Tdf Stage 5 *spoiler*

iainf72

magicrhodes wrote:

True and I agree with you completely, cycling is a team sport and you need a good one. I'm just sick of these holier than thou fans who think having a downer on Cav and Wiggins put them above us. Seriously I had one guy try to tell me that cycling fans aren't patriotic which is just wrong!

Ahhh, so we're in agreement. I don't like Cavendish or Wiggins but it has zero to do with where they're from.

woodford2barbican

iainf72 wrote:

That might be true in some cases, sure. But I don't believe it's the case in general.

Saying "oooh, you're just trying to be cool and un-British" ignores the fact that perhaps people do find Cavendish objectionable. Hell, they might even feel it more acutely because he's "British" - I don't know. To me, Cavendish is very much like Ricco. A very good bike rider, big "personality" but an absolute tool (based on your book, your many TV and magazine interviews Mark, not just 5 minutes post stage BTW)

You don't tend to see people begrudging Hammond or Jez Hunt doing well, do you?

Personally - I don't begrudge anyone doing well. Seems churlish to me.

DaveyL

iainf72 wrote:

That might be true in some cases, sure. But I don't believe it's the case in general.

Saying "oooh, you're just trying to be cool and un-British" ignores the fact that perhaps people do find Cavendish objectionable. Hell, they might even feel it more acutely because he's "British" - I don't know. To me, Cavendish is very much like Ricco. A very good bike rider, big "personality" but an absolute tool (based on your book, your many TV and magazine interviews Mark, not just 5 minutes post stage BTW)

You don't tend to see people begrudging Hammond or Jez Hunt doing well, do you?

I didn't say it was the case in general though. Of course people have a whole range of reasons to like and dislike other people. I suspect it operates a fair bit though, even if only on a subconscious level.

And the point about Hammond and Hunt only reinforces my point - they ain't mainstream.

Tusher

Sigh.
I am so pleased for Cav this evening.

dennisn

DaveyL wrote:

iainf72 wrote:

magicrhodes wrote:

Sometimes I do honestly think that some people are gutted to have a set of good/great British riders because they felt that supporting foreigners (sorry but it is the most suitable word) makes them better than everyone else.

Cavendish depended on an Australian, German, Austrian, Belarusian and that guy from Belgium to win his race today. For an American team. With a German sprint mentor.

So if you support Cav, you support foreigners.

I agree with that though. There's a certain type of cycling fan who's a bit of a snob. Part of the reason they like cycling is that it's a minority sport in the UK, and they get to be into this cool minority sport that's really great, that no-one else "gets". Whenever there is a successful British rider, it raises the profile of the sport, the sport becomes more mainstream and more "commoners" get into the sport, thus diluting it. Kind of like being into a cool band no-one knows about before they make it big. Hence the reason there is also a lot of dislike of Sky from some quarters.

+1... You could use the example of Lemond and then Armstrong here in the States. Exact same thing. Not that it's bad or anything like that.
So you're also saying that some cyclist's dislike Sky because they make cycling more mainstream? That they don't want the sport to be "diluted"? I guess I have known some people like that too. I remember one guy who, after Lemond came on the scene, decided that cycling wasn't quite "exclusive"(for lack of a better word) enough for him anymore, moved to California, and now climbs mountains. Or at least that's the last I've heard.

DaveyL

Oh well. There goes any credibility I had...

Cleat Eastwood

iainf72 wrote:

To me, Cavendish is very much like Ricco. A very good bike rider, big "personality" but an absolute tool (based on your book, your many TV and magazine interviews Mark, not just 5 minutes post stage BTW)

Absolutely spot on IMO.

DaveyL

I disagree with the Cav / Ricco comparisons - at least to an extent. They may both come across badly, but I think Cav does display moments of self-reflection which I have not really seen from Ricco.

