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Tameside Crits in Ashton.

freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
edited July 2010 in Amateur race
Well I did one today, cost me 18 quid, 10 quid for a day license, gonna have to buy a BC license ASAP.

In the end, they combined Cat Elite, 1, 2,3,4, it was hard, I seemed to have got an awful bit of heartburn that lasted most of the race, seems to come on every time, but I overcome it, I was blowing up but managed to get on someone's wheel to recover.

At the end, I don't know what happened, I slowed down and took it steady for a lap, thinking that was the end lap, I don't know if I should have actually carried on, the main group did and they pulled everyone else off, it was confusing and I'll probably never know where I came.

Suffice to say, I'm disappointed, as there was about 20 people still going, I don't know what the hell happened and I'm peed off about it.

I know it's mostly tactics, I do it wrong every time, a guy that managed to stick it till the end who was in the main group, I was hanging on his back wheel pretty comfortable then overtook, he set off in the Cat E/1/2 group though so obviously lapped me, I think, not that I noticed us getting lapped.



  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,667
    Google Translate button won't work.

    Can anyone tell me what he just said?
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    Funny...... not.

    It's perfectly readable, your comment is only warranted for walls of unbroken text...
  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,667
    I think your confusion in the race has translated to your description of the race, I haven't a clue what happened!

    Anyhoo, how was the the new circuit? Any good? Looks quite long and with a right censored of a hairpin.
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    It's about same length as saltayre, someone lost it on the corner, I also lost it but stayed up right.

    It's a good circuit.
  • CrimmeyCrimmey Posts: 207
    Lol. You aint the only one who didn't have a clue what happened. I was with the E/1/2 group for what seemed like ages after they overtook :) and pulled out as I saw everyone else had as I thought only the E/1/2 were racing. Then my missus and m8 kept asking me why I pulled out as there were 3 guys at the end still racing that hadn't lapped me and they thought I was infront of. Why was everyone waiting in the pits after? Well it was my first race ever and will deffo do it again. Racing discipline from everyone was top notch I thought.
  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,667
    Why did they put them all in together? Low turnout?
  • CrimmeyCrimmey Posts: 207
    Timing, I think. The last race started very late
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    Yes, low Cat 3/4 turnout.
  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,667


    It's new though... Next year I will be there as often as poss...
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    I might do oulton park next week, it's TLi ain't it?

    I believe that TLi races are no where near as hard as BC races now tho, people on TLi races must be using it as a recovery ride.
  • Yes, they combined the 2 races because of a low turn out, mainly from the 3rd and 4ths.
    I guess that normal at the opening of any new circuit series. Also add to that the fact the season is half way over already and many people may already be involved in some other league (salt ayre maybe).

    I'm hoping attendance rises as the circuit is ace! Also it could be a Preston style disaster mixing all cats, including elites, with that hairpin.

    To those who got pulled out and a frustrated that they didn't know where they have come fear not... you came nowhere. I think, in most leagues at least, if you're not in the top ten you don't get any kind of placing so even if you didn't get pulled out you'd not have received a place. :(
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    I reckon I could have got a placing, I'm physically capable of it, but end up buggering it up doing silly things.

    I noticed how fast the bunch moved away when I was sat behind someone struggling, and I could not overtake due to other people coming past, which then meant I had to sprint to catch them up, and could not, when if I got on the back straight away it's be straight forward holding onto them.
  • ProssPross Posts: 32,793
    So did they combine the races or space the starts out? It seems nuts to have two races running at the same time but that's the impression I got of what happened! The only reason you should have been pulled out was if you'd been lapped by someone who started with you (they usually only pull you out on the last lap to avoid confusion and you should be given your placing at that time).

    How did the racing compare with the TLI races?
  • Slow1972Slow1972 Posts: 362
    I've never read so much mis-information as Will has posted up here, obvioulsy it was a bit easier to see what unfolded from the side of the circuit than in Will's racing mode.

    For clarity:

    - There was a shortage of E/1/2s (around 10), not Cat 3/4s (30 odd).

    - The E/1/2s were started ahead of the 3/4s instead of all together (which can lead to 3/4 simply trying to cling onto coat-tails). As a result the 3/4 race was already blown into 3 separate bunches and a few odd ones here and there before the E/1/2 starting catching and passing 3/4s.

