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Who's the Greatest - English Speaking Rider?

tailwindhometailwindhome Posts: 15,520
edited January 2013 in Pro race
Who in your opinion is the best 'English Speaking' rider?

I'm thinking Kelly's palmares takes this one - any counter arguments?
Believe that a farther shore
Is reachable from here.
Believe in miracles
And cures and healing wells
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  • RichN95.RichN95. Posts: 24,088
    I'm thinking Kelly's palmares takes this one - any counter arguments?
    Not from me. LeMond second. Then put Roche, Evans, Simpson and Wiggins and Cavendish in whichever order you fancy.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • Kelly speaks English? :shock:
  • tailwindhometailwindhome Posts: 15,520
    RichN95 wrote:
    I'm thinking Kelly's palmares takes this one - any counter arguments?
    Not from me. LeMond second. Then put Roche, Evans, Simpson and Wiggins and Cavendish in whichever order you fancy.

    Robert Millar above Cavendish but below Wiggins?
    Believe that a farther shore
    Is reachable from here.
    Believe in miracles
    And cures and healing wells
  • RichN95.RichN95. Posts: 24,088
    RichN95 wrote:
    I'm thinking Kelly's palmares takes this one - any counter arguments?
    Not from me. LeMond second. Then put Roche, Evans, Simpson and Wiggins and Cavendish in whichever order you fancy.

    Robert Millar above Cavendish but below Wiggins?
    Based on victories, he's below them both for me. Harsh I know - I grew up watching him.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • mrolimroli Posts: 3,622
    You can put him below, but it doesn't denigrate the achievement. He did it all himself without the structures that are in place now.
  • RichN95.RichN95. Posts: 24,088
    mroli wrote:
    You can put him below, but it doesn't denigrate the achievement. He did it all himself without the structures that are in place now.
    I'm not criticising him. Far from it - I think he's great. It's just a subjective list.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • tailwindhometailwindhome Posts: 15,520
    RichN95 wrote:
    RichN95 wrote:
    I'm thinking Kelly's palmares takes this one - any counter arguments?
    Not from me. LeMond second. Then put Roche, Evans, Simpson and Wiggins and Cavendish in whichever order you fancy.

    Robert Millar above Cavendish but below Wiggins?
    Based on victories, he's below them both for me. Harsh I know - I grew up watching him.

    I'm not convinced Roche shouldn't be above LeMond.

    Roche's 87 v 3 Tours.

    And Roche is Irish whereas LeMond is clearly a Yankee.
    Believe that a farther shore
    Is reachable from here.
    Believe in miracles
    And cures and healing wells
  • Giro, Tour, Worlds vs 3xTours, 2xWorlds? LeMond for me.
  • rick_chaseyrick_chasey Posts: 50,777 Lives Here
    Surprisingly short list really, given how English speakers have infiltrated every corner of the current peloton.

    I'd be tempted to say Armstrong, but it's too much hassle.
  • cal_stewartcal_stewart Posts: 1,840
    LANCE for me even on the gear.

    Please lets not start a big he's evil thread, for me 7 back to back has it in a massively corrupt era.

    His biggest problem is he's not a very nice bloke
    eating parmos since 1981

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  • tailwindhometailwindhome Posts: 15,520
    As the OP I have determined that Lance is eligible for the list but only with his palmares post USADA ban and UCI ratification.

    No further discussion will be entered into on this matter.


    Andy Hampsten and Phil Anderson are entitled to a place on the list.....they won't get near the top tier though.
    Believe that a farther shore
    Is reachable from here.
    Believe in miracles
    And cures and healing wells
  • LangerDanLangerDan Posts: 6,132
    According to the combined (ie. stage races and one-day races) on http://www.cyclinghalloffame.com, the most successful "English-speaking" (IMHO, I think that term has the distinct odour of colonialism) riders are

    LeMond 8100 points
    Kelly 8095
    Evans 3965
    Roche 3735
    Wiggins 2430
    McEwen 1800 (forgot wee Robbie, didn't we)
    Cavendish 1720
    Simpson 1720
    Hampsten 1125
    Millar,R 1075
    'This week I 'ave been mostly been climbing like Basso - Shirley Basso.'
  • bigmatbigmat Posts: 5,111
    LangerDan wrote:
    According to the combined (ie. stage races and one-day races) on http://www.cyclinghalloffame.com, the most successful "English-speaking" (IMHO, I think that term has the distinct odour of colonialism) riders are

    LeMond 8100 points
    Kelly 8095
    Evans 3965
    Roche 3735
    Wiggins 2430
    McEwen 1800 (forgot wee Robbie, didn't we)
    Cavendish 1720
    Simpson 1720
    Hampsten 1125
    Millar,R 1075

    That looks about right to me.
  • RichN95.RichN95. Posts: 24,088
    I made up my own points system (broadly based on the World Tour* system and counting wins only) and the computer said:

    1. Kelly 3506
    2. Roche 1062
    3. LeMond 1016
    4. Cavendish 998
    5. Evans 786
    6. McEwen 752
    7. Wiggins 706
    8. Hampsten 588
    9. Simpson 532
    10. Anderson 436
    11. R Millar 422
    12. Armstrong 300
    13. Hoban 272
    14. Farrar 260
    15. O'Grady 220
    16. Hesjedal 186
    17. D Millar 176

    This is not my opinion - it's Microsoft Excel's - so blame Bill Gates

    (Note: 'Bad Armstrong' would have scored 2400, 'Bad David Millar' 226. 'Bad Hincapie' & 'Bad Leipheimer' didn't score that highly)

    *Worlds & Olympics (RR & TT) and GT jerseys scored points
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • ocdupalaisocdupalais Posts: 3,767
    How about Merckx? He speaks English better than a native: i.e. he's intelligible and almost totally free of grammatical errors...

