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Hardknot Pass

Percy VeraPercy Vera Posts: 1,103
edited September 2009 in Training, fitness and health
Is it possible to get up Hardknot Pass on a 39x23?
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Posts

  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    edited August 2009
    If you are strong enough yea. Judging by the max 30% sign it'd be very very hard for most.
  • amaferangaamaferanga Posts: 6,789
    For my grandmother, no. For me, yes. For you, maybe.
    More problems but still living....
  • inseineinseine Posts: 5,785
    It's clearly possible to do the Alp d'huez in under 40mins, but that doesn't help most of us.
    Nobodies gonna enjoy it on that gear especially if you want to do Wrynose as well.
  • Percy VeraPercy Vera Posts: 1,103
    What about your grandmother when she was younger?

    Thanks.
    Just wanted to know as I might go for a ride up there over the next couple of months and that will be (I've yet to take delivery of my iron horse) my lowest gear.
  • inseineinseine Posts: 5,785
    Well, if you've got a couple of months to do it you'll be fine ;)
  • amaferangaamaferanga Posts: 6,789
    I make that a moving average of about 0.002km/h.....
    More problems but still living....
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    I think I could do it, but I can't help but think grinding along in that might be bad for allot of peoples knees, unless uber strong.

    I'd put on a 12-27 cassette.
  • Percy VeraPercy Vera Posts: 1,103
    inseine wrote:
    Well, if you've got a couple of months to do it you'll be fine ;)

    Great! I'll wait for you at the top! :lol:
  • DaveyLDaveyL Posts: 5,167
    39x23 at 60 rpm is 8.2 mph. At 40 rpm it's 5.4 mph.

    Good luck with that...
    Le Blaireau (1)
  • Percy VeraPercy Vera Posts: 1,103
    Judging from the gradient I doubt very much I'll be anywhere near 40rpm
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    Then I'd get a different cassette so you can go faster than 3mph.
  • dodgydodgy Posts: 2,890
    Up Hardknott from which direction? I couldn't get up on a 39 x 23 anyway, lots of different abilities / weights on here.
  • BhimaBhima Posts: 2,145
    edited August 2009
    Assuming you + bike = 80kg, wind is "normal" and the road surface is average. On the 30% bits:

    39 x 23 x 40 RPM = 5.3 mph / 566.7 Watts = Ouch
    39 x 23 x 60 RPM = 8 mph / 861.2 Watts = Ridiculous effort
    39 x 23 x 90 RPM = 11.9 mph / 1295.8 Watts = Insane sprint effort

    Good luck with that.
  • bobtbuilderbobtbuilder Posts: 1,537
    I did Hardknott on a 39x23 many years ago. A pretty unpleasant experience.

    I wouldn't tackle it now without my trusty compact. :)
  • Percy VeraPercy Vera Posts: 1,103
    freehub wrote:
    Then I'd get a different cassette so you can go faster than 3mph.

    I wouldn't necessarily want to go faster on the steepest parts (unless I was in a race) - I would treat it as a good leg strength workout.

    I am not going to buy a new cassette to climb a few hills on a particular day.
    I will let you know if/when I go how I get on.

    I understand there are a lot of variables and that it was a very broad question, but if you all had have come back with the reply, no way, it can't be done then I would even attempt it; but because some have I now know it is possible. As I have never been its hard for me to know what to expect even looking at photos.

    I don't know what side either - what do you recommend? I think I read somewhere Dave Lloyd has a Sportive round there - I see if I can find the route.

    Thanks for all your replies
  • dodgydodgy Posts: 2,890
    East to West is the usual Hardknott direction, taking Wrynose first. Wrynose is enough of a challenge in its own right. I'll be doing it next week (34 x 26).
  • freehubfreehub Posts: 4,257
    Percy Vera wrote:
    freehub wrote:
    Then I'd get a different cassette so you can go faster than 3mph.

    I wouldn't necessarily want to go faster on the steepest parts (unless I was in a race) - I would treat it as a good leg strength workout.

    I am not going to buy a new cassette to climb a few hills on a particular day.
    I will let you know if/when I go how I get on.

    I understand there are a lot of variables and that it was a very broad question, but if you all had have come back with the reply, no way, it can't be done then I would even attempt it; but because some have I now know it is possible. As I have never been its hard for me to know what to expect even looking at photos.

    I don't know what side either - what do you recommend? I think I read somewhere Dave Lloyd has a Sportive round there - I see if I can find the route.

