Are we confusing new riders with all these MTB 'types'?

Thewaylander

But on the negative Kaise, there also fairly likely the reason for all the trails been smoothed over and reduced in difficulty all over Wales, so clueless people don't hurt themselves and others

Kaise

Thewaylander wrote:

But on the negative Kaise, there also fairly likely the reason for all the trails been smoothed over and reduced in difficulty all over Wales, so clueless people don't hurt themselves and others

fair point, i hadnt thought about it like that!

.blitz

Thewaylander wrote:

I think on this we ahve to take into account the human race...

Most people are either a bit thick or a bit lazy and it amounts to the same thing in the end, lazy to not do an hours research ont here own for there safety/finacial benefit (this i believe is the majority) or to stupid IE they just don't understand what there reading.

Both types are dangerous to others in my veiw.

Sad but true

chemicalviking

im new to mtb about 5 months, i bought a cheap bike and started riding now as im gaining more skills and pushing myself more and more, its becoming clearer on what type of riding im doing. so my next bike will reflect this. i feel too many people watch you tube and go ' that looks easy i will try that' then spend a fortune on bikes and all the kit only for it to end up on ebay 12 mths later.
i may not ride like danny hart just yet but im a lot closer than i was 5 mths ago.

there is a lot of bikes on the market but coming from a beginner point of view just research a lot then do some more.

bails87

Thewaylander wrote:

But on the negative Kaise, there also fairly likely the reason for all the trails been smoothed over and reduced in difficulty all over Wales, so clueless people don't hurt themselves and others

We must all be 'nails' in the Midlands then, if the progression at Cannock Chase is anything to go by

Where are my stabilisers?

The industry doesn't help much - My bike gets described as XC, trail and AM... Not very helpful to a noob!

It's light like an XC bike, but it takes a fork between 140 and 160mm... not so "XC".
Then you have the AM option, switch the brakes and the wheels and ta-da! We have an AM trail bike!

It's perfect for my kind of riding and it's even seen a couple of DH trails (don't tell Santa Cruz, they might get cross ), but what is it really? There must be an easier way to market a bike than as 3 different things - even the manufacturers don't know what box to put their bikes in :shock:

Kaise

Where are my stabilisers? wrote:

even the manufacturers don't know what box to put their bikes in :shock:

Chain Reaction Cycles have though - the biggest box they can find!

miss notax

Where are my stabilisers? wrote:

The industry doesn't help much - My bike gets described as XC, trail and AM... Not very helpful to a noob!

It's light like an XC bike, but it takes a fork between 140 and 160mm... not so "XC".
Then you have the AM option, switch the brakes and the wheels and ta-da! We have an AM trail bike!

It's perfect for my kind of riding and it's even seen a couple of DH trails (don't tell Santa Cruz, they might get cross ), but what is it really? There must be an easier way to market a bike than as 3 different things - even the manufacturers don't know what box to put their bikes in :shock:

Exactly!! I think it's great that there's so much variety, but I just can't help thinking it's all got a bit too complicated :shock:

delcol

There must be an easier way to market a bike than as 3 different things - even the manufacturers don't know what box to put their bikes in

there is a mountain bike..

i ride my bike on the road does this make it a road bike ?
i ride it across countryside is it a xc bike ?
i ride it off drops and jumps and teccy trails is it a free ride bike ?
i ride it down hill is it a downhill bike ?
i ride it at trail centres so is it a trail bike?
it weighs around 30-31lbs..

no it's a mountain bike made to ride, and thats what i do. ( when it's not raining and windy as i am a pussy)

Ghostt

Although it's sad to see newbies blowing wads of cash on the 'wrong' kit, I guess we should all be grateful for the ebay bargains!

Seriously though, is there actually such a thing as the 'wrong' type of bike? I've got a 28lb 100mm hardtail, which is most definitely an XC bike, yet it copes with pretty much anything I can throw at it (bar the most gnarly descents when I put my brown trousers on...)

I reckon it's about being sensible with what you've got. I'm going to Cwmcarn next week but obviously will steer clear of the DH sections (unless it's quiet, then I might go scare myself!) Sure I can see that a newbie spending £5k on a proper DH rig might seem a waste, but if he rides Downhill on it he's got the right tool for the job.

Chunkers1980

Not really...

It's about what 'hits' they can take.

Road bikes - bend if you hit a 3 inch curb

XC bikes don't but may if any more.

