"You can't imagine how angry and pissed off I am."

Dgh

I thought yesterday's stage was great! Nice to have something in the first week to break things up, and better to do it with a some cobbles than with a team time trial.

Pity about FS, and VDV, but that's bike racing.

Did people want to get rid of mountain stages after Beloki's crash? Of course not!

takethehighroad

I'd like to see him tell Cancellara and O'Grady that Paris-Roubaix is a stupid race.

As has been said before, winning the Tour de France is about completing the course in the fastest time

Cumulonimbus

Does he want to tell LA that the 1999 tour GC should be annulled due to an unfair advantage caused by going over the Passage du Gois?

Tom Butcher

It's routine for Jens to whine whenever race organisers put in any challenges like this - if Jens isn't upset then the race organisers aren't doing their job properly.

pedro118118

I seem to recall Frank has had multiple pile-ups on multiple parcours. I don't see many people calling for Amstel Gold, Tour de Suisse etc to be removed from the pro calender.

The argument seems to come down whether these 'spectacles' have any place in a Grand Tour, in that there are too may variables and the terrain makes the races more of a game of chance, rather than a test of rider talent/resolve.

My view would be that a winner of the Tour has to prove himself the best overall rider around, having dealt with all the challenges put in front of him. Luck has always been a factor (mechanicals, punctures, crashes etc). Otherwise it's just a very drawn out climbing/TT competition?

Frankly, the riders/teams always have a choice. If they want to protest, don't participate in the race.

Cancellara has gone way down in view - for him to dictate to the peleton (presumably having been instructed down his earpiece from Riis) who rides and who doesn't is scandalous. It was clear that his actions rendered the stage much 'fairer' to some teams (ie his own) than others. No wonder the likes of Columbia, Rabobank and Garmin provided support - pure coincidence that Cav, Freire and Farrar were off the back and out of the green jersey points.

A dangerous precedent...

ScottieP

Glad to see that there is consensus here that Jens is completely wrong on this one ... putting in the cobbles was a great move and has mixed up the GC a bit and made the race more interesting - I'm sorry that Frank got hurt - but that is part and parcel of racing.

As we saw in the Giro - mixing up the race stages makes for a much better race ... I certainly don't want to see just a TT specilalist or a specialist climber being able to win the race - how dull.

inkyfingers

I was worried after stage 2 that the race might become a joke, thankfully yesterday they just raced without any bullshit. I didn't see Saxo Bank/CSC complaining about the roads in the Ardennes when Andy rode away solo to win Leige last year, or when Frank won Amstel Gold a few years ago!

For such a hard bastard Jens does like a whinge, and he's entitled to say what he thinks, however when one team takes it upon itself to decided when they can race is wrong and the organisers must not be seen to condone it or it will happen again. What will happen if a couple of GC candidates go down on a decent in the Pyrenees, will they neautralize it then?

Neil McC

Don't agree with Jens at all. All the reasons have been stated by others in this thread.

Homer J

That stage made great tv

RichN95.

Sonny73 wrote:

Here's a video of Jen's anger post race: http://link.brightcove.com/services/player/bcpid28343239001?bctid=109510111001

"I lost one of my best friends today". Jens seems to think he's in Afghanistan.

disquieting_museeuws

I am amazed and disgusted about the vitriol Frank Schleck attracts - this is a man who has won Amstel Gold and on Alpe d'Huez. His achievements on a bike are virtually beyond comprehension for the vast majority.

redddraggon

disquieting_museeuws wrote:

I am amazed and disgusted about the vitriol Frank Schleck attracts - this is a man who has won Amstel Gold and on Alpe d'Huez. His achievements on a bike are virtually beyond comprehension for the vast majority.

His achievements don't eliminate his ability to fall off though.

pedro118118

Homer J wrote:

That stage made great tv

Certainly did, bit not just great TV, it gave the big favourites something else to think about - a different kind of challenge to deal with. Some stepped up (Schleck A, Bertie, Cadel, Menchov, Wiggo etc), some didn't (Basso, Sastre, Armstrong etc). The time gaps are by no means catastrophic, but it puts the onus on some GC guys to attack/gain time sooner, rather than later.

I think it was a master stroke.

chriskempton

The last thing I want to do is stick up for LA, but in the interests of fairness, he was unlucky to puncture. For once. Like, ever.

chriskempton

I'd also like to thank my daughter for contracting chicken pox and forcing me to work from home.

With the TV on

eh

I feel sorry for Frank, but to moan at the organisers (Jens that is), is daft as Andy managed to ride the stage excellently. At the end of the day while the organisers have a duty to make sure the risks are sensible, the simple fact is cycling is very safe compared to many other sports and professions. Plus cycling crashes happen on all surfaces, plenty of horror crashes have happened on indoor tracks, where you can't get a much more ideal surface environment for racing if you tried.

Philip S

Kléber wrote:

Looking at the video, it seems Frank Shleck goes down by himself. A real shame he's out of the race but he wasn't taken down by a freak event, it looks like a handling error. Clearly Voigt is going to be upset but these things happen, contenders always drop out.

It looked to me that Tony Martin crashed in front of Schleck and Frank went down hard as a result of hitting Martin's bike, which then got tangled up with the Garmin rider's bike.

It's not entirely clear as there's a strategically placed tree that obscures things, but that's how it looks to me.
See it here at 3.05 in: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=25mho3YxcM0
Martin goes down just before the tree, then Frank hits the bike just as he is about to go behind the tree.

Doobz

Jens needs to STFU and ride his bike

Anonymous

Cake and eat it syndrome.

