New SPDs, perhaps not the best for technical trails?
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my eye.
lost the other one when you first posted that"Do not follow where the path may lead, Go instead where there is no path, and Leave a Trail."
Parktools :?:SheldonBrown0 -
It always amazes me the enternal debates that go on about this.
Its well established for longer riding SPDs make sense as they improve effiency (I ride flats (always) and I appreciate this), however, when things get technical (and technical off road is something that research is going to find very difficult to measure) it is also safe to say that the natural feel of flats is beneficial to confidence and control that can make you faster than having a little extra power.
So ultimately its down to personal preferance and rider style and if your riding varied off road mountain biking trails with technical bits - go with what your comfortable with and you'll probably go faster with whatever pedals that might be.
Or am I just being nievely simple?!Lapierre Spicy 516 XTR custom (2013) -http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=10017&t=129323320 -
Nope, you're spot on.
Mountainbikers are naively simple. We're grown men who ride bicycles in the mud.0 -
If only my fork lowers were black, the illusion would have been complete...0
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Steve Peat will often change from a flats to an SPD and visa versa.
Is he wrong to do so?
Should he be riding exclusively on Flats or SPDs?
Of course not it comes down to the type of terrain your dealing with.
Just out of interest the UCI have took it upon themselves to ban SPDs for 2010.
The reason given is that......................... The decision is aimed at improving the credibility of DH riding to a wider market by differentiating it even more from the XC, Road and Track cycling disciplines.
Errr.................... like its really difficult to tell them apart?0 -
Dirtydog11 wrote:Just out of interest the UCI have took it upon themselves to ban SPDs for 2010.
The reason given is that......................... The decision is aimed at improving the credibility of DH riding to a wider market by differentiating it even more from the XC, Road and Track cycling disciplines.
Errr.................... like its really difficult to tell them apart?
Did you read that on Pinkbike? Did you check the date of the article? Want to go check it again?
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Alex wrote:Dirtydog11 wrote:Just out of interest the UCI have took it upon themselves to ban SPDs for 2010.
The reason given is that......................... The decision is aimed at improving the credibility of DH riding to a wider market by differentiating it even more from the XC, Road and Track cycling disciplines.
Errr.................... like its really difficult to tell them apart?
Did you read that on Pinkbike? Did you check the date of the article? Want to go check it again?
Yes mate the article was 2009 but its the first Ive heard about SPDs being banned for 2010.0 -
Alex wrote:Mountainbikers are naively simple. We're grown men who ride bicycles in the mud.
Spot on. The efficiency argument makes me laugh a little sometimes, like, a while back we had a big chat on chains vs belts and people kept saying "It's more efficient". You're riding up a mountain on a 30lb 5 inch travel trail bike with tyres that'd look more at home on a motorbike, and you want to talk about efficiency? Mountain biking's all about inefficiency! I mean, I took a perfectly good chairlift up a mountain then I rode a child's toy back down? Madness! When there's a perfectly good chairlift!Uncompromising extremist0 -
Dirtydog11 wrote:
Yes mate the article was 2009 but its the first Ive heard about SPDs being banned for 2010.Alex wrote:
Did you read that on Pinkbike? Did you check the date of the article? Want to go check it again?Dirtydog11 wrote:Just out of interest the UCI have took it upon themselves to ban SPDs for 2010.
http://www.pinkbike.com/news/spd-ban-2009.html
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Oh f**ck. So thats what was so funny. Anyway it doesn't count cos its November.LOL brilliant
Well at least the debate ended on a light note. 0 -
hehe! I love how you've zoomed in, and IN, and IN just to prove the point!0
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classic what are brakes for again0
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Alex the 8sec study is kinda pointless, peak power doesn't really come into riding more than maybe once or twice, particularly if you're not techincally adept,
(that isn't an accusation for you, or all spd riders, merely poor technical riders often will use huge boosts of power to clear obstacles that better riders can ride without that energy outlay)
a ride. It isn't sustainable power which is interesting. The peak power will obviously be higher, but that has effectively no real world effect.
As for not spinning, i ride with a guy on flats who spins at about 120 rpm (guesstimate, but it's very very very fast, will count properly next time) and I can get pretty high. It's a case of practice.0 -
Am I missing something, or did the article Alex linked to look at the difference between pedals with toe-clips, and pedals without toe clips? By pedals without toe clips, does it mean SPDs or flats?