Pross

Good sprint, physical but clean. EBH for green for me, he'll pick up points in all but the highest mountains and Thor hasn't been that good in the big sprints. Other than the pave stage EBH would be right up there.

oldwelshman

Great win for Cav, especially after loads of crap in the forums yesterday as usual
I am impressed with Sky so far also, Geraint is riding very well and led EBH up well today and yesterday.
Depending how much work he does for wiggins, he could be a threat for points but it looks like he is working for EBH. He may bury himself for Wiggo but doing well for now.
You never know he may go better that Fab on one of the harder days over the climbs and get Yellow for a day or so

RichN95.

DaveyL wrote:

I agree with that though. There's a certain type of cycling fan who's a bit of a snob. Part of the reason they like cycling is that it's a minority sport in the UK, and they get to be into this cool minority sport that's really great, that no-one else "gets". Whenever there is a successful British rider, it raises the profile of the sport, the sport becomes more mainstream and more "commoners" get into the sport, thus diluting it. Kind of like being into a cool band no-one knows about before they make it big. Hence the reason there is also a lot of dislike of Sky from some quarters.

You're very much right I think. But I don't think that that sort of fan isn't particularly common on this forum. They are far more noticable on the CyclingNews or BBC forums (although some of them are self loathing Brits). I'm reminded of my old housemate who used to like obscure bands, but dropped them like a stone if they became remotely mainstream.

I think on here there are some who just prefer there sportsmen to be polite, placid corporate drones - like Tim Henman. And I shared a few beers with Henman once and he's not at all like his public image.

Having said all that, the Tour is a little exotic and that's some of it's appeal. So when some kid from Whitchurch gets the white jersey and could get the yellow, it's just wrong . I mean, I know some people he went to school with him, I often play hockey at his old school against a couple of his old teachers ("we didn't see much of him"). He was even on the back page of the Echo. It's nonsense. I'm done with the Tour. Bring on the Eneco - proper obscure Belgians.

iainf72

RichN95 wrote:

I think on here there are some who just prefer there sportsmen to be polite, placid corporate drones - like Tim Henman. And I shared a few beers with Henman once and he's not at all like his public image.

This is an over simplication. Cavendish comes across as a huge knob a lot of the time. Look at the way he keeps going on and on about Thor winning the green last year.

Cavendish seems to have a sense of entitlement, and I mean that in the worst possible way.

disgruntledgoat

Seems to work for him though, Iain. This is my thing with Cav, I accept he's probably a knobhead, but he's harder on himself than anyone else and that seems to be how he motivates himself. I don't really care if he's an arse, I don't have to live next door to him, I enjoy watching him win bike races.

Probably similar to my feelings on Cipo, although he was much more entertaining.

frenchfighter

I admire his sprint - the speed, acceleration, technique and positioning. That's it though.

frenchfighter

Yes, that is meant to be blood spatters on Cav's bike...

k2rider

frenchfighter wrote:

Yes, that is meant to be blood spatters on Cav's bike...

and?..................... does anyone actually care how his bike is painted and if they did how sad does that make them?

frenchfighter

It always surprises me the amount of people who seem to take offence when anything to do with equipment, kit etc is mentioned/commented on. Very bizzare that it riles them and they feel the need to express their displeasure. If it is not something you care about them simply don't comment, it serves no positive worth.

pb21

frenchfighter wrote:

It always surprises me the amount of people who seem to take offence when anything to do with equipment, kit etc is mentioned/commented on. Very bizzare that it riles them and they feel the need to express their displeasure. If it is not something you care about them simply don't comment, it serves no positive worth.

+1

Keep the pics coming FF.

Pokerface

EBH has one of the most awkward sprinting styles I have ever seen - bouncing up and down like a yo-yo. But he certainly does get some speed.

FransJacques

Will Petacchi win another or has Chav now found the magic combination? From the overhead it looked a bit scary for the other sprinters -> no one was coming back on him in the last 30 meters.

Today we should see another sprint.

Pross

I think HTC played it right yesterday by not having a full lead out train like they used last year and making use of other teams. I think Petacchi has to go early and it's difficult to do that on too many occassions.