Vuelta Stage 17**Spoiler**

dave_1

What do you think will happen today? I am hoping Cobo has an off day...but Froome could be pretty devastating in attack mode. Can't see wigoo endangering 3rd place..surely Froome is the one to do it?

Nasty climb at end...leaders jersey changed hands on this cimb in 1979 to Joop Zoetemelk
http://www.cyclingnews.com/vuelta-a-espana/stage-17

LeicesterLad

I don't see that Froome and Wiggo have any choice but to attack if they want red, Cobo doesn't really need to do anything but keep up now, the ball is in Sky's court!

thamacdaddy

Wiggins just posted on twitter

@bradwiggins
How do you play it? Conserve 3rd or throw everything at winning at the risk of loosing all? stupid or brave? What would you do?
Mobile Web • 07/09/2011 08:16

https://twitter.com/bradwiggins/status/ ... 4472398848

So what would we say?

rick_chasey

What fans will always say.

Risk it all.

Sky have got a podium with Froome anyway, so surely they can gamble and have Wiggins go for it.

inkyfingers

I think they can afford to at least have a go. Mollema is 50 seconds behind Wiggins on GC so even if he attacks and fails he's unlikely to lose his podium spot on what is a steep but relatively short climb.

I'd go for the 1-2 punch with Wiggins attacking and then if he gets caught Froome launches. Then again as Rick said, i'm a fan, not a rider thinking about the value of already having a podium spot in the Vuelta.

nic_77

inkyfingers wrote:

I'd go for the 1-2 punch with Wiggins attacking and then if he gets caught Froome launches.

+1

inkyfingers wrote:

Then again as Rick said, i'm a fan, not a rider thinking about the value of already having a podium spot in the Vuelta.

But with cycling becoming dangerously conservative already, I'd value a brave and attacking rider more highly than one with a third in the Vuelta on his palmares.

andyp

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DegGwZnySmk

That's what he should do!

Pross

I'd have Wiggo driving hard like Sky have done on the previous climbs then get Froome to jump when everyone is being stretched but that assumes Froome is capable. The biggest problem is that Cobo was one of the few who was able to hold the Sky duo's pace consistently on previous climbs. Sky probably need Lofkvist, Zandio and Possoni to drive hard at the start of the final climb as well. The biggest issue is that Geox have the strength to cover moves and be aggressive themselves.

rick_chasey

Pross wrote:

I'd have Wiggo driving hard like Sky have done on the previous climbs then get Froome to jump when everyone is being stretched but that assumes Froome is capable. The biggest problem is that Cobo was one of the few who was able to hold the Sky duo's pace consistently on previous climbs. Sky probably need Lofkvist, Zandio and Possoni to drive hard at the start of the final climb as well. The biggest issue is that Geox have the strength to cover moves and be aggressive themselves.

Why not an eyball popping attack from Wiggins - give it everything he can.

A kinda madison-want-to-try-and-lap-the-field effort he did on the track.

Froome can sit in the wheels.

Etc

Like the Schlecks in the Pyrenees this year, only actually putting your balls on the line and going for it.

sonny73

inkyfingers wrote:

I'd go for the 1-2 punch with Wiggins attacking and then if he gets caught Froome launches. Then again as Rick said, i'm a fan, not a rider thinking about the value of already having a podium spot in the Vuelta.

Another +1, I think they have to go for it and will.

thamacdaddy

I do think wiggins has the personality to say "gonna go for it" but a podium in a GT is not to be sniffed at. Of course all fans want to see him put it on the line and would probably respect it more, as annoying as pro riders like dan lloyd might find it (Armchair fans) https://twitter.com/daniellloyd1/status ... 4367433728.

Although looking at Froome's latest status here's hoping sky have a plan up their sleeves
https://twitter.com/chrisfroome/status/ ... 2253898752

chrisfroome: I wouldn't want to be trying to defend the red jersey on a finish like today's

Pross

Rick Chasey wrote:

Pross wrote:

I'd have Wiggo driving hard like Sky have done on the previous climbs then get Froome to jump when everyone is being stretched but that assumes Froome is capable. The biggest problem is that Cobo was one of the few who was able to hold the Sky duo's pace consistently on previous climbs. Sky probably need Lofkvist, Zandio and Possoni to drive hard at the start of the final climb as well. The biggest issue is that Geox have the strength to cover moves and be aggressive themselves.

