"Hardcore" hardtails

keppy

Why not consider something like a Cube Reaction GTC SLT 29er? It weighs a mere 22 lbs and has XT throughout...

supersonic

keppy wrote:

Why not consider something like a Cube Reaction GTC SLT 29er? It weighs a mere 22 lbs and has XT throughout...

Not really what he is after though, ie a tough, long travel, relaxed angle hardtail.

milko9000

Right, the BFe frame I was umming and ahing over has been sold so that helps. Ben, how best to discuss this spec you worked up for me there?

funkywigster

milko9000 wrote:

Right, the BFe frame I was umming and ahing over has been sold so that helps. Ben, how best to discuss this spec you worked up for me there?

think i just brought that Bfe (med/green) been riding a ragley mmmbop for the last couple of years
it's been a great bike single ring setup with talas 150 forks bit of a harsh ride but worth considering..
light,strong and quite cheap. hope the Bfe rides aswell as the ragley has

,got mmmbop frame for sale too

milko9000

Found someone selling a Slackline with not very much use at all. Hng. Change my mind between this and the C456 about twice a day now.

Thinking rather than buying a load of new bits I'll try and donate things like drivetrain from my Yeti and then upgrade on that come the January sales or thereabouts. So would potentially just need forks and a seatpost, I think. And a headset.

milko9000

Sorry to go on and on (and on) in this thread. I can get a 150mm 2012 Rockshox Rev RLT for about £300 with an olde worlde straight steerer. The tapered equivalent is about £500 at least. Now, the Slackline only takes a straight steerer. The C456 would need a reducer headset of some kind. Should this influence me strongly, d'you think? Either to buy the more expensive fork or just change everything all over again.

paulneenan76

For the saving, the non tapered steerer is fine. Smoothie mixer headset by On One takes straight or tapered. If you look at eBay, someone has just listed a mint C456 frame with a keen BIN price and also some Revs which also look good. Saving is huge!

milko9000

interesting... but can't see that on eBay anywhere right now? Perhaps someone snapped it up.

paulneenan76

milko9000 wrote:

interesting... but can't see that on eBay anywhere right now? Perhaps someone snapped it up.

Yep but not surprised it went fast. Forks from the same stiller seem to be still up


Look at this on eBay:

Rockshox Revelation RL Dual Air forks, remote lock out, 1 1/8 steerer

http://bit.ly/Sj0YTE

benpinnick

Thats optimistic pricing right there.

paulneenan76

benpinnick wrote:

Thats optimistic pricing right there.

That's as maybe, but I'm sure the seller knows it and is expecting an offer or two. Or the OP could check the classifieds on here.

milko9000

Hmm, for £300 new I'd be tempted to stick with that and get the warranty etc.

Found a Slackline for sale in complete bike form, but its the wrong colour and uses xfusion velvet forks... Tempting still but I don't know much about them. Actually no it's more pricey than I remember. Still might buy that frame though! Must Decide Finally Argh.

paulneenan76

milko9000 wrote:

Hmm, for £300 new I'd be tempted to stick with that and get the warranty etc.

The pricing quote from me refers to the forks, not the frame, which is £399/499 currently.

milko9000

Oh, I'm getting confused, thought you were talking about the ebay forks on for £250.

Yes, can get a C456 new for £399. The Slackline I've seen "almost new" at £350.

Prescient

cyd190468 wrote:

Really don't get the hard core hard tail thing. How much can you get a trance 29er for? One bike to rule them all!

Your suggestion is a dead giveaway that "you don't get the hardcore hardtail thing"

To successfully ride a technical section at speed on a 140/150mm travel hardtail, is a lot more rewarding than a FSer, especially where the average person would need a FSer to achieve it. Some people seem to get them, like me for example.

I often wonder about the demographic of hardcore hardtails though; and whether people who grew up in the era when front suspension was a luxury, never mind having more than 63mm travel, are the ones propping up the market. People who learned to ride the hard stuff without any suspension because it wasn’t available or cost crazy money.

People who were influenced by this video and the rider on the cover…



Plus they just look sweet……

paulneenan76

Prescient wrote:

cyd190468 wrote:

Really don't get the hard core hard tail thing. How much can you get a trance 29er for? One bike to rule them all!

Your suggestion is a dead giveaway that "you don't get the hardcore hardtail thing"

To successfully ride a technical section at speed on a 140/150mm travel hardtail, is a lot more rewarding than a FSer, especially where the average person would need a FSer to achieve it. Some people seem to get them, like me for example.

I often wonder about the demographic of hardcore hardtails though; and whether people who grew up in the era when front suspension was a luxury, never mind having more than 63mm travel, are the ones propping up the market. People who learned to ride the hard stuff without any suspension because it wasn’t available or cost crazy money.

