Commuter Chat forum?

DonDaddyD

deptfordsomething wrote:

That was why I suggested having more than one route into Cake Stop, a bit like a café with more than one entrance.

Yes, but by doing that you take away the magic that is this commuting section. The reason why people post off topic threads in this section is because they want their friends they've made in this section to participate.

It's why there is both a Morpeth and Yokel friday beers thread in this section (which is well attended by people who participate in this section). It's why we discuss sportives, social rides and weekends away, here, and not post these in the road section or any other section of the website. It's why we ask buying advice here and not elsewhere. We do so because we want to discuss it here with people, other commuters, who we feel most comfortable with and who we have built a rapport and understanding.

If you remove that then you dilute or kill the community that has developed here.

bails87 wrote:

The MTB section, as with the road section, has a specific OT area, so if you were to put something silly in MTB General or Road Buying Advice, then you'd be told off for it...

And that's friendly? I think you've highlighted why people choose to post here be it off or on topic. More tolerance, less intimidating.

lost_in_thought

OldSkoolKona wrote:

DonDaddyD wrote:

Why does it need to change? What's the problem? The forum is healthy and active.

If you create a commuting cake stop forum it would serve to break up/seperate the (online) community that has developed in this section. A community that has developed because this section is the way it is.

Half the reason we feel comfortable posting things above and beyond "our journey to work today" and rigidly commuter specific topics is because a community has developed.

It's the commuter based topics that have made us better riders and more knowledgeable about cycling. It's the off-topic stuff (that have spun out of the serious stuff) that has made us friends. Threads born from this section is why we meet at the pub and all are welcome to do so, why we have SCR X-mas parties, why there has been at least one group weekend away to Wales and why, on occasion when its not raining, we go on social weekend rides. Finally it's why I'll be doing my first of two sportives ever and why I have completely turned my health and lifestyle around (I'm sure others have equal personal gains from this section). The Commuting section, as it is, is only a few steps away from a cycle club.

What I like about this section is that when you do have a serious question these are often met with friendly answers containing some of the most helpful information available. But the 'cake' makes this section less intimidating when asking those serious questions.

My personal view?

Leave it alone.

+1

Very well said DDD

Commuting is the one place on the site where what type of bike you chose to ride is not important - we've roadies, fixie'ers, ss'ers, mtbers, hybrid'ers, even crossers :shock: all here linked by the fact we chose to commute to work on our bike.

Cycling is changing, its becoming less about knowing your gear ratio or how many inches of travel you have (mtb dirty chat), and this forum really reflects that change

+ another 1.

supersonic

The reason why people post off topic threads in this section is because they want their friends they've made in this section to participate.

There is a definite sense of community, but it can look cliquey to a newcomer.

Kiblams

supersonic wrote:

There is a definite sense of community, but it can look cliquey to a newcomer.

Yeah It's a 'cliquey-ness' of this forum that stopped me from posting for a long time, I also found I my posts were being ignored while regulars discussed 'in-jokes' (but then this happens in the MTB forum too if I am honest)

The great thing about the MTB and road sections IMO is that by confining the cliquey behaviour to one place where they can discuss OT all they like; the forums with specific purposes are more welcoming from an 'ask a question' point of view. I just thought that the commuters might benefit from a similar structure is all...

OldSkoolKona

Is it cliquey? Sorry, if it comes across that way, I don't think its intentional. Here, come and have a big Commuter Thread big hug.

I often say hi to noobies who post hello 8)

And there are in jokes? I really am as slow in the interweb world as I am in reality as I've missed them. Oh well

lost_in_thought

If it comes across as clique-y it's certainly not intentional.

I guess part of the 'problem' is that a lot of people have made some good friends on here, so there are bound to be in-jokes and such silliness.

I reckon the answer is to get involved, I mean, barely anybody who posts on here knew anybody else who posts on here before they started.

Does that make any sense? I don't know, it's 7:15pm and I'm still in an office for some reason.

Gazzaputt

supersonic wrote:

The reason why people post off topic threads in this section is because they want their friends they've made in this section to participate.

There is a definite sense of community, but it can look cliquey to a newcomer.

I'm an old timer here and it is cliquey there is no getting away from that.

TBH I got tired of the ridiculous posts about scalping 'roadies' etc. A lot of labelling done here of types of cyclists and what seems looking down noses.

Shame it used to be ok. Some of chest thumping posted is laughable now. I've gone to road forums as I'm an experienced 'roadie' I find posts a little more in keeping with what i want to read.

Of course this is imo.

DonDaddyD

Is the solution for us not to be friends?

It was bound to happen that this section, any section on this site after given period of time is going to have friendships form and to an outsider that will appear "cliquey". Hell it appears cliquey to me at times and yes that's the downside of a successful forums, people get to know each other. I feel the same way, (that it feels cliquey) when I post in Cake stop and other sections on the forum.

Of this section I will say this, it is friendly and all welcoming. The all inclusion X-mas party and the once 30rider deep social ride (though numbers dwindled due to rain) is proof of that. Both of those things are arguably off-topic but intricately tied to this sections. Those threads would have no place in the cake stop, road, commuting or otherwise because they were born out of threads and discussions here.

