half.

Like that idea. I ride with the fast group and have considered dropping to the slow group but they are tooo slow.

mike101

Have you got a turbo? I've found that 2 * 20 Threshold sets on the turbo twice a week have improved my pace on Club runs dramatically.

GiantMike

mike101 wrote:

Have you got a turbo? I've found that 2 * 20 Threshold sets on the turbo twice a week have improved my pace on Club runs dramatically.

Or 60 mins at sweetspot.

vespario

Can you explain threshold and swetspot?

mike101

Threshold is the maximum effort you can output in an hour. Sweetspot is 90% of that i.e. comfortably hard. This article explains it in better detail.

http://m.bikeradar.com/road/fitness/art ... sts-34902/

alihisgreat

vespario wrote:

Tend to ride about 100 + miles a week in winter. One 70 club run plus one or two shorter rides in the week.

During school holidays this goes up to about 150 a week to 170 depending on weather.

Tend to average around 17mph on most rides or so my garmin tells me.

How old are you?

vespario

I am 41 and a half.

wardieboy

Do you have a hot younger sister?

Graham K

Have you tried changing your riding pattern, say doing a 15-20 mile sprint flat out instead of a say 50 mile ride, ideally have a hill or 2 in it and time yourself to see progress.

alihisgreat

vespario wrote:

I am 41 and a half.

I just noticed you already mentioned it on the OP :oops:

oldwelshman

Graham K wrote:

Have you tried changing your riding pattern, say doing a 15-20 mile sprint flat out instead of a say 50 mile ride, ideally have a hill or 2 in it and time yourself to see progress.

Wow 15-20 mile sprint flat out, great advice Physically impossible so interested to know how you get on sprinting flat out for 15 miles were most sprinters even the likes of Cav and Hoy normally do max for 200 to 400m and can't do anymore 20 miles hmm

Tom Butcher

Surprised that 100-150 miles a week isn't enough to stick with a club ride - especially at 11 stone in the hills.

Is this a particularly fast club ride or is it starting to kick off a bit when you get dropped - because it may be the lads dropping you are out on chain gangs in the week and you just lack enough high intensity riding to stick with them when they put the hammer down. In other words are you blowing up at 2 hours or are they suddenly accelerating up a hill and you struggle to go with that intensity ?

vespario

Bit of both I think!

joe.90

oldwelshman wrote:

Graham K wrote:

Have you tried changing your riding pattern, say doing a 15-20 mile sprint flat out instead of a say 50 mile ride, ideally have a hill or 2 in it and time yourself to see progress.

Wow 15-20 mile sprint flat out, great advice Physically impossible so interested to know how you get on sprinting flat out for 15 miles were most sprinters even the likes of Cav and Hoy normally do max for 200 to 400m and can't do anymore 20 miles hmm

im pretty sure he didn't literally mean sprinting, just a much faster pace for shorter time.

SBezza

vespario wrote:

Tend to ride about 100 + miles a week in winter. One 70 club run plus one or two shorter rides in the week.

During school holidays this goes up to about 150 a week to 170 depending on weather.

Tend to average around 17mph on most rides or so my garmin tells me.

First of all ride more frequently, 3 rides a week will not really help build fitness, you would have lost virtually all of the fitness in the 4 days you are not riding. If you can try to ride 3 to 4 times during the week, have a rest day before the 70 miler, you will eventually get fitter.

If you can only do an hour or so on each ride during the week, up the intensity, no point doing you 70 mile effort/pace for less than 3 hour IMO. 60 mins at high tempo is a good start, or if you can manage it at sweetspot, but if you are not that fit that might prove to tiring if trying to ride more often as well.

As above, seeing you can do 2 hours at a good pace, strength is a non issue, cardio fitness is the issue.

oldwelshman

joe.90 wrote:

oldwelshman wrote:

Graham K wrote:

Have you tried changing your riding pattern, say doing a 15-20 mile sprint flat out instead of a say 50 mile ride, ideally have a hill or 2 in it and time yourself to see progress.

Wow 15-20 mile sprint flat out, great advice Physically impossible so interested to know how you get on sprinting flat out for 15 miles were most sprinters even the likes of Cav and Hoy normally do max for 200 to 400m and can't do anymore 20 miles hmm

im pretty sure he didn't literally mean sprinting, just a much faster pace for shorter time.

Well he did say sprint "flat out" which does not even come close to saying ride at or just below threshold, flat out is anaerobic and unsustainable over endurance distance, this is a forum and some beginners may read training section for advice and take it as literal. I did put a couple of smiley faces so not being totally pedantic :-)

okgo

oldwelshman wrote:

joe.90 wrote:

oldwelshman wrote:

Graham K wrote:

Have you tried changing your riding pattern, say doing a 15-20 mile sprint flat out instead of a say 50 mile ride, ideally have a hill or 2 in it and time yourself to see progress.

Wow 15-20 mile sprint flat out, great advice Physically impossible so interested to know how you get on sprinting flat out for 15 miles were most sprinters even the likes of Cav and Hoy normally do max for 200 to 400m and can't do anymore 20 miles hmm

im pretty sure he didn't literally mean sprinting, just a much faster pace for shorter time.

Well he did say sprint "flat out" which does not even come close to saying ride at or just below threshold, flat out is anaerobic and unsustainable over endurance distance, this is a forum and some beginners may read training section for advice and take it as literal. I did put a couple of smiley faces so not being totally pedantic :-)

I think you actually were being totally pedantic, to be honest. If you think someone is going to read that, then start sprinting out of the saddle in 53/12 and expect to hold it for 20 miles then you perhaps underestimate humans as a species

Graham K

joe.90 wrote:

oldwelshman wrote:

Graham K wrote:

Have you tried changing your riding pattern, say doing a 15-20 mile sprint flat out instead of a say 50 mile ride, ideally have a hill or 2 in it and time yourself to see progress.

Wow 15-20 mile sprint flat out, great advice Physically impossible so interested to know how you get on sprinting flat out for 15 miles were most sprinters even the likes of Cav and Hoy normally do max for 200 to 400m and can't do anymore 20 miles hmm

im pretty sure he didn't literally mean sprinting, just a much faster pace for shorter time.

Spot on Joe, Cheers.
I have a MTB route of 17 miles, its not the most adventurous, technical or hilly but I use it as a sprint (higher tempo blast) and time myself over and through it,
Since doing this I found I was getting stronger on the slog's and gaining in endurance.
So there you go oldwelshman, hmm :roll:

oldwelshman

Sorry but there is a big difference between high tempo blast and a sprint. If you mean do high tempo ride just say that, sprint efforts are much shorter duration but also have their benefits.

Tom Butcher

There is a relevant point here which is if an hours hard riding on a MTB is a sprint then unless the rider is doing some super fast sprints or something they are probably not doing any real high intensity stuff.

So yes maybe nobody did think they meant actually sprint for an hour but it's worth pointing out an hour is actually quite a long time to be pressing on and the intensity you could sustain isn't that much higher than the longer 50 milers - and certainly closer to that than actually sprinting.

Graham K

oldwelshman wrote:

Sorry but there is a big difference between high tempo blast and a sprint. If you mean do high tempo ride just say that, sprint efforts are much shorter duration but also have their benefits.

Sorry but I will check and re-check each post I make to ensure the pedantic farts on the forum aint awoken


And just to declare, what you class as a sprint and what I class as a sprint may be different