People who were influenced by this video and the rider on the cover…



Plus they just look sweet……

I'm one of the people you describe - must be an old fart

And they do look sweet, not always pretty, granted, but frickin' sweet all the same!

Prescient

paulneenan76 wrote:

I'm one of the people you describe - must be an old fart

And they do look sweet, not always pretty, granted, but frickin' sweet all the same!

Yer frickin' sweet


#dangerousground
My assumption was 29ers are for those riders whose wheels never leave the ground……

See quite a few round here now but never one popping a wheelie

styxd

Prescient wrote:

cyd190468 wrote:

Really don't get the hard core hard tail thing. How much can you get a trance 29er for? One bike to rule them all!

Your suggestion is a dead giveaway that "you don't get the hardcore hardtail thing"

To successfully ride a technical section at speed on a 140/150mm travel hardtail, is a lot more rewarding than a FSer, especially where the average person would need a FSer to achieve it. Some people seem to get them, like me for example.

I often wonder about the demographic of hardcore hardtails though; and whether people who grew up in the era when front suspension was a luxury, never mind having more than 63mm travel, are the ones propping up the market. People who learned to ride the hard stuff without any suspension because it wasn’t available or cost crazy money.

People who were influenced by this video and the rider on the cover…



Plus they just look sweet……

A proper hardcore hardtail right there. With short travel forks (circa 80mm?)

The "hardcore hardtails" these days completely miss the point of riding a hardtail. Bouncing your way down hills with 150mm travel forks, just get a full sus instead!

Northwind

Been through a few of these lately...

Soul- stunning bike, but I sold it for being a bit allroundery. Proper masterpiece.
BFe- seemed to lack what made the Soul so special, without really gaining a lot.
Mmmbop- superb geometry, too stiff- made it a handful in anything rocky and I got fed up of having to be always so on top of it. Fine when I was enjoying it but it made bad days worse.
C456- a bit meh. Capable, competent, but never once was it inspirational. Something not right about the handling, somehow feels longer than it is and kind of clumsy, but also not a great climber. Slacked it off eventually which made it better but still, close but no cigar. Finish was terrible.
Ragley Ti. What I wanted in the first place, and should have bought a year ago. All the best parts of the Bop with all the inspirational lively up-for-it feeling of the Soul. Not easy to find though, but I paid less than the cost of a new Chameleon for mine. So far, not even the slightest regret.

paulneenan76

I think Northwind's post is proof enough that hardtails, long travel or not, are most certainly alive and kicking, and make a lot of sense to a lot of people. Want a bit more travel, want a cooler brand for a bargain, want steel or carbon or titanium etc etc etc - there's a place for all. I grew up with hardtails and the conditions I ride in mostly are suited to hardtails, I can get a better bike for the money, and I don't want more than one bike, I wouldn't get authorisation for a summer luxury ride anyway, and I don't want the wear and tear of a big full Suss rig - sand and grit and pivots - I wanna fit and forget for the most part.

Plus full Suss is cheating right? ;D

junglist_matty

cyd190468 wrote:

Really don't get the hard core hard tail thing. How much can you get a trance 29er for? One bike to rule them all!

Watch this and maybe you will understand....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wv7TyakE8qw

Prescient

To be fair, I don't need a hardcore hardtail anymore. I just prefer them.

After building up a Jack Flash with Bomber Z1s in 2000, I have never been able to get comfy on an XC bike since (currently polish a 2010 Marin Rocky Ridge)

The sad thing is, the most off road my bike has seen in the last 9 months has been the grass verge between the pavement and the road.

There is definitely something satisfying about being able to pump/frantically squish 140-150mm travel forks just for the fun of it when riding along. 80-100mm forks really don’t deliver the same satisfaction.

#Edited since I don't ride much at the moment but I do go in the garage and clean and upgrade parts on my Marin a couple of times per week

paulneenan76

junglist_matty wrote:

cyd190468 wrote:

Really don't get the hard core hard tail thing. How much can you get a trance 29er for? One bike to rule them all!

Watch this and maybe you will understand....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wv7TyakE8qw

Ha ha, if he didn't get it before, he should now after watching that.

Northwind

junglist_matty wrote:

Watch this and maybe you will understand....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wv7TyakE8qw

If that's what hardcore hardtails are for, I should sell mine.

warpcow

Thought-provoking piece, perhaps with quite an emphasis on the provocation bit, on PB today:

http://www.pinkbike.com/news/The-Argument-For-Short-Travel-Bikes-Opinion-2012.html

It's not that far off a lot of stuff that gets spouted around these parts though. For the most part I sort of agree in principle. I can say with almost 100% certainty that riding a HT has made me faster on an FS, and not just in terms of fitness, but also that the HT is just more fun/challenging for me a lot of the time.

Another nice Jinya vid in the link too.