The only other thing I will say is this. If you don't like the discussions in this section, if you want more of a certain type of discussion instead of forcing people to discuss what you want to discuss, how about making a thread or two and see where that takes you. It is a discussion forum after all.

rolf_f

More than most forums it has a good excuse for cliquiness - ultimately, if you aren't part of the London commuter scene you probably are a bit out of it. It feels to me like the forum is evenly split between London and 'everywhere else' and the London crowd have more to talk about and relate to amongst themselves, and more opportunities to meet up than 'everywhere else'. It's just down to numbers. In my case, there just aren't many cyclists on my routes in to Leeds.

But it is pretty cliquey!

Agent57

There are the in-jokes that newcomers (or outsiders if you prefer) won't get (such as the CX capes). But it doesn't take long to pick up on the in-jokes, and as for the social groups, well it sucks that I'm not able to take part in the London fun, for example, but as far as I've found, no one's outwardly unwelcoming to anyone, regardless of where they're based. There is a sizeable London bias, but that's a side effect of the relatively large number of London-based commuters.

Doesn't seem any different from any other long-standing forum, and I don't think there's anything broken that needs fixing.

Kiblams

I just thought that it was odd that people have to put OT at the beginning of the thread titles is all, seemed to me that a commuting OT forum was missing due to this.

That is all

Agent57

Well I think [OT] is fine. It's courteous, and means that those people who do only want to read commuting threads can avoid all the other stuff.

I prefer it all in once place though, mainly because I already check far too many forums, and don't want to add yet more.

Stone Glider

If there is a cliquey feel to this forum and there is, it did not serve to discourage me from participating. BR is the only forum I contribute to. I read Commuting General for a while before joining in despite not fitting the profile or, indeed the demographic. There is a certain heirarchy typical of any social arrangement but it doesn't feel exclusive, the in-jokes are fairly overt (or have I missed them?), I feel comfortable posting.

The relaxed approach of the main participants colours the threads to make them easy to enjoy. There is plenty of interest over the weeks, a broad church. It ain't broke, don't fix it!

supersonic

Seems to be quite a split on this!

We have changed other parts around in the past, especially the MTB forum, and it usually ends up being a better experience for users.

Maybe it does need splitting into a more OT section, with a general that sticks to themes and issues associated with commuting, with the OT serving the more social topics and fun? We have the workshop section... It is a busy forum.

linsen

I think the whole point of the commuting forum is that it is a very wide range of people - from those who are totally obsessed with two wheeled objects to those who "happen" to cycle to work.

For a long time I was neither of the above, and nothing in between either, and I still felt very welcome.

If you come and read the commuting thread you will have to pick your way through a fair amount of stuff you may not want to read, but I don't think changing the headings is going to help - this lot could make the TdF go off course.

Crapaud

Agent57 wrote:

... prefer it all in once place though, mainly because I already check far too many forums, and don't want to add yet more.

Why not just have one thread then?

I, too, prefer everything in one place. That way I can find the info / things which interest me quickly and easily. If I was looking for something on sportives I'd check out the 'Road Rides, Sportives and Audax' board. The last place I'd consider would be Commuting yet that might just be where what I'm searching for is.

The idea of a Commuting community is bogus. The community, IMO, is the cycling community, ie all the forums in their entirety. Commuting is mearly a subset. By having threads on sportives, for example, in Commuting are you getting the best info on the subject by relying on folk with knowlege and experience dropping by? I'd suggest not. By limiting themselves to Commuting a poster isn't getting the full benefit of the forums. Likewise, by having a mess of OT and duplicate threads it doesn't entice many - or at least some - to come into Commuting. I'd contend that the forums and the user 'experience' is diminished for all.

Perhaps the only change needed is to change the title of the board from Commuting to something that more accurately reflects the posting activity here.

supersonic

Many would argue that off road commuting is more MTB, on road commuting is simply road riding.

cjcp

Crapaud wrote:

By having threads on sportives, for example, in Commuting are you getting the best info on the subject by relying on folk with knowlege and experience dropping by? I'd suggest not. By limiting themselves to Commuting a poster isn't getting the full benefit of the forums.

I don't think the idea of a Sportive thread in the Commuting section is to replace the Sportive and Audax board, but just to find out who from Commuting is doing what event - it helps if people are looking to share lifts, accommodation and what not.

tailwindhome

I raised this several month ago and the poll included was pretty one sided

http://www.bikeradar.com/forum/viewtopi ... g+cakestop

Though the thread did go off topic in that beautiful commuting style


I largely agree with what DDD wrote earlier. Though I do think a cake stop style area within the commuting for threads which bear no relation to cycling (eg Which Phone Should I buy,Today I shall mostly be eating.., Guilty Pleasures etc) might be an improvement.

The threads on social rides, sportives, stats etc would stay within the commuting area which I would rename to reflect what it really is - 'Commuting and Leisure Cycling'

By having threads on sportives, for example, in Commuting are you getting the best info on the subject by relying on folk with knowlege and experience dropping by

The other side to this is that we can discuss the TDF without it descending into a screaming match.

cjcp

WheezyMcChubby wrote:

The other side to this is that we can discuss the TDF without it descending into a screaming match.