MrChuck

I like Voigt but he does say some silly things sometimes. Remember when they tried a couple of stages last year without radios? He compared it to trying some stages without brakes.

It's a shame when riders get hurt and when big names go out early but that's the way it goes. The cobbles yesterday made for a good stage.

greeny12

chriskempton wrote:

The last thing I want to do is stick up for LA, but in the interests of fairness, he was unlucky to puncture. For once. Like, ever.

However, in the run-up to the cobbled sections, several commentators were saying "don't ride in the dirt on the sides, that's much riskier for punctures"

Where was Lance riding at the time? Yup, you guessed it. Unlike Cancellara and Schleck, among others, who gritted their teeth and rode on the crown of the cobbles, like you're supposed to.

Maybe those old bones didn't like a shakin'....

Monty Dog

Give me open, honest racing like this anyday - anything that 'livens' up LeTour in week 1 is a good thing - particularly as they've ditched the TTT where entire teams are charged up to create artificial advantages for their GC contenders. Evans clearly has a big opportunity too now that he won't be 3 minutes down as we hit the mountains.

It's also ironic that the biggest whinge comes from the team that effectively neutralised Monday's stage - Andy Schleck should be 2 minutes down on GC by my reckoning - probably due to his brother's pathological inability to ride a bike down anything but a smooth, straight road. The fact that Frank's out is probably a good thing for Andy's GC prospects.

Thick Tester

Shame on you all for taking the stick to him....

Here is a man who has seen it all, even sanded his face on the Col du Petit St Bernard. He knows whats normal and whats acceptable after 15 years of being at the top.. He won't speak like this without good reason in his capacity as part of the riders union.

Beside this he craps more sense than you 'orrible lot can spout about compact chainsets.

Just a little reminder

http://www.bigringriding.com/post/707584392/chuck

Anonymous

Thick Tester wrote:

Shame on you all for taking the stick to him....

Here is a man who has seen it all, even sanded his face on the Col du Petit St Bernard. He knows whats normal and whats acceptable after 15 years of being at the top.. He won't speak like this without good reason in his capacity as part of the riders union.

Beside this he craps more sense than you 'orrible lot can spout about compact chainsets.

Just a little reminder

http://www.bigringriding.com/post/707584392/chuck

Fair point you make here, but what is better, compact or standard ?

deejay

Chrissz wrote:

Why is he whining? Forgive me if I'm wrong but haven't they known about the route for six months before the start? Haven't they done team/individual recce of the route? Haven't most of the tems been out training on the cobbles before the start of the tour?

Of course they have and I bet Saxo were licking their lips that this was a Plus stage for them. (oh sorry it was wasn't it)
Proof of the training they have done is that Andy looked like a veteran Roubaix rider.

Murderers how come.??
They are always oversubscribed for the Paris-Roubaix when Cold North winds blow.
That one notorious bad bike handler falls off. Well we have seen him do that too often.
Belt up Jens you are out of order.

Gingerflash

To be fair to Frank, I think it's only Jens Voigt who has complained. Neither of the Schlecks, as far as I'm aware, has said there was anything wrong with that stage being included.

FWIW I tyhink Voigt has go this one wrong and I don't see anyone else joining his coimplaint. I guess he was still wound up after seeing his mate carted off, not necessarily a considered comment.

It also looked to me like someone crashed in the left gutter, just in front of Frank; a split second later, his front wheel slid out. I guess he grabbed a load of front brake in reaction to the rider falling on the left. Sure a better bike handler might have stayed upright, but I don't think he just fell for no reason.

Apart from the loss of Frank, Saxo had a great day, retaking yellow and Andy regaining the time he lost in the prologue. The loss of Frank might even help Andy in the mountains if it enables him to be more selfish and focus on his own ride instead of always trying to help his brother.

I thought it made for great racing, doing as much to the GC as a long TT or mountain top finish, albeit with different winners and losers. The only shame was that punctures played such a major part for some but that's the way it goers in any sport on wheels.

As for the day before, why did the other riders go along with Cancellara's protest? Hushovd just sat alongside Cancellara at the finish and then complained afterwards. How come he didn't tell FC to stoick it and that he and his team were still going to race?

Gingerflash

"rode on the crown of the cobbles, like you're supposed to.

Obviously, only cobble novices ride in the gutters.

chriskempton

greeny12 wrote:

chriskempton wrote:

The last thing I want to do is stick up for LA, but in the interests of fairness, he was unlucky to puncture. For once. Like, ever.

However, in the run-up to the cobbled sections, several commentators were saying "don't ride in the dirt on the sides, that's much riskier for punctures"

Where was Lance riding at the time? Yup, you guessed it. Unlike Cancellara and Schleck, among others, who gritted their teeth and rode on the crown of the cobbles, like you're supposed to.

Maybe those old bones didn't like a shakin'....

There were loads of riders in the gutters, but not many punctures!

Gingerflash

Indeed. It's a common way of riding them. There's usually 3 lines to take, the crown and both gutters, assuming the crowds aren't encroaching too much,

deejay

pedro118118 wrote:

Homer J wrote:

That stage made great tv

Certainly did, bit not just great TV, it gave the big favourites something else to think about - a different kind of challenge to deal with.

I am very happy to see these 2 stages on TV. (for better or worse)
They commemorate 2 races that are older than the TDF.
Mr TUE has done the "U S" a favour by riding the Giro last year and (wait for it) putting up a gritty show yesterday on Historic French Roads.
They comment with "Is there any other race" and these pictures will have broadend their knowlege.