Why not an eyball popping attack from Wiggins - give it everything he can.

A kinda madison-want-to-try-and-lap-the-field effort he did on the track.

Froome can sit in the wheels.

Etc

Like the Schlecks in the Pyrenees this year, only actually putting your balls on the line and going for it.

I think the problem with that is he is unlikely to make up the time required to win so the best he is likely to achieve is to leap frog Froome which is pretty pointless. That said, if he attacked hard enough and early enough then maybe it would give Froome the chance to pull the old 1-2. I've just never seen Wiggo really attack like that in any race. I hope he does though (although don't forget he is a crap climber )

rick_chasey

Pross wrote:

Rick Chasey wrote:

Pross wrote:

I'd have Wiggo driving hard like Sky have done on the previous climbs then get Froome to jump when everyone is being stretched but that assumes Froome is capable. The biggest problem is that Cobo was one of the few who was able to hold the Sky duo's pace consistently on previous climbs. Sky probably need Lofkvist, Zandio and Possoni to drive hard at the start of the final climb as well. The biggest issue is that Geox have the strength to cover moves and be aggressive themselves.

Why not an eyball popping attack from Wiggins - give it everything he can.

A kinda madison-want-to-try-and-lap-the-field effort he did on the track.

Froome can sit in the wheels.

Etc

Like the Schlecks in the Pyrenees this year, only actually putting your balls on the line and going for it.

I think the problem with that is he is unlikely to make up the time required to win so the best he is likely to achieve is to leap frog Froome which is pretty pointless. That said, if he attacked hard enough and early enough then maybe it would give Froome the chance to pull the old 1-2. I've just never seen Wiggo really attack like that in any race. I hope he does though (although don't forget he is a crap climber )

He's got enough rope that Cobo/Geox can afford let him go, surely?

It's all moot anyway since I imagine Sastre and Menchov can happily string it out and nullify everything.

avoidingmyphd

So Sky's plan for today seems to be to try psyching Cobo out on twitter. I'm not sure that will work.

mroli

A marginal gain perhaps?!

bigmat

My tactics (FWIW) would be to put Wiggins on the front, get him to force the pace, ramp it up to above threshold and then Froome at the same time could deliberately lose Wiggo's wheel, allowing a gap to develop. Hopefully if Wiggins is feeling strong and really going for it, he could build a big enough gap to make it hard to cover, the onus would then be on Cobo to jump across and Froome could just sit behind him, then either Wiggo gets some time back or Froome is in good position to attack Cobo at end of stage. Of course, it all depends on shedding Cobo's dom's early doors so the Sky boys will need to work hard, also in an ideal world there wouldn't be a breakaway up the road thereby allowing Froome to take a win bonus.

I reckon Wiggins might have half a chance in the Basque stages, he launched a pretty impressive late attack to take the British Champs jersey, he only needs a 30 second gap (with win bonus) after all, so Sky will have cards to play after today.

iainf72

If it was the day after the rest day, I would've put a shiny pound on Froome losing some time. But as it's not, I think it'll be active but not sure much will happen in the end.

3rd week of grand tour, this is where your legs start failing, so could be changes.

FJS

Of course they should give it a go - it's not often in your career you're within a minute of a grand tour win. But it's easy to get into defensive mode if their podiuam places themselves come under attack. Mollema will be eying that podium too, Nibali has said he still wants to make his mark somewhere, and Leopard have two riders in the top 10.

It'll be interesting what others do and who'll react. If Mollema attacks, do they chase to defend Wiggins' 3rd, or let Geox do the work? Or if, say, Nibali tries an all or nothing attack in that long descent from 40 km out today, who's going to chase? It's not just today, but the Basque Country stages the coming days too with opportunities to gain bits of time - but they need friends in the peloton

tailwindhome

Or Roche and Martin attack, dropping the enitre field in an epic journey through the mountains crossing the line together and waiting for the photo finish to determine the Red Jersey.