Four months and counting! Hurrah!

Oh, here we go OT again.

itboffin

Hold it there matey me laddie "today i will be mostly eating" is very much a part of cycle commuting, what you eat is invaluable to how you perform and recover okay so a lot of mine involves curry and beer :roll:

jonginge

cjcp wrote:

WheezyMcChubby wrote:

The other side to this is that we can discuss the TDF without it descending into a screaming match.

Four months and counting! Hurrah!

Oh, here we go OT again.

But it's four months and counting to a certain sportive, too *gibber*

redddraggon

whyamihere wrote:

Agent57 wrote:

whyamihere wrote:

Not a feasible idea either.

Why isn't it feasible? From a technical point of view, I don't see any difficulty with it. Might take a little bit of PHP hackery, but that's about it.

PHP hackery's off the cards.

Off the card's because no one has the technical ability probably.

This is the poorest coded website I use. The other forums I use are run by amateurs and screw up far less than this place. If I was Future I'd be wanting my money back from who ever built this site.

Bikequin

As a fairly new poster to the forum and someone who is reasonably new to taking cycling seriously - have to say I really like the commuting forum. I've found almost everyone to be friendly and certainly very helpful.

Whilst commuting is obviously the glue that holds this part of the forum together and provides common ground for everyone who posts this is not where the range of topics need to or indeed do stop. I've managed to gain some really good advice about a wide range of cycling issues that has helped me enormously - yes I could have searched elsewhere on the forums for these but as others have said I don't have time to read several forums.

Basically its another +1 for what DDD wrote.

DonDaddyD

supersonic wrote:

Seems to be quite a split on this!.

how did you come to that conclusion? Yes the forum is cliquey, the entire forum is. Regular posters become more familar and more friendly with each other.

The whole point, the whole reason this section is so successful is because we can go offtopic within the section and that has allowed us to get to know each other above and beyond commuting, hence the social rides and other get togethers.

Yes you have a workshop section, people still post workshop questions here.

Also, it's telling that the people who post in this section regularly are happy with it and the people who don't are calling for change. Thing is have those calling for change actually tried to engage with the section or are they the type to het disgruntled with topics others have written?

Crapaud

cjcp wrote:

Crapaud wrote:

By having threads on sportives, for example, in Commuting are you getting the best info on the subject by relying on folk with knowlege and experience dropping by? I'd suggest not. By limiting themselves to Commuting a poster isn't getting the full benefit of the forums.

I don't think the idea of a Sportive thread in the Commuting section is to replace the Sportive and Audax board, but just to find out who from Commuting is doing what event - it helps if people are looking to share lifts, accommodation and what not.

I had a shifty earlier and that's not what I saw (can't find them now ).

I could have used Campaign instead - there're plenty of threads that would fit there. If there's a case for a cake stop there's a case for a commuting campaign, rides and sportives (we'll keep audax, thanks), training etc. In fact, why not just recreate Road without the bits you don't want. More boards, I feel, would be more fractious and further dilute the pool of experience. If the existing boards were used as intended everyone would benefit.

DonDaddyD

Crapaud wrote:

I, too, prefer everything in one place. That way I can find the info / things which interest me quickly and easily. If I was looking for something on sportives I'd check out the 'Road Rides, Sportives and Audax' board. The last place I'd consider would be Commuting yet that might just be where what I'm searching for is.

I would because I want to know who in this section is partcipating in what sportives. This could be for accomodation or logistic reasons, which I would then PM the person about.

The idea of a Commuting community is bogus. The community, IMO, is the cycling community, ie all the forums in their entirety.

Couldn't disagree more. I have to ask, have you been to any of the real world meet ups or taken part in the banter in this section? If not, then you wouldn't have a sense of the community in this section would you?

supersonic

Also, it's telling that the people who post in this section regularly are happy with it and the people who don't are calling for change

How did you come to that conclusion?!

If the subject is raised, and people are agreeing with it, then it will be looked into. I, (we) will not change things without discussion, and we are not just going to close the thread - so discuss away!

Crapaud

DonDaddyD wrote:

... Couldn't disagree more. I have to ask, have you been to any of the real world meet ups...

No, to the best of my knowlege there haven't been any near me. Have you been to any up here? And what's the relevance? The forum's on-line.

DonDaddyD wrote:

... ... or taken part in the banter in this section? If not, then you wouldn't have a sense of the community in this section would you?

Yes.

DonDaddyD

supersonic wrote:

Also, it's telling that the people who post in this section regularly are happy with it and the people who don't are calling for change

How did you come to that conclusion?!

If the subject is raised, and people are agreeing with it, then it will be looked into. I, (we) will not change things without discussion, and we are not just going to close the thread - so discuss away!

and what of those that are disagreeing with it?

I'm not asking for the thread to close, I'm offering an observation of someone who posts here hourly. What I can tell is that the people I see here every day, who have met up in the real world organised from threads in this section are happy with it as it is. That's all.