WSJ Part 2

dennisn · July 2010

BikingBernie wrote:

micron wrote:

Someone was having a bad day http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQsqS-mY ... r_embedded

What an arrogant prick!. Love the way Jerkstrong deliberately shoulders the guy before stopping in order to give him the 'the stare'. It would have served him right if the guy in the white T-shirt had decked him.

Bernie, Bernie, Bernie, calm it down. Try putting a cold compress on your forehead
if you're that stressed out about this "incident". You let the littlest things bother you. Not good. Hate to see something really important get you down.

moray_gub · July 2010

BikingBernie wrote:

micron wrote:

Someone was having a bad day http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQsqS-mY ... r_embedded

What an arrogant prick!. Love the way Jerkstrong deliberately shoulders the guy before stopping in order to give him the 'the stare'. It would have served him right if the guy in the white T-shirt had decked him.

Dont see anything wrong with what he did there at all guy was in his way at the end of TDF mountain stage . I know what your problem here is that guy in the white T-Shirt was you wasnt it it you have mysteriously suddenly started visiting the Tour again (despite not being interested in pro cycling)and you wanted to give Tex a bit of dogs abuse but he got to you first.

gabriel959 · July 2010

Moray Gub wrote:

BikingBernie wrote:

micron wrote:

Someone was having a bad day http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQsqS-mY ... r_embedded

What an arrogant prick!. Love the way Jerkstrong deliberately shoulders the guy before stopping in order to give him the 'the stare'. It would have served him right if the guy in the white T-shirt had decked him.

Dont see anything wrong with what he did there at all guy was in his way at the end of TDF mountain stage . I know what your problem here is that guy in the white T-Shirt was you wasnt it it you have mysteriously suddenly started visiting the Tour again (despite not being interested in pro cycling)and you wanted to give Tex a bit of dogs abuse but he got to you first.

The guy in the white t-shirt probably doesn't even know LA is there, he is just walking and gets barged away for no reason, and also then stared at. May be its the kind of conduct you approve MG.

moray_gub · July 2010

micron wrote:

Someone was having a bad day http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQsqS-mY ... r_embedded

Loved the way the spectators all went 'oh!' when he swipes the spectator as if they thought he was genuinely a nice guy, I mean, didn't Renshaw get chucked off the race for that kind of thing?

I feel your pain i really do anyway what do you care about pro cycling.............you couldnt give a monkeys its all about LA for you.

moray_gub · July 2010

gabriel959 wrote:

Moray Gub wrote:

BikingBernie wrote:

micron wrote:

Someone was having a bad day http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQsqS-mY ... r_embedded

What an arrogant prick!. Love the way Jerkstrong deliberately shoulders the guy before stopping in order to give him the 'the stare'. It would have served him right if the guy in the white T-shirt had decked him.

Dont see anything wrong with what he did there at all guy was in his way at the end of TDF mountain stage . I know what your problem here is that guy in the white T-Shirt was you wasnt it it you have mysteriously suddenly started visiting the Tour again (despite not being interested in pro cycling)and you wanted to give Tex a bit of dogs abuse but he got to you first.

The guy in the white t-shirt probably doesn't even know LA is there, he is just walking and gets barged away for no reason, and also then stared at. May be its the kind of conduct you approve MG.

Its a bit like If you walk in the road you are gonna get hit by car.

gabriel959 · July 2010

I don't think I am going to get anything out of this but here it goes.

The guy is minding his own business, we don't even know who he was, a team mechanic? a pr guy? a visitor? In any case, LA for no reason just goes into him, he could have said excuse me or something else. It is just very poor attitude.

moray_gub · July 2010

gabriel959 wrote:

I don't think I am going to get anything out of this but here it goes.

The guy is minding his own business, we don't even know who he was, a team mechanic? a pr guy? a visitor? In any case, LA for no reason just goes into him, he could have said excuse me or something else. It is just very poor attitude.

He did shout something before he collided with him anyway if you walk around that area you run the risk of getting hit by a bike. A nothing shot so it is.

iainf72 · July 2010

dennisn wrote:

IF this goes to a Grand Jury. All you'll get is media speculation, LA, GL, FL, and whomever tough guy posturing, lawyer "statements" proclaiming their clients innocense, rightiousness or whatever, etc., etc. The real deal is going to be secret.

1) Grand Jury = no lawyers

2) Witnesses called by Grand Juries are free to discuss their testimony after the event.

3) If you'd read any of the articles you know who Jeff Novitzky is

Garry H · July 2010

Moray Gub wrote:

gabriel959 wrote:

I don't think I am going to get anything out of this but here it goes.

The guy is minding his own business, we don't even know who he was, a team mechanic? a pr guy? a visitor? In any case, LA for no reason just goes into him, he could have said excuse me or something else. It is just very poor attitude.

He did shout something before he collided with him anyway if you walk around that area you run the risk of getting hit by a bike. A nothing shot so it is.