Of course they should give it a go - it's not often in your career you're within a minute of a grand tour win.

This

Wiggins may never have this opportunity again, he just isn't good enough for podium in either the Tour or GIro and may not ride the Vuelta again.

Turfle

I'd so as Pross said. Drill it up the final climb, with Wiggo giving it everything at the top. Hopefully leaving a small enough group for Froome to take the win and the bonus seconds. It's a tactic they've shown can work for them.

avoidingmyphd

There was another one earlier:

chris sutton on twitter wrote:

2day is 211km. Let's rip in and get this jersey back

Monty Zoncolan

I'm encouraged to see those Twitter messages. They might make no difference to the outcome but at least the sky riders are going into the stage in an attacking frame of mind.

greeny12

Whatever happens it should be bloody exciting - such a pity it's almost completely under the radar of the UK media...

inseine

I think that the heavy roads on Thursday, perhaps Friday, might be better suited to a SKY attack, but other teams will have to play too.

mrushton

I say go 5h1t or bust and blow the field apart. Either anyone with a chance works together to get their own riders up or stuff them. What will really pi55 me off is Wiggo/Froome losing out and Cobo getting busted in 3 weeks time.

verylonglegs

It seems not many have considered that other teams could wrest control of the stage from Sky before the final climb denying them a chance to work Cobo over?

Turfle

If another team want to push the tempo even higher than Sky are prepared to I guess they'd be more than happy for the help.

derbygrimpeur

mrushton wrote:

What will really pi55 me off is Wiggo/Froome losing out and Cobo getting busted in 3 weeks time.

+ 1

FJS

Right they've started.

Taaramae just abandoned after 51 km.

Very lively start, but seems there's a big group more firmly ahead now, 23 riders:
BARREDO LLAMAZALES Carlos (151), OLIVIERA Nelson Filipe (207), CARUSO Damiano (003), VIGANO Davide (106), LEQUATRE Geoffroy (205), CHAVANEL Sylvain (143), MONTAGUTI Matteo (018), MARANGONI Alan (005), DE GREEF Francis (122), CAZAUX Pierre (059), KISERLOVSKI Robert (135), FRÖHLINGER Johannes (173), ROSENDO PRADO Jesus (028), LOSADA ALGUACIL Alberto (084), VELITS Martin (079), LASTRAS GARCIA Pablo (115), SÖRENSEN Nicki (169), LE MEVEL Christophe (195), SANTAMBROGIO Mauro (035), MORI Manuele (093) y SARAMOTINS Aleksejs (045).

No Sky, no Geox, but 2 Liquigas. Perhaps Nibali for that attack in the descent?

rick_chasey

FJS wrote:

Right they've started.

Taaramae just abandoned after 51 km.

Very lively start, but seems there's a big group more firmly ahead now, 23 riders:
BARREDO LLAMAZALES Carlos (151), OLIVIERA Nelson Filipe (207), CARUSO Damiano (003), VIGANO Davide (106), LEQUATRE Geoffroy (205), CHAVANEL Sylvain (143), MONTAGUTI Matteo (018), MARANGONI Alan (005), DE GREEF Francis (122), CAZAUX Pierre (059), KISERLOVSKI Robert (135), FRÖHLINGER Johannes (173), ROSENDO PRADO Jesus (028), LOSADA ALGUACIL Alberto (084), VELITS Martin (079), LASTRAS GARCIA Pablo (115), SÖRENSEN Nicki (169), LE MEVEL Christophe (195), SANTAMBROGIO Mauro (035), MORI Manuele (093) y SARAMOTINS Aleksejs (045).

No Sky, no Geox, but 2 Liquigas. Perhaps Nibali for that attack in the descent?

It's a shame Geox or Sky aren't represented. Would have spiced it up a little.

Any reason why Taaramae abandoned? was he caught up in the pile up?

FJS

Rick Chasey wrote:

Any reason why Taaramae abandoned? was he caught up in the pile up?

No, no information given, and no big crash reported. Perhaps he's taking some rest to prepare for Estonia's bid for Worlds glory