Coming here giving us jobs!

Pross
Pross Posts: 43,463
edited February 2010 in The bottom bracket
Interesting report that a Halal meet company hopes to open a super factory in South Wales bringing 3,000 much needed jobs to the area. Sort of flies in the face of the foreigners coming here taking our jobs. Mind you, there are now those going on about the 'barbaric' practices in Halal slaughter so there's always something to blame 'them' for :wink:

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/cardiffonline/cardiff-news/2010/02/17/3000-jobs-hope-for-wales-91466-25850131/
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Comments

  • blackpanther
    blackpanther Posts: 221
    Good stuff eh im all for investment, even if those people are paid for under a welsh dvelopment agency grant.
  • rake
    rake Posts: 3,204
    for your information it was illegal for us to slaughter animals this way. so why change now?
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,463
    Thought Mr Walker may be first to comment :lol:
  • softlad
    softlad Posts: 3,513
    I would treat any 'job creation' claims by the Welsh Assembly with a large pinch of salt, if I were you.

    Using their formula, 3,000 jobs will probably turn out to be less than 30. They once said they were going to create 200 jobs in an investment project up this way - I think the true number was between 2-3 at best.
  • markyboy2005
    markyboy2005 Posts: 465
    rake wrote:
    for your information it was illegal for us to slaughter animals this way. so why change now?

    Fair comment.

    I did not realise that Halal slaughter was illegal in the UK, but if it is, how does a Halal slaughter house plan to get round that?

    Any clues?
  • rake
    rake Posts: 3,204
    the law seems to have been changed to suit .
  • Pross
    Pross Posts: 43,463
    softlad wrote:
    I would treat any 'job creation' claims by the Welsh Assembly with a large pinch of salt, if I were you.

    Using their formula, 3,000 jobs will probably turn out to be less than 30. They once said they were going to create 200 jobs in an investment project up this way - I think the true number was between 2-3 at best.

    I know what you mean, I worked on the construction of the LG factory that was going to provide 8,000 jobs from memory. The access road alone cost in excess of £8m and one of the two factories was never used!
  • rake
    rake Posts: 3,204
    they dont eat pork, so where would the pork butchers be, pork chops, ham and bacon sandwiches and fry ups would all be out. i think they have the market cornered as there used to be no demand and no legal grounds to do this.
  • markyboy2005
    markyboy2005 Posts: 465
    rake wrote:
    the law seems to have been changed to suit .

    I see.

    When was Halal slaughter banned in UK? I had a quick google search and could only find some stories about it being debated in 2003.

    Hard to understand why a law would be changed just for this business to open.
  • rake
    rake Posts: 3,204
    it wasnt for this business to open. im a bit sketchy on the full details but not specifically halalal meat illegal but to bleed an animal to death while it is still fully consious and awake, its barbaric to the animals. it can sometimes take a few minutes twitching and thrashing about before it dies. it used to be thought unacceptable.
  • Westerberg
    Westerberg Posts: 652
    rake wrote:
    it wasnt for this business to open. im a bit sketchy on the full details but not specifically halalal meat illegal but to bleed an animal to death while it is still fully consious and awake, its barbaric to the animals. it can sometimes take a few minutes twitching and thrashing about before it dies. it used to be thought unacceptable.

    I expect you scrutinise your meat product purchases to make sure the animal has been both reared and killed in an acceptable way? Whilst I don't condone the processes involved in producing Halal meat, it would be hypocritical not to balance this with condemnation of the way meat is often brought to my table. Have you seen a UK abbatoir recently??!!
  • softlad
    softlad Posts: 3,513
    A fiver says this thread will go beyond 5 pages.....

    place your bets now....
  • Westerberg
    Westerberg Posts: 652
    agreed. it's classic walkerfodder™
  • rake
    rake Posts: 3,204
    theres always some kind of counter argument comes along. this is a large step backwards. do you justify everything with its ok to digress because everythings not perfect yet. please expand on what you have seen in slaughterhouses these days.
  • Westerberg
    Westerberg Posts: 652
    rake wrote:
    theres always some kind of counter argument comes along. this is a large step backwards.
    oh yes, differences of opinion and the free expression thereof - a major step backwards :roll:

    FYI - I used to investigate injuries and have seen many an Abbatoir accident book. Quite an eye opener.
  • Heckler1974
    Heckler1974 Posts: 479
    Kosher and Halal are similar methods of dispatch with a single cut with a very sharp knife but Halal in the stricter fatwas can only be performed by a Muslim who invokes the name of Allah before performing the cut (or dedicates the animal to Allah, I can't recall which).
  • rake
    rake Posts: 3,204
    edited February 2010
    Westerberg wrote:
    rake wrote:
    theres always some kind of counter argument comes along. this is a large step backwards.
    oh yes, differences of opinion and the free expression thereof - a major step backwards :roll:

    FYI - I used to investigate injuries and have seen many an Abbatoir accident book. Quite an eye opener.
    you misread my post and i failed to make it clear. the step backwards was referring to the barbaric slaughter not peoples right to a view.by counter argument i meant deviating from the issue just to sling mud back. :wink: were the accidents of a human kind? what do you think about halal.
  • PBo
    PBo Posts: 2,493
    Heckler1974 wrote:
    Kosher and Halal are similar methods of dispatch with a single cut with a very sharp knife but Halal in the stricter fatwas can only be performed by a Muslim who invokes the name of Allah before performing the cut (or dedicates the animal to Allah, I can't recall which).

    there was a consultation last year http://www.defra.gov.uk/corporate/consult/slaughter/index.htm

    looking at adopting an eu reg about stunning animals at slaughter.....so the issue of whether you can stun first in a religious slaughter will end up being key....
  • blackpanther
    blackpanther Posts: 221
    Westerberg wrote:
    rake wrote:
    theres always some kind of counter argument comes along. this is a large step backwards.
    oh yes, differences of opinion and the free expression thereof - a major step backwards :roll:

    FYI - I used to investigate injuries and have seen many an Abbatoir accident book. Quite an eye opener.

    Pity you never had one yourself.

    Word
  • Heckler1974
    Heckler1974 Posts: 479
    blackpanther wrote:
    Pity you never had one yourself.

    Word

    Steady on.....
  • deptfordmarmoset
    deptfordmarmoset Posts: 3,118
    blackpanther wrote:
    Westerberg wrote:
    rake wrote:
    theres always some kind of counter argument comes along. this is a large step backwards.
    oh yes, differences of opinion and the free expression thereof - a major step backwards :roll:

    FYI - I used to investigate injuries and have seen many an Abbatoir accident book. Quite an eye opener.

    Pity you never had one yourself.

    Word

    I'm using a spreadsheet to count the number of times you finish your messages with ''Word''


    Excel :wink:
    Looking for a cycling buddy?
  • rake
    rake Posts: 3,204
    who is that too about the accident.
  • cee
    cee Posts: 4,553
    I had Halal chicken for lunch today...

    it was yummy...........

    I would like to see a side by side comparison of a Halal butchered animal and a standard uk butchered animal...

    I reckon most folks would not like the reality of either....
    Whenever I see an adult on a bicycle, I believe in the future of the human race.

    H.G. Wells.
  • rake
    rake Posts: 3,204
    seeing as its no logistically possible for us to eat as vegetarians theres not much choice. at least try and make it the best you can.
  • blackpanther
    blackpanther Posts: 221
    rake wrote:
    who is that too about the accident.

    westerberg :)


    Word brother
  • blackpanther
    blackpanther Posts: 221
    deptfordmarmoset wrote:
    blackpanther wrote:
    Westerberg wrote:
    rake wrote:
    theres always some kind of counter argument comes along. this is a large step backwards.
    oh yes, differences of opinion and the free expression thereof - a major step backwards :roll:

    FYI - I used to investigate injuries and have seen many an Abbatoir accident book. Quite an eye opener.

    Pity you never had one yourself.

    Word

    I'm using a spreadsheet to count the number of times you finish your messages with ''Word''


    Excel :wink:

    Put a colum in for




    CHURCH :)
  • Heckler1974
    Heckler1974 Posts: 479
    rake wrote:
    seeing as its no logistically possible for us to eat as vegetarians theres not much choice. at least try and make it the best you can.

    Sorry I read that as not logistically possible for us to eat vegetarians.... :shock:

    They might be a bit scrawny but the logistics could be worked out...... :D
  • Westerberg
    Westerberg Posts: 652
    I would be more prepared to accept an anti-halal argument from
    a. A vegetarian or
    b. Someone who researches where there own meat comes from

    I fall into neither category as I am too lazy and don't have the moral conviction to find out about the meat I buy. Humans treat animals barbarically - muslim or non-muslim. I doubt the animals in many non-halal slaughterhouses fare much better once the inspectors have gone. Though I am not sticking up for Halal meat - agreed it's barbaric.
  • rake
    rake Posts: 3,204
    how do vegetarians have crediblity. if we were all vegetarian there would be massive food shortages, not enough land to grow the food. far more expensive to cultivate.
  • Heckler1974
    Heckler1974 Posts: 479
    rake wrote:
    how do vegetarians have crediblity. if we were all vegetarian there would be massive food shortages, not enough land to grow the food. far more expensive to cultivate.

    It's the gas and general air of smugness I couldn't stand.

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