Looks like he intentionally barged into the guy. There was plenty of space on the right for someone with his bike handling experience to go by on.

moray_gub · July 2010

iainf72 wrote:

3) If you'd read any of the articles you know who Jeff Novitzky is

There is a bit of deification going on by the ALB here with regard to Jeff.

iainf72 · July 2010

Moray Gub wrote:

iainf72 wrote:

3) If you'd read any of the articles you know who Jeff Novitzky is

There is a bit of deification going on by the ALB here with regard to Jeff.

What does that have to do with Den's inability or unwillingness to read anything before posting a comment?

rockmount · July 2010

iainf72 wrote:

Moray Gub wrote:

iainf72 wrote:

3) If you'd read any of the articles you know who Jeff Novitzky is

There is a bit of deification going on by the ALB here with regard to Jeff.

What does that have to do with Den's inability or unwillingness to read anything before posting a comment?

Have to say I don't see the point reading the same old junk, over and over again, I think barkinbernie has taught us all that lesson ..

iainf72 · July 2010

rockmount wrote:

Have to say I don't see the point reading the same old junk, over and over again, I think barkinbernie has taught us all that lesson ..

I do try to post things that are newish. There is a probably a lot of repeated stuff but I definitely don't want to be "the graph / IM guy"

So if I post something it probably contains something new / different. It will tend to favour my prejudice about Lance but that's only natural.

dennisn · July 2010

iainf72 wrote:

dennisn wrote:

IF this goes to a Grand Jury. All you'll get is media speculation, LA, GL, FL, and whomever tough guy posturing, lawyer "statements" proclaiming their clients innocense, rightiousness or whatever, etc., etc. The real deal is going to be secret.

1) Grand Jury = no lawyers

2) Witnesses called by Grand Juries are free to discuss their testimony after the event.

3) If you'd read any of the articles you know who Jeff Novitzky is

1) Knew that
2) After their testimony or after the Grand Jury ends their deliberations???
3) Don't really care who this Jeff Novitzky is. I think "you guys have got me confused with someone who cares". I don't care about GL, FL, LA, and whomever else is involved.
They made their beds and must sleep in them, just like you and I. I'm in this world for myself and my family and I think some of you should be also. Instead of obcessing over
sports figures, celebs, and the like. You'll be better off in the end.

iainf72 · July 2010

3) You're lying. You do care, that's why you keep posting.

2) After their testimony I believe.

moray_gub · July 2010

iainf72 wrote:

Moray Gub wrote:

iainf72 wrote:

3) If you'd read any of the articles you know who Jeff Novitzky is

There is a bit of deification going on by the ALB here with regard to Jeff.

What does that have to do with Den's inability or unwillingness to read anything before posting a comment?

Well Dennis trying to point out the basics to you with regards to the American legal system and that it not as clear cut as the ALB seem to think but you lot are too busy deifying Jeff to pay too much attention to the realities of the situation.

ratsbeyfus · July 2010

Sit down and read 'From Lance to Landis' - educate yourself for the coming conflicts.

iainf72 · July 2010

Moray Gub wrote:

Well Dennis trying to point out the basics to you with regards to the American legal system and that it not as clear cut as the ALB seem to think but you lot are too busy deifying Jeff to pay too much attention to the realities of the situation.

Dennis didn't appear to know a GJ witness is free to discuss their testimony, so is his input on the American legal system of any consequence?

blazing_saddles · July 2010

gabriel959 wrote:

I don't think I am going to get anything out of this but here it goes.

You called this one right.

gabriel959 wrote:

The guy is minding his own business, we don't even know who he was, a team mechanic? a pr guy? a visitor? In any case, LA for no reason just goes into him, he could have said excuse me or something else. It is just very poor attitude.

You also called this one right.
But heck, if you are walking next to a barrier in a cordoned off area, off course you expect to get hit by a car from behind. So why not a frustrated cyclist? :roll:

Just Mr Wind Up on his evening troll.

moray_gub · July 2010

Blazing Saddles wrote:

gabriel959 wrote:

I don't think I am going to get anything out of this but here it goes.

You called this one right.

gabriel959 wrote:

The guy is minding his own business, we don't even know who he was, a team mechanic? a pr guy? a visitor? In any case, LA for no reason just goes into him, he could have said excuse me or something else. It is just very poor attitude.

You also called this one right.
But heck, if you are walking next to a barrier in a cordoned off area, off course you expect to get hit by a car from behind. So why not a frustrated cyclist? :roll:

Just Mr Wind Up on his evening troll.

Aye whatever Victor............

iainf72 · July 2010

Action packed article

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-07-2 ... probe.html?

knedlicky · July 2010

gabriel959 wrote:

Moray Gub wrote:

BikingBernie wrote:

micron wrote:

Someone was having a bad day http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQsqS-mY ... r_embedded

What an arrogant prick!. Love the way Jerkstrong deliberately shoulders the guy before stopping in order to give him the 'the stare'. It would have served him right if the guy in the white T-shirt had decked him.

Dont see anything wrong with what he did there at all guy was in his way at the end of TDF mountain stage . I know what your problem here is that guy in the white T-Shirt was you wasnt it it you have mysteriously suddenly started visiting the Tour again (despite not being interested in pro cycling)and you wanted to give Tex a bit of dogs abuse but he got to you first.