    Anyway, enough of Axel: his Giro stage win and Belgian Champion's jersey will hardly thrust him into top 100, I imagine...and that's giving him the benefit of doubt as being "Good" Axel.
    That's "Good" Axel; formerly a pro with Telekom, Motorola, Polti, Phonak, etc,
  • NapoleonDNapoleonD Posts: 18,632
    Disappointed no-one has mentioned me :(
    Twitter - @NapD
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    ABCC Cycling Coach
  • nathancomnathancom Posts: 1,567
    Surprisingly short list really, given how English speakers have infiltrated every corner of the current peloton.

    I'd be tempted to say Armstrong, but it's too much hassle.
    I guess similar to a list of all time Belgium footballers despite you having a hell of a team right now.

    I think you have to include Armstrong since without him would cycling be as big in anglophone regions as it is now? He should definitely be demoted several places for is egregious doping though...
  • DrumlinDrumlin Posts: 120
    Beryl Burton
    Would welcome company for Sat rides west/south of Edinburgh, up to 3 hrs, 16mph ish. Please PM me if interested/able to help.
  • symosymo Posts: 1,743
    1. LeMond
    2. Burton
    3. Wiggins
    4. Cav
    5. Miller.
    +++++++++++++++++++++
    we are the proud, the few, Descendents.

    Panama - finally putting a nail in the economic theory of the trickle down effect.
  • tailwindhometailwindhome Posts: 15,520
    symo wrote:
    1. LeMond
    2. Burton
    3. Wiggins
    4. Cav
    5. Miller.


    WTF

    Neither Kelly or Roche make your top 5?
    Believe that a farther shore
    Is reachable from here.
    Believe in miracles
    And cures and healing wells
  • symosymo Posts: 1,743
    Nope
    +++++++++++++++++++++
    we are the proud, the few, Descendents.

    Panama - finally putting a nail in the economic theory of the trickle down effect.
  • ju5t1nju5t1n Posts: 2,028
    RichN95 wrote:
    *Worlds & Olympics (RR & TT) and GT jerseys scored points
    How did Malcolm Elliot do? ...he won a GT jersey
  • cal_stewartcal_stewart Posts: 1,840
    burton was over looked by many and I think if you look at it she was the best
    eating parmos since 1981

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  • tailwindhometailwindhome Posts: 15,520
    symo wrote:
    Nope

    By what criteria?
    RichN95 wrote:
    I made up my own points system

    How did Boardman score? Any points for going round in circles?
    Believe that a farther shore
    Is reachable from here.
    Believe in miracles
    And cures and healing wells
  • symosymo Posts: 1,743
    Hey the question was; who do I believe to be the greatest speaking English rider. Not who do you agree with, met Roche nice bloke and all, but tainted at the end of his career and I just don't warm to Kelly. This is a question about my personal opinion and I gave it. Not saying it is more valid or correct than yours; I just have a different opinion to you.
    +++++++++++++++++++++
    we are the proud, the few, Descendents.

    Panama - finally putting a nail in the economic theory of the trickle down effect.
  • tailwindhometailwindhome Posts: 15,520
    symo wrote:
    I just have a different opinion to you.

    Of course you do. You're entitled to it. I'm just entering into a discussion on it. You don't want to. That's ok.
    Believe that a farther shore
    Is reachable from here.
    Believe in miracles
    And cures and healing wells
  • mididoctorsmididoctors Posts: 8,612
    RichN95 wrote:
    I made up my own points system (broadly based on the World Tour* system and counting wins only) and the computer said:

    1. Kelly 3506
    2. Roche 1062
    3. LeMond 1016
    4. Cavendish 998
    5. Evans 786
    6. McEwen 752
    7. Wiggins 706
    8. Hampsten 588
    9. Simpson 532
    10. Anderson 436
    11. R Millar 422
    12. Armstrong 300
    13. Hoban 272
    14. Farrar 260
    15. O'Grady 220
    16. Hesjedal 186
    17. D Millar 176

    This is not my opinion - it's Microsoft Excel's - so blame Bill Gates

    (Note: 'Bad Armstrong' would have scored 2400, 'Bad David Millar' 226. 'Bad Hincapie' & 'Bad Leipheimer' didn't score that highly)

    *Worlds & Olympics (RR & TT) and GT jerseys scored points

    if you strike lance then you have to strike most of that list

    so basically its Cav OTOH seeing as bad LA doesn't beat kelly(bad or otherwise) I see the wisdom of this method :lol:
    "If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm
  • mididoctorsmididoctors Posts: 8,612

    How did Boardman score? Any points for going round in circles?

    his cache is going to rise in hindsight
    "If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm
  • bipedalbipedal Posts: 466
    LeMond.
  • Dave_1Dave_1 Posts: 9,512
    Easily Lemond. In the doped category-Armstrong. Even with
    13 years tipexed over his palmares runs Hampsten close
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