AM bikes will take 6 inches of curb ok

DH will just ride over a 6 inch curb type thing.

Fit everything else in between.

bluechair84

If you use a bike regularly, and you get enjoyment out of it, then it's not the wrong bike. You might not be getting the most out of the bike, but to be fair few people do. When you have resources and friends in the sport though, it seems ridiculous to get a bike that means you don't have to learn basic skills. DH bikes flatter your skill, XC bikes are flattering for your fitness, get a proper mountain bike, be a proper mountain biker and learn to ride proper!

I'm a biking fascist and proud of it.

wordnumb

delcol wrote:

i ride my bike on the road does this make it a road bike ?
i ride it across countryside is it a xc bike ?
i ride it off drops and jumps and teccy trails is it a free ride bike ?
i ride it down hill is it a downhill bike ?
i ride it at trail centres so is it a trail bike?
it weighs around 30-31lbs..

If you ride it into a big puddle it is not a boat.
But wouldn't that be cool if it could?

bails87

The thing is, if you go to a shop with £500, you're going to get a 'mountain bike'. It won't be spectacularly light, it'll have 100-120mm of suspension, it will cope with trail centres, XCing, road riding, towpath riding.

If you spend ten times that then of course there's scope for specialisation. If there wasn't then DH racers would be riding 120mm full sussers, along with XC racers, and freeriders, and people going to Morzine for their summer holiday.

I'm sure with golf or fishing or wind surfing or skiing or any other type of expensive hooby you can buy entry level kit that will do most things well, or you can buy high end stuff that's more focussed.

If someone is stupid enough to buy a £5k bike and ride it down a DH trail having not been on a bike for 20 years, then they'd probably be doing something just as stupid if they'd bought a Hardrock or a Carrera Fury.

wordnumb

Nah, the issue is people who believe that their £5k has bought them a bike which will fast-track them to being able to ride hard stuff. "I'm going straight to the black run because I got myself the most top-of-the-range bike with specially designed knobbles on its tyres."

Mojo_666

Someone who can afford to spend 5K on a bike is probably not quite as stupid as some of you would like to think they are.

delcol

[quote="delcol"(it's not raining and windy as i am a pussy)[/quote]

wordnumb wrote:

delcol wrote:

i ride my bike on the road does this make it a road bike ?
i ride it across countryside is it a xc bike ?
i ride it off drops and jumps and teccy trails is it a free ride bike ?
i ride it down hill is it a downhill bike ?
i ride it at trail centres so is it a trail bike?
it weighs around 30-31lbs..

If you ride it into a big puddle it is not a boat.
But wouldn't that be cool if it could?

no because that would mean my bike would get wet and worse possibly dirty.. and i would'nt want that would i it cost alot of money....
if i did happen to come across a puddle while out riding i would go around it or simply get off my bike and carry it around the puddle. to avoid getting my bike wet..

wordnumb

Not to mention the risk of barnacles, a wise man that Delcol.

bails87

Mojo_666 wrote:

Someone who can afford to spend 5K on a bike is probably not quite as stupid as some of you would like to think they are.

Perhaps 'lacking common sense' would be a better term.


For describing the thickos.

And let's not forget Mario Ballotelli, a man who could buy a new Bentley every week, but is so dim he almost burnt his own house down by setting off fireworks in the bathroom.

delcol

wordnumb wrote:

Not to mention the risk of barnacles, a wise man that Delcol.

i try to keep my barnacles in my shorts when out riding i would'nt want to tyre burn them now would i... :roll:

Anonymous

To be fair, Cwmcarn DH is designed for a wide range of skills and is perfectly rideable on an XC bike, hard tails, and whatever you like really. It's a trail that is what you make of it. The kit you have all depends how fast and hard you ride it.

Aside from that, many start out on the wrong kind of bike and doesn't just apply to £5k bikes. Just look at all the people out on budget BSOs. If it gets them hooked and they start to work out what they really need, then great.

Still, wealthy types on bikes give us a laugh: http://youtu.be/feQyJeJgIw8

bails87

deadkenny wrote:

To be fair, Cwmcarn DH is designed for a wide range of skills and is perfectly rideable on an XC bike, hard tails, and whatever you like really

Hmm interesting, the XC trails are surprisingly easy, I could liven a CC trip up by doing the DH.......

Thewaylander

bails87 wrote:

deadkenny wrote:

To be fair, Cwmcarn DH is designed for a wide range of skills and is perfectly rideable on an XC bike, hard tails, and whatever you like really

Hmm interesting, the XC trails are surprisingly easy, I could liven a CC trip up by doing the DH.......

