More Tube Strikes

bails87

Tube driving is very difficult. I mean, they only get a rubbish light, how are they meant to keep the train balanced on the rails in the dark? It takes years of training.


In all seriousness, if it's so easy and so well paid, why don't more people do it?

spen666

clarkey cat wrote:

surely a trained chimp could drive one?

I reckon some people reckon a trained chimp could do your job too. I know some people (clients mainly) reckon a trained chimp could do my job!

A trained chimp would be more productive than most of us

bails87

spen666 wrote:

clarkey cat wrote:

surely a trained chimp could drive one?

I reckon some people reckon a trained chimp could do your job too. I know some people (clients mainly) reckon a trained chimp could do my job!

A trained chimp would be more productive than most of us

Only because they don't know about forums yet!

clarkey cat

they can't get any signal down there. they are probably the most productive and efficient workforce in the UK.

spen666

"LU keeps on about how it is carrying more and more passengers. That is good news for London but also means a lot more work for our members."

What more work is there for a driver if there are 1 or 100 people in each carriage?

tgotb

bails87 wrote:

In all seriousness, if it's so easy and so well paid, why don't more people do it?

Because it's a closed shop. Notoriously difficult to get a job as a tube driver unless you know the right people...

bails87

TGOTB wrote:

bails87 wrote:

In all seriousness, if it's so easy and so well paid, why don't more people do it?

Because it's a closed shop. Notoriously difficult to get a job as a tube driver unless you know the right people...

Biblically?

I wouldn't want to 'know' Bob Crow.....I'm out!

bigmat

DonDaddyD wrote:

Why are they threatening to strike then Mat?

I don't know. I don't really care to be honest, I'll be on my bike as usual (or, on this occasion, many miles away from London). It was more a general point that people have a tendency to have a go at other people on strike without actually considering what caused the strike in the first place (there's a similar tendency to draw sweeping conclusions about what a great deal the strikers have and how they should consider themselevs lucky).

jzed

Edit: wrong thread

cjcp

clarkey cat wrote:

Would you be a tube driver for £45k and 43 days holiday a year?

I wouldn't.

Look, whatever you've done with clarkey cat, let him go.

(Nope. But they made their bed etc.)

rjsterry

DonDaddyD wrote:

notsoblue wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

It pisses me off as it makes people less sympathetic to proper strikes/protests like tuition fees and public sector pensions.

Yep. Hard to sympathise with tube drivers too. They're like subterranean cabbies.

Regardless of where you fall on the side of the aforementioned examples I'd say those were far greater reasons to strike/protest than the greed displayed by tube drivers who are already generously paid. Time was £42-45K would put you in the 40% middle class tax bracket.

They strike more than any other industry and people have not only become exasperated with them but with stirkes and protests in general thus making the impact of more valid strikes/protest less meaningful. Great work there from their Unions.

Fairly sure it still does <runs off to check> Yup personal allowance of £7,475 + upper limit of standard rate band of £35,000 = £42,475 ≤ £45K.

TheStone

I think everyone has the right to strike, but with the tube drivers it always seems a bit more sinister.

They're in a very powerful position because so many other people rely on them to get to their own workplace. This is not because they're brilliant at train driving, but because they have control over the trains. I'm fairly sure 90%+ of the population could do it, but as mentioned before it's a closed shop.

Each time they strike it's about money. There's ofter some 'safety issue', but always ends in higher wages. They're so far removed from any normal labour market and yet still have the control over the trains to demand more. Can it ever end? Will they stop at double the average wage and double the normal holidays? We're there already. Someone who drives a train down a tunnel with one lever and hundreds of automatic fail safes if they don't correctly use the lever gets paid twice the average person??

bigmat

...

daviesee

Glasgow subway is about to undergo upgrades.
Part of the plan is driverless trains.

It's only a matter of time.

Stevo_666

Problem with the tube stike in particular is that it affects a lot of people who have nothing to do with the dispute. Not sure how much sympathy people are meant to have with tube strikers if their working day is screwed up - several times a year.

Roll on driverless trains.

First.Aspect

The Tube map was designed to make everywhere look a train ride away from anywhere else. You Londoners should take a look at an actual map sometime and figure out how far you can reasonably walk in the half hour it takes to get the tube from anywhere to anywhere else and put these leeches out of work.

I heard that they are striking over a settlement negotiated 15 years ago; work 25% of the bank holidays in return for a 40% rise in annual pay, and they are now asking for triple time for boxing day, plus a day in leiu, because there are more serices now on boxing day, despite the fact than any one individual isn't actually treated any differently. Its enough to turn me right wing, it really is. This isn't what the union movement was for.

notsoblue

First Aspect wrote:

This isn't what the union movement was for.

+1

cjcp

First Aspect wrote:

The Tube map was designed to make everywhere look a train ride away from anywhere else. You Londoners should take a look at an actual map sometime and figure out how far you can reasonably walk in the half hour it takes to get the tube from anywhere to anywhere else and put these leeches out of work.

The beauty of the Boris Bike.

Here, in the office, preparing for a board meeting tomorrow, and I'll have to sleep in the office.