If it means SPDs, then it shows that SPDs might be better than 'flats with toe-clips' (but who rides with toe clips!?).
If by 'clip-less' it means 'flats with no clips', then isn't it comparing flat pedals with and without toe clips, and found the pedals without clips were better?
Its the use of the word 'clip-less' that's confusing, to us that means SPDs, but literally it means 'without clips', and seeing as it explicitly states it's comparing pedals with clips to pedals without clips, it could almost read that not being attached to the bike is better.0 -
flats are for fannys end of0
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i like hanging out of fannys but i wouldnt want to be one0
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rapid_uphill wrote:i like hanging out of fannys but i wouldnt want to be one
Right....
So hopefully rapid_uphill's carer has taken the keyboard off him by now, does anyone know exactly what that study was comparing, or would you have to buy it to find out? I'm not saying it wasn't SPDs vs Flats, it just seems a bit unclear.0 -
I think clipless pedals mean SPDs
but if the study was a comparrison of SPDs against pedals with toe clips then it is pretty much pointless.
Flat pedals are quite different to pedals with toe clips.
I also don't think there is much point comparing the power transfer anyway - flats aren't best at power transfer they are best for DH or jumps or something...Not really active0 -
Northwind wrote:I was trying- and failing- to find the 2 studies which indicated that you don't add power with the upstroke- instead, all you do is unweight the back pedal and remove a power loss, but none of the athletes in the test added power with the upstroke.
You might not when just spinning along, but I have pulled up enough to unclip an spd on the upstoke on a few occasions, pretty sure that isn't just unweighting.0 -
I think in a normal situation say, riding up a fire road you probably don't pull up on the SPD. I know I don't. It's only when it gets technical that I pull up, then you get a boost of power to get over things but pulling up all the time just feels unnatural.Not really active0
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To be honest, I wish I could somehow run both effectively!
I spend about 50% of my ride on a mixture of flowy and techy trail. When it's muddy and wet and I hit a rockfest, i'm torn between whether I prefer having my feet secured and not flailing all over the place, or whether I prefer having the ability to get my foot out/down as required.
I've ridden the same trails with both flats and SPDs and it's almost impossible to choose the most comfortable/efficient for me.
However, the other 50% of my ride I tend to spend doing more stop/start playing around, like drop offs, stupidly steep sections, natural kickers, gaps, stairs, walls etc etc.
I certainly DON'T like using SPDs for that. Nothing worse than riding to the end of a 6" wide and 5ft high wall ready to jump off and you lose your balance slightly with SPDs on :shock: Bye bye elbows and shoulders!
I like small kickers on SPDs, but it's just waaayyyyy to risky on the bigger stuff. I like being able to dump my bike if need be.
So for that reason, I find that I am almost forced to ride flats in order to be able to ride all of the stuff I want to comfortably. I used massive B54's with the pins pulled out by about 1cm!!!! They have a huge, grippy platform and I rarely lose my footing.
However, now that we are in the grip of winter proper, I do find my feet flailing around more on the trail and am debating sticking SPDs back on until things dry up a bit.
I pedal more efficiently with SPDs, but I'm probably quicker overall with flats, simply because I need to get my feet down a lot and if I can't I need to srub speed before the corner etc. (I tend to ride in rooty, rocky areas, infested with mud and wetness , so my feet or my entire body tend to be on the deck a lot!) 0 -
It really depends on your experience with SPDs as to whether to use them all the time.
I understand that some people feel more confidence on flats, being able to get your foot out quickly on a corner or dumping your bike mid air or simply riding up to a jump and having your feet in the right place without having to find the SPD first.
However, it is possible to do all this with SPDs.
I always, no matter what, can get my foot out on a corner for balance. I can always ditch the bike in midair if I have to and I (almost) always find the SPD first time if approaching a jump.
It just takes a hell of a long time to get there.
I have several mates who are now freeriding and downhilling on SPDs because they simply have more control on the sketchy sections. I also have more mates who are trying SPDs out for DH because of this.
Like I said, it takes time and I wouldn't recommend that a beginner use SPDs on a sketchy section of trail but it can be done, and unlocking this potential can be very rewarding...Not really active0 -
Personally I can't use SDPs due to a dodgy ankle, however a decent pair of shoes/flats makes a MASSIVE difference from a cheap set-up - just got a pair of five-ten impacts and thought my skate shoes were fine, the new ones are incredible!!
However my opinion might not mean much, I also ride a Marin.......
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