Tougher than the fake smooth at Cannock though fella, FTD and Monkey trail are super smooth and flat

But CC DH is super hard, or nicely rollable depending on the sections choices you make which is cool, and is easilly accessable from the XC trail making you only miss the last 3 sections

Pudseyp

I had the same debate with regards to the black runs at the likes of llandegla and the fact that riders without the required skillset will "have a go"..whilst they slow other riders down, don't have an appropriate bike or gear in my eyes they are a right royal pain in the ass...there are signs up at the start of the runs, and there is plenty of info on the deggy website and trail maps..but as someone pointed out, if you pay your parking (or uplift fee in this case) then at the end of the day you are free to ride...

In principle this is fine, but to me I like to consider others enjoyment...

anyway i might buy a old LDV Sherpa van and take it on the next Oulton Park track day...after all its a similar thing..

bluechair84

Phoar, LDV Sherpa... I'm after an LDV Cub for a small light camper conversion so I can go hold all the highly skilled riders up on the Stanes or Fort Billl.

Stu Coops

Pudseyp wrote:

I had the same debate with regards to the black runs at the likes of llandegla and the fact that riders without the required skillset will "have a go"..whilst they slow other riders down, don't have an appropriate bike or gear in my eyes they are a right royal pain in the ass...there are signs up at the start of the runs, and there is plenty of info on the deggy website and trail maps..but as someone pointed out, if you pay your parking (or uplift fee in this case) then at the end of the day you are free to ride...

In principle this is fine, but to me I like to consider others enjoyment...

anyway i might buy a old LDV Sherpa van and take it on the next Oulton Park track day...after all its a similar thing..

Some of these people may be on the verge of having enough skill to confidentlly DH but the only way they get to the next level is by riding the DH sections and as for slowing other riders down I doubt they want to do that and I'm sure you slowed others up yourself when you wern't so talented so a little consideration should be given really.

bluechair84

It's a necessary evil, like learner drivers on the road. There was a funny video doing the rounds last year where a rider slammed into the back of a female beginner who'd just stopped in the middle of the trail - she was really freaked out by the incident which was caught on headcam. Beginners are a danger when out of their depth, but they deserve to be there too if they can follow simple courtesy guidelines.

Pudseyp

bluechair84 wrote:

It's a necessary evil, like learner drivers on the road. There was a funny video doing the rounds last year where a rider slammed into the back of a female beginner who'd just stopped in the middle of the trail - she was really freaked out by the incident which was caught on headcam. Beginners are a danger when out of their depth, but they deserve to be there too if they can follow simple courtesy guidelines.

And that my friend was what I was trying to say in my rant....common sense and common courtesy...it really is that simple....

Anyway...back to LDV.....

Anonymous

Common sense and courtesy applies to faster riders too. Such as not heading off on the heals of the obviously less experienced guy in front then yelling and swearing because he's spoiled your fast blast down Babymaker at Swinley by being in front. One example I witnessed (not that the guy in front was that slow or standing in the trail etc).

Just allow room for each other and pay attention to who's ahead or behind. If you're slow let the fast guys go ahead if they want or give them warning to wait a while. If you hear them thundering down, pull over if you can. Likewise if you're fast allow for the possible slow guys, and don't get wound up because you haven't got the trail to yourself all the time and if the guy in front has no where to pull over, tough, just wait.

bails87

Thewaylander wrote:

bails87 wrote:

deadkenny wrote:

To be fair, Cwmcarn DH is designed for a wide range of skills and is perfectly rideable on an XC bike, hard tails, and whatever you like really

Hmm interesting, the XC trails are surprisingly easy, I could liven a CC trip up by doing the DH.......

Tougher than the fake smooth at Cannock though fella, FTD and Monkey trail are super smooth and flat

You moan all the time (justifiably!) that Cwn Carn is boring! As you said, the 'freeride' area is more like a red XC.

The black stuff at cannock is the trickiest stuff I've seen anywhere I've ridden, and there are a lot of places I haven't ridden, but I'm not 'untravelled'. A smooth trail covered in technical features, berms, jumps and drops is more interesting to me than a featureless trail that happens to be a bit bumpy, not that FTD/Monkey is even that smooth.

Have you done the new black options? http://youtu.be/wZP3rG1N7Fc?hd=1