So, should I give the remotest of sh*ts that they should have a day off in lieu because they can't have their bubble 'n' squeak on Boxing Day?

I'm actually fine being here. I made my bed and I'm lying in it. I suggest that those who chose a life on the LU do the same, shut their pie-holes and get on with their jobs.

sketchley

kelsen wrote:

JZed wrote:

Roll on automatic tube trains.

No doubt the announcement of these would cause another strike as their jobs are threatened.

I doubt it we already have them DLR, Victoria Line, Central Line & Jubilee Line line are all automatic.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automatic_train_operation

jonginge

Pretty sure only the DLR is actually driverless, though. Prime candidate for driverless would be the Waterloo and City line...

sketchley

None of the DLR, Victoria Line, Central Line & Jubilee Lines have "Drivers". They have "Train Operators", most of the time all this involves is opening and closing the doors. Although RMT will tell you that they also have their hand over the break in case of emergency and are checking the track in front in case of obstructions. Apparently they still drive the trains on the central line on manual at the weekend so they don't forget how to do it.

BTW Victoria line trains have had this system since 1968!!!!!

rick_chasey

Sketchley wrote:

None of the DLR, Victoria Line, Central Line & Jubilee Lines have "Drivers". They have "Train Operators", most of the time all this involves is opening and closing the doors. Although RMT will tell you that they also have their hand over the break in case of emergency and are checking the track in front in case of obstructions. Apparently they still drive the trains on the central line on manual at the weekend so they don't forget how to do it.

BTW Victoria line trains have had this system since 1968!!!!!

In fairness to their job, they're not paid for what they do, but for what they know.

It's comparable to commercial pilots. In theory, the planes can pretty much take off, fly, and land themselves. It's when things don't go quite right, or the auto-stuff can't cope that the pilot is used. I read somewhere there was a 1-117 chance your plane will be flown by a drunk pilot, so they can't do that much.

When there are delays, when they need to shunt stuff about, when someone pulls the cord, faints on the train, has a heart attack etc - that's what the drivers are paid for.

You can argue about their pay, but since a) you all commute by bike, and b) it's happening on boxing day, why care?

It's not like you're paying for them.

clarkey cat

chord

fail.

rick_chasey

sad face.

rjsterry

Sketchley wrote:

None of the DLR, Victoria Line, Central Line & Jubilee Lines have "Drivers". They have "Train Operators", most of the time all this involves is opening and closing the doors. Although RMT will tell you that they also have their hand over the break in case of emergency and are checking the track in front in case of obstructions. Apparently they still drive the trains on the central line on manual at the weekend so they don't forget how to do it.

BTW Victoria line trains have had this system since 1968!!!!!

Given the stopping distance of a train, by the time the 'driver' sees something, it is already too late.

il_principe

cjcp wrote:

Here, in the office, preparing for a board meeting tomorrow, and I'll have to sleep in the office.

Dude, srsly!

rjsterry

Il Principe wrote:

cjcp wrote:

Here, in the office, preparing for a board meeting tomorrow, and I'll have to sleep in the office.

Dude, srsly!

+1, although that does explain the posts about riding home at 1am. Bugger that for a game of soldiers.

DonDaddyD

cjcp wrote:

Here, in the office, preparing for a board meeting tomorrow, and I'll have to sleep in the office.

So, should I give the remotest of sh*ts that they should have a day off in lieu because they can't have their bubble 'n' squeak on Boxing Day?

I'm actually fine being here. I made my bed and I'm lying in it. I suggest that those who chose a life on the LU do the same, shut their pie-holes and get on with their jobs.

:shock:

In fairness to their job, they're not paid for what they do, but for what they know.

It's comparable to commercial pilots. In theory, the planes can pretty much take off, fly, and land themselves. It's when things don't go quite right, or the auto-stuff can't cope that the pilot is used. I read somewhere there was a 1-117 chance your plane will be flown by a drunk pilot, so they can't do that much.

When there are delays, when they need to shunt stuff about, when someone pulls the cord, faints on the train, has a heart attack etc - that's what the drivers are paid for.

You can argue about their pay, but since a) you all commute by bike, and b) it's happening on boxing day, why care?

It's not like you're paying for them.

:shock: :shock: :shock:

It's going up to £52,000 by 2015.

Look. They are gerously paid. They are generously rewarded with excepional holiday. I get 27 days and I think that is good to get near double is astounding.

You have to take those factors into consideration when you looking at the demands they're making which are (i) monetary and (ii) more time off.

Furthermore it's a request, I don't just mosey up to my manager ask for more moeny and time off and threaten to go on strike if I don't get it. That's not reasonable negotiating. You should only strike in the face of injustice or mistreatment not use it as a tool to negotiate additional perks of the job.

rick_chasey

I wasn't defending the strike - I was just suggesting that the argument that they 'don't do anything since it's all automated' is wide of the mark.

DonDaddyD

OK, I agree with that.

I don't know what the drivers/operators do. It's not for me to determine whether anyone else's job is worth the money they are paid. So I'll leave that alone. But comparable to the rest of society LU drivers/operators run the risk of becoming the new bankers.