what happened to sportsmanship ?

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Comments

  • pedro118118
    pedro118118 Posts: 1,102
    rockmount wrote:
    pedro118118 wrote:
    Andy Schleck did NOT have a mechanical.
    DID TOO !!
    Every time little bertie looks at the winner's trophy he'll hear the booooos of the crowd !

    A broken chain is a "mechanical".
    Or broken anything, which makes the bike unridable without impediment.
    Poor decision-making and dismal execution of a simple gear-shift is not a "mechanical". It's a mistake. Rider error. And like any other rider error, rivals are free to captalise. Indeed, in order to maintain the credibility of the race and the support of their hard-working team-mates, they (GC riders) have a duty.

    In my view, Shleck and his Saxo-Bank cronies have done themselves no favours in this Tour. The sheer number of ill-informed morons have jumped on this bandwagon baffles me.

    This is not golf. It seems like an excuse for those with some sort of grudge to engage in a bit of Bertie bashing.
    And I'm not a Bertie "fan", I'm a fan of bike RACING.
  • marie blanc
    marie blanc Posts: 135
    The sheer number of ill-informed morons have jumped on this bandwagon baffles me.

    And also the number of people trying to re-write Tour history, claiming the end of "sportsmanship" in cycling. What sportsmanship? when did thtis exist? In 1999 in the Passage du Gois perhaps?

    Contador and Schleck themselves seem confused about the matter. Time people did some reading - Wheatcroft wrote a nice history book on the Tour.
  • pedro118118
    pedro118118 Posts: 1,102
    marie blanc wrote:
    The sheer number of ill-informed morons have jumped on this bandwagon baffles me.

    And also the number of people trying to re-write Tour history, claiming the end of "sportsmanship" in cycling. What sportsmanship? when did thtis exist? In 1999 in the Passage du Gois perhaps?

    Contador and Schleck themselves seem confused about the matter. Time people did some reading - Wheatcroft wrote a nice history book on the Tour.

    Exactly.

    There has never been any consistency regarding the application of these 'rules' over the years, as it seems up to the complete discretion of the riders involved. Some riders do, some don't. Some do in certain circumstances (ie Armstrong waiting for Ullrich following a crash) and not in others (ie Armstrong hammering away from Iban Mayo following a crash). More pertinent in this very race was Bertie waiting for Shleck on St 2, yet Shleck not waiting for Bertie on St 3. Or Chavanel for that matter. Or Armstrong.

    Nice isn't it when you can pick and choose when to apply the rules?!
  • Deegs
    Deegs Posts: 74
    Bugly wrote:
    Ok I am a babyboomer - to me what AC did was wrong - but then I am a dinosaur. Wonder if its mostly GenYs that support the win at all costs and bugger the sportsmanship?

    Interesting- I see the stereotype of babyboomers as more self-centred than any previous generation.

    This is obviously NOT a comment about you personally but I wouldn't think it particularly likely that boomers would be especially sportsmanlike.
  • Tom Butcher
    Tom Butcher Posts: 3,830
    pedro118118 wrote:
    In my view, Shleck and his Saxo-Bank cronies have done themselves no favours in this Tour. The sheer number of ill-informed morons have jumped on this bandwagon baffles me.

    This is not golf. It seems like an excuse for those with some sort of grudge to engage in a bit of Bertie bashing.
    And I'm not a Bertie "fan", I'm a fan of bike RACING.

    Sean Kelly thought he should have slowed down, Paul Sherwen thought he should have slowed, Vino did slow down - not sure if you think those three are morons but convince us they are ill informed about bike racing.
    it's a hard life if you don't weaken.
  • deejay
    deejay Posts: 3,138
    micron wrote:
    I remember that Deejay - there are plenty of instances of the MJ being attacked when in trouble.