    - Will and the bunch he was in was caught and passed by the E/1/2 group. As that group progressed it picked other faster 3/4s and that larger combined group lapped the other 3/4s (including Will). The 3/4s pulled were lapped which is why the riders were told "if you have been lapped, pull out"

    - The riders were pulled to make judging of the finish easier to avoid lapped riders contesting the finish. There were enough Cat 3/4 finishers to have a full 1 to 10 result. So no-one missed out on a placing worth BC points. There was a lapped rider who stayed on, but he had been spotted and accounted for in the results.

    - As it was run with everyone together it meant a longer race than if they had been run separately. Good or bad depending on your point of view.

    - All this was explained to Will after the race who admitted as to not knowing where he was, who had passed him and who hadn't.

    It was the first EVER senior race on the circuit, so it was a learning experience for riders, organisers and commissaires alike. There was a lot of happy riders who enjoyed an evenings circuit racing, for people living in or close to Manchester this was the first time for ages they had been able to that without a long trip to Preston or Liverpool.

    There will undoubtedly be the odd tweak of arrangements (predominantly youth / junior race durations) going forward.

    Will is a young and inexperienced racer, he hasn't got the greatest awareness of what is unfolding in the race around him yet and has acknowledged as much. Because of this I wouldn't want other riders to read this thread, get the wrong impression and simply not go down to the Ashton circuit and trying a race out for themselves.

    Put it this way - it was happy days for the E/1/2s last night - a finish got you points....

    It's only £8 for seniors, there's no race league affiliaition like other crits in the North West and its 5 minutes off the M60. It's being run by a mix of local clubs in conjunction with BC to offer local midweek racing, not the worst thing in the world is it?

    Will - you're improving well and there were some quick cat 3/4s there last night who are well on the way to Cat 2 status, so don't beat yourself up. Carry on racing, learn to read the race, what's unfolding around you, who's where and react to it. And having a few easy laps usually ends up with you being an also ran.
  • ProssPross Posts: 32,793
    Cue argument about not being lapped!

    Slow1972 - would it be worth splitting the races as a 4th only and an E/1/2/3? One thing I hear said quite often is there aren't enough 4th cat only races. Just an idea.
  • Slow1972Slow1972 Posts: 362
    Hehe, I'm not going to get into a wider debate with him about whether he was lapped or not. If you go on the BC website there's an article on last night's racing now. The gallery shows how blown apart the race became. Coupled with concentrating on riding I suspect it was one reason why Will lost track of where he was relative to the leaders.

    I know what you say about splitting E/1/2/3 and 4ths only. I suspect for now it will remain E/1/2 and 3/4ths.

    However, I suspect that when things settle down there will be other races that aren't part of the Tameside evening series that are organised on the circuit. It may be that one or more of the clubs interested in organising those races (hint hint) would be looking at holding some 4ths only races on them ;)
  • redddraggonredddraggon Posts: 10,862
    Which one is will?

    I like bikes...

  • a_n_ta_n_t Posts: 2,011
    the one being lapped :P
    Manchester wheelers

    10m 20:21 2014
    25m 53:18 20:13
    50m 1:57:12 2013
    100m Yeah right.
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    I'm not denying I got lapped, it's clear in the end. But in the end, it was about getting on the back of the right people I think, I got on the back of the wrong peoples sometimes, so I had to overtake and trying to catch anyone absolutely killed me I'm amazed I kept going, I'd have no problem keeping up with them in the group, it's just making sure I can get through.

    It's sort of pike being on a checkers board I think.

    I'm going to have to do much more training, but I don't want to loose hill climbing performance so I'm still doing hilly rides when I can.
  • Slow1972Slow1972 Posts: 362
    Of course it's about who you're on the back of, the trick is following them when they decide to accelerate and clear off up the circuit and that's what is usually the selection between the winners and the also rans.

    There's more to racing than simply being able to pedal fast Will. You need to get more practice of watching what's going on, reading the moves and reacting, not just following the couple of wheels in front of you. The short hard bursts to close gaps are also something that requires training for. Hill climbing won't do you any harm, but you need to be able to accelerate quickly and often to follow jumps in racing or make your own.

    The more you race, the easier it will become.
  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,667
    The big change for me in my last BC race came from riding much more smart, e.g. moving up the bunch when it uses the least amount of energy etc. rather than thinking 'Ooh, good! A rest!'
  • mcrdavemcrdave Posts: 501
    I had no excuse not to go, it's 10 minutes from my house, 30minutes from work. Really happy to have a circuit like this on my doorstep.