The guy in the white t-shirt probably doesn't even know LA is there, he is just walking and gets barged away for no reason, and also then stared at. May be its the kind of conduct you approve MG.

LA was having another of his weak spate-of-crashes moments and would have landed on the deck but for a coincidental shoulder. So I think he probably turned round and said 'merci ... connard'.

Pokerface · July 2010

Going back to the video - looks like he lost his balance a little going around the guy. There was a barrier on one side and at slow speed the bike can wobble like that (I've done it myself).

Still - there stopping and staring was a little OTT. As was the 'get off' stuff with the cameraman at the end of the clip.

I'd probably be pissed too if I spent all day in a break and got outsprinted by everyone else in it!

Pokerface · July 2010

iainf72 wrote:

Action packed article

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-07-2 ... probe.html?

Which of the 14 words in the article were the most action-packed? :oops:

iainf72 · July 2010

Ok, here's a more action packed article

http://sports.espn.go.com/oly/cycling/n ... id=5399613

BikingBernie · July 2010

"He lost his balance", "He turned round to apologise", "Armstrong did nothing wrong there, just as a car driver who runs someone down from behind has done nothing wrong", "It's alright to act like a prick if you get out-sprinted by a couple of second-rate Frenchmen and other assorted 'no marks' after sitting on their wheel all day".

I can hardly wait to hear what the Armstrong fanboys are going to come out with once he is forced into admitting that he doped his way to his 7 Tour 'wins'. It's going to be hilarious!

guinea · July 2010

I'm really not trying to stir up an argument, but don't most Lance fans accept he doped?

I've been a fan since 1999 when I watched my first tour while living in Switzerland and I think he probably doped.

However, I think it's double standards from his detractors to hold Lance above Miguel Indurain, Eddy Merckx, Jan Ulrich, Frank Schleck or Alberto Contandor when the evidence also exists that they cheated too.

On the balance of probability there's probably never been a clean winner of the Tour in the proffessional era. By all means denounce cheating, but to symbolise one guy as the problem is to airbrush out the actual facts.

BikingBernie · July 2010

guinea wrote:

I'm really not trying to stir up an argument, but don't most Lance fans accept he doped?

It's a sad reflection on human rationality, but many Armstrong fans still deny that he doped, despite all the evidence to the contrary.

guinea wrote:

I think it's double standards from his detractors to hold Lance above Miguel Indurain, Eddy Merckx, Jan Ulrich, Frank Schleck or Alberto Contandor when the evidence also exists that they cheated too.

But criticism of Armstrong is based on a lot more than the simple fact that he was (is?) a doper. For example, the way he has cynically used cancer in order to shield himself from criticism; his generally obnoxious 'personality' (see above for an illustration); his personal enforcement of the 'omerta', as with his bullying of people like Bassons and Simeoni and his threats to 'destroy' people who spoke out against doping, such as Prentice Steffen. It has also been argued that Armstrong was instrumental in ensuring that the shock of the Festina scandal did not lead to any lasting change in the sport. As Frankie Andreu put it 'After 1999, you know many things changed. lance did not'.

http://www.cbc.ca/sports/indepth/landis ... ssage.html

cajun_cyclist · July 2010

guinea wrote:

I'm really not trying to stir up an argument, but don't most Lance fans accept he doped?

I've been a fan since 1999 when I watched my first tour while living in Switzerland and I think he probably doped.

However, I think it's double standards from his detractors to hold Lance above Miguel Indurain, Eddy Merckx, Jan Ulrich, Frank Schleck or Alberto Contandor when the evidence also exists that they cheated too.

On the balance of probability there's probably never been a clean winner of the Tour in the proffessional era. By all means denounce cheating, but to symbolise one guy as the problem is to airbrush out the actual facts.

Professional era starting?? When??

Personally, Classic riders Bartali and Bobet I think were probably clean, Bartali in fact famously going after Coppi on the subject. These two riding after World War II though Bartali actually wins a TdF before the war.

But the overwhelming majority of riders and winners sure, I'd think they used.

I'm starting to think, doping is so prevalent, maybe it is wrong to go after any rider and have a righteous attitude about it.

However, with Lance I believe part of it IS in fact, he invites the scrutiny with his acts, going after certain riders, etc.

moray_gub · July 2010

BikingBernie wrote:

"He lost his balance", "He turned round to apologise", "Armstrong did nothing wrong there, just as a car driver who runs someone down from behind has done nothing wrong", "It's alright to act like a prick if you get out-sprinted by a couple of second-rate Frenchmen and other assorted 'no marks' after sitting on their wheel all day".

I can hardly wait to hear what the Armstrong fanboys are going to come out with once he is forced into admitting that he doped his way to his 7 Tour 'wins'. It's going to be hilarious!

F*ck me LA really gets into your head doesnt he..........seems to eat you up inside, so much pent up hatred. You really need to get a grip you are coming across as old bitter individual.

WSJ Part 2

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