    Knedlicky says it best on another thread
    All this stuff about ‘noble tradition of not taking advantage of another's misfortune’, ‘big No No to attack the Yellow Jersey when the rider has a crash or mechanical’, ‘unwritten rule in the peloton that you did not capitalise on someone else's crash or mechanical’, “etiquette’, etc, is nonsense.
    It’s a race and all competitors have to take it how it comes, including rivals taking advantage when they can.

    It’s wrong to say ‘the players of TDF used to have a gamesmanship not found in other sports’, this approach never really existed in past decades, at least to the extent that some people now believe.
    Merckx didn’t wait for Ocana when he punctured, Thevenet for Merckx when he was attacked by a spectator, Zoetemelk for Hinault when he punctured, Roche for Bernard when he punctured, Chiappucci for Lemond when he punctured, etc.

    The idea of waiting only really took over during the Armstrong years, when on the one hand LA almost demanded it from others or, in order to appear magnanimous, granted it to certain others (but only in hypocritical fashion, i.e. not to all rivals), while on the other hand the media played up this notion to suggest the sport still had some ideals despite doping scandals

    Those who should know best, ex-riders Hinault, Bernard, Jalabert and Bruyneel, have all stated what Contador did is quite legitimate.
    One of them also pointed out that if people expected Contador to wait, where do you draw the line, because Menchov and Sanchez would have heard through their earpieces what had happened.
    Yes your right, this post covers my point even better.
    Organiser, National Championship 50 mile Time Trial 1972
  • disgruntledgoat
    disgruntledgoat Posts: 8,957
    pedro118118 wrote:
    rockmount wrote:
    pedro118118 wrote:
    Andy Schleck did NOT have a mechanical.
    DID TOO !!
    Every time little bertie looks at the winner's trophy he'll hear the booooos of the crowd !

    A broken chain is a "mechanical".
    Or broken anything, which makes the bike unridable without impediment.
    Poor decision-making and dismal execution of a simple gear-shift is not a "mechanical". It's a mistake. Rider error. And like any other rider error, rivals are free to captalise. Indeed, in order to maintain the credibility of the race and the support of their hard-working team-mates, they (GC riders) have a duty.

    In my view, Shleck and his Saxo-Bank cronies have done themselves no favours in this Tour. The sheer number of ill-informed morons have jumped on this bandwagon baffles me.

    This is not golf. It seems like an excuse for those with some sort of grudge to engage in a bit of Bertie bashing.
    And I'm not a Bertie "fan", I'm a fan of bike RACING.

    Quite so, back in the olden days, before indexed gears, a missed gearshift by a favourite was the cue for everybody to gain 20 metres by attacking him while he was messing about. To be able to execute the shifts properly was regardeda s part of the skillset of a good racer.
    "In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"

    @gietvangent
  • rockmount
    rockmount Posts: 761
    WOW .... you people are mostly just nuts !! sorry for posting anything, I really ought to know better by now !
    .. who said that, internet forum people ?
  • disgruntledgoat
    disgruntledgoat Posts: 8,957
    Nuts how?
    "In many ways, my story was that of a raging, Christ-like figure who hauled himself off the cross, looked up at the Romans with blood in his eyes and said 'My turn, sock cookers'"

    @gietvangent
  • rockmount
    rockmount Posts: 761
    disgruntledgoat wrote:
    Nuts how?
    Well where do I start...

    Five pages of argument over ummm feck all !
    .. who said that, internet forum people ?
  • dougzz
    dougzz Posts: 1,833
    UNwritten rules are stupid. It's a R A C E.......................
  • Teach
    Teach Posts: 386
    I do not come from a racing back ground and I am sure there are unwritten rules, but they are unwritten. Surely that prevents them from being enforceable. If they are important then they should be in the rule book. Even if they are in the rule book, professionals in lots of sports push the boundaries to see if they can get an advantage. Sometimes it works in their favour other times it doesn't and they may be disqualified sin binned etc.
    I believe in football there is an unwritten rule if a player is injured the other team may kick the ball out of play to let the medic on. This happened in a 'premiership match, could have been division 1' . The understanding the opposition throw the ball back and play continues, but the opposition took the ball and scored a goal. There was a big thing about it shouldn't have happened, but it did and it affected the result. They broke no rules. Bit like Shumacher taking his opposition out on the first bend. No rules were broken, he stopped them opposition taking points from him. It's not right people could have been killed, but technically he broke no rules.
    These people want to win. it's the selfishness/self belief that often creates these world champions.
  • iainf72
    iainf72 Posts: 15,784
    Tan Man sez