    From doing Preston, I'd say it's safer in some ways and not in others. Preston is 8ft wide, shrinking down to 6ft in places but when the hammers down you better get in the middle or you're on the grass.

    Tameside on the other hand, remains a nice even width around the circuit. But it's more technical than Preston, I clipped my pedals on a few corners. Being a lanky get, and having 175mm cranks doesnt help. The hairpin and 2nd to last corner are definitely clippable if you're not careful, saw a few guys do this. A guy who wrote off his Scott Addict on Tues so it's not without it's dangers.

    It flows really well though and you can get into a rhythm quite nicely. You just need to quickly learn to hold your line through the bends, you can see the track riders out there, they don't budge an inch round the bends. I think it'll be a good series once they get enough numbers to seperate the 2 races.

    I turned up at 6.15 not knowing what time the 3/4 race would be. As they started both races at 8, I was bloody starving by then and I wanted the race to bypass the mcd's drivethru! It was fun though, I managed 6th in the 3/4s, just struggled on the last couple of laps as the big hitters ramped it up.

    Hopefully be there next tues, later and properly fed this time.
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    I was belting round the last corner up to the start line and I clipped the floor.
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    Should be doing this tonight, I've got a BC Membership (Silver) and license now. Hopefully it'll be worthwhile, got about 11 races lined up for the rest of the season, might not get into all of them, I'll pre enter them all at the start of July when I'm home.

    Hopefully tonight I'll do better than last week!
  • mcrdavemcrdave Posts: 501
    Report on 2nd week of the Tameside event:

    Similar numbers to last week for the 3/4 race. They started the E/1/2s a lap after ours this time, just to mix things up a bit.

    Quick start as with most crits but after a few laps it settles down, quickly found the back straight was the place to move up the field and try to get away as there was a brisk headwind so you just had to man up and go for it! Had a try, got away for a lap or so but nothing stuck.

    All fairly settled until the E/1/2s caught us, then we started to mix it with the big boys, Ben Swift hooning it on the front! Felt pretty good and was in the first 5 or so. Noticed quite a few Mcr Wheelers going off the front one after another, was that a pre planned tactic maybe? Wear down the competition?

    So all was well, I was happily in the first 5 or so still, nicely placed until we started to catch back markers and then, scrape, bang, ouch. Round the hairpin a back marker came off, took down a Mcr wheeler chap and myself. He panicked, clipped a pedal and that was that. I didn't go down but the main bunch went through, my chain was off and gears were knocked out of synch so effectively game over. Although I later found out bout the lap out rule, if you get caught up in an incident you can take a lap out, will know next time!

    Was pretty pee'd off as it was just befor the 5 lap board but thats racing I guess. Just wanted to rid myself of the 4th Cat and last night would have done it if I'd finished in the top 8. censored !

    Oh well, will be back next week.
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    It was me who went down, did I deffo clip my pedal on the floor? That is a relief, I thought I might have went round the corner wrong and slipped.

    I never knew about that lap out rule too, although even if I did, on that occasion I'd have not got back in I was nearly fainting for some reason and feeling proper sick and dizzy.

    So was I in the top 5? I looked at the people in front and was thinking, I was about 12th, unless we had some E/1/2 in the bunch too?

    What is a back marker? The numbers?
  • mcrdavemcrdave Posts: 501
    First things first, is your bike alright!? Pretty sure it was a clip, there were about 10 riders in that bunch, mix of E/1/2s and 3/4s so would have been a top ten finish! If that's any consolation, you know for next week roughly what level you're riding at!
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    My bike is ok, my handlebars turned sidewards due to the force, my front right shifter has the top of it smashed, the top cap on it with Shimano 105 or w/e on, and a chunk chipped out of the shifter, and that's about it.

    I've got a couple of grazes which make it abit uncomfortable sleeping lol but apart from that everything seems ok.
  • mcrdavemcrdave Posts: 501
    Ah well, you'll be fixed soon enough I'm sure, Scrapes and grazes soon heal! Take it easy.
  • BronzieBronzie Posts: 4,927
    freehub wrote:
    What is a back marker?
    Someone who is being lapped / off the back.
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