    http://tdf.sbs.com.au/tdf2010/blogartic ... nthony-Tan
    Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
  • secretsqirrel
    secretsqirrel Posts: 2,041
    Do you think the new caring, sharing Alberto will cross the finish line with his mate Andy again tomorrow? :wink::lol:
  • Buckled_Rims
    Buckled_Rims Posts: 1,648
    SecretSqirrel wrote:
    Do you think the new caring, sharing Alberto will cross the finish line with his mate Andy again tomorrow? :wink::lol:

    It'll be a miracle, it's a TT tomorrow :wink:

    However, as Contador will go last it is possible (theoretically) for him to catch Schleck and cross the line together, maybe Andy will wait for him - wow, that would be nice.
    CAAD9
    Kona Jake the Snake
    Merlin Malt 4
  • secretsqirrel
    secretsqirrel Posts: 2,041
    Buckled_Rims wrote:
    SecretSqirrel wrote:
    Do you think the new caring, sharing Alberto will cross the finish line with his mate Andy again tomorrow? :wink::lol:

    It'll be a miracle, it's a TT tomorrow :wink:

    However, as Contador will go last it is possible (theoretically) for him to catch Schleck and cross the line together, maybe Andy will wait for him - wow, that would be nice.

    I think you are understanding my little joke there, Buckle :lol:
  • luckao
    luckao Posts: 632
    iainf72 wrote:
    Tan Man sez

    http://tdf.sbs.com.au/tdf2010/blogartic ... nthony-Tan

    I wish they would do. Controversy is an inherent part of sport. Of course, you can never dispel the ill-feeling that will occur with cyclists taking advantage of each other's misfortune (and why would you, that's the fun part), but they should stop riding under the misguided assumption that they can control the variables Tan refers to.

    I felt somewhat bad for Schleck in that he seemed so naive about it all. He even went as far as to misinterpret Contador's apology.
  • guilliano
    guilliano Posts: 5,495
    Why should anyone wait for anyone who's made a mistake? Did the Olympic marathon field wait for Paula Radcliffe while she had a poo? Would Anyone try to nulify the 100m if Asafa Powell or Dwayne Chambers tripped over an untied lace? If a defender slips and leaves a forward through on goal in a football match should the forward forgo the opportunity to score?

    Personally I think Contador was right to continue. He didn't suddenly kick on, he caried on at the pace he'd set to reply to Schleck. I think his sence of fair play was shown when he slowed the peloton to wait for Sanchez after he crashed badly.
    http://www.flickr.com/photos/guilliano/
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,223
    There's been a few comments on here along the lines of "if someone's gear box breaks in F1 do you expect them to wait". Well, as on the evidence on Sunday they can't even follow the written rules they'd have no chance with the unwritten rules :wink:
  • luckao
    luckao Posts: 632
    How about a real injustice.
    Protester ruins marathon

    Italy's Stefano Baldini took gold in the men's marathon, but his victory was overshadowed after one of the runners was attacked by a protester.

    Brazilian Vanderlei de Lima was leading when the man pushed him to the side of the road four miles from the finish.

    _40015536_protesterap203.jpg

    Soon afterwards, Baldini overtook De Lima to win in a time of two hours 10:54 secs.

    Mebrahtom Keflezighi of the United States took silver, while De Lima finished with bronze.

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