    Thanks for all your replies

    Well I'd hate to be grinding up a hill, out of breat sweating buckets, legs burning, 3mph, feeling sick, swearing under my breath at what a ******* of a hill this has turned out to be.

    I think there was a dave Lloyd sportive, 145 miles, 16,000ft of climbing :shock:, even with energy drinks and all that I'd not be able to do that, maybe when I'm older.
  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,667
    Honest opinion?

    I reckon only 5-10% of the cyclists here in the UK would get up that on that gear....and even then it would be a horrible experience.

    Even the top pro's wouldn't use such a heavy gear for a climb like this...have you seen it?...if not your maybe thinking only 2kms ascending 300meters....but when you clap eyes on it, it beggars believe! and it looks horrendous...and it is?....do your knee caps a favour and get a lower gear.
  • amaferangaamaferanga Posts: 6,789
    Worst case is the OP walks for a few hundred metres up the steepest bits. I don't think I'd spend £30 plus on a new cassette just to avoid that.

    Hills like Hardknott and Wrynose are never going to be enjoyable unless you have mountainbike gearing....
    More problems but still living....
  • dodgydodgy Posts: 2,890
    amaferanga wrote:
    Worst case is the OP walks for a few hundred metres up the steepest bits. I don't think I'd spend £30 plus on a new cassette just to avoid that.
    .

    Or he could be spending £30 on new cleats :lol: Seriously though, it raises an interesting point. I reckon cleat covers might be useful if you're out geared by Hardknott / Wrynose.
  • maddog 2maddog 2 Posts: 8,114
    a mate did it on 39-27, which impressed the hell out of me (on the FWC)

    39-23 is right on the very edge of doable IMO. Somebody may be able to, but no one I know.
    Facts are meaningless, you can use facts to prove anything that's remotely true! - Homer
  • gazza_d1gazza_d1 Posts: 53
    maybe on a 23-39 possibly.

    It's a absolute pig of a climb though. Many years ago I watched the Kellogs tour climb Rosedale Chimney in the Yorkshire moors. Similar grade at 1 in 3, but slightly easier (ridden both) and a lot of the Pros got off and pushed their bikes!

    One more thing - don't do it shortly after a cake stop!!
  • AidanRAidanR Posts: 1,142
    I've only been up it once, on my touring bike (not loaded!), and it was fine. Of course the touring gearing of 30-27 helped somewhat ;)
    Bike lover and part-time cyclist.
  • andy162andy162 Posts: 634
    I went up Rosedale on 39/25 the other week. Was a censored tho. That's the lowest gear I've got but standing on the pedals honking up silly gradients is what I like to do I guess!

    Some of the Planet X boys big ring it up the Chimney....53/27! I kid you not!

    So back on thread... I would say doable, but by the sounds of it done only as a self challenge & not pleasurable at all.

    Also lest we forget it's down to the individual. I'm a rake with high vo2 and a good watts output. My mate has a lower output but spins up on a 34/25 on a 33% with no bother...horses for courses I guess.

    Give it a go, nowt to lose.
  • dodgydodgy Posts: 2,890
    andy162 wrote:
    I
    Some of the Planet X boys big ring it up the Chimney....53/27! I kid you not!

    But then I guess they get their drivetrain spares for free 8)
  • mididoctorsmididoctors Posts: 11,029
    RICHYBOYcp wrote:
    Honest opinion?

    I reckon only 5-10% of the cyclists here in the UK would get up that on that gear....and even then it would be a horrible experience.

    Even the top pro's wouldn't use such a heavy gear for a climb like this...have you seen it?...if not your maybe thinking only 2kms ascending 300meters....but when you clap eyes on it, it beggars believe! and it looks horrendous...and it is?....do your knee caps a favour and get a lower gear.

    +1

    i reckon less than than 5%

    a lot of talk on this thread...I suspect less than 50% of uk cyclists could get up it on any gear!
    "If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm
  • mididoctorsmididoctors Posts: 11,029
    maddog 2 wrote:
    a mate did it on 39-27, which impressed the hell out of me (on the FWC)

    39-23 is right on the very edge of doable IMO. Somebody may be able to, but no one I know.

    I ride 13-29 on a 53/39 when in the lakes which i visit half a dozen times a year

    i went out for a 25 miles short ride and ended up doing over 1500m of climbing without tackling any of the major climbs except sickle pike/kiln bank.. there is an outrageous density of horrid ramps in the lakes...

    i nearly blew a gasket on the kirby in furness to netherhouses road.. just some little side road over some nameless "low" fell
    "If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm
  • Percy VeraPercy Vera Posts: 1,103
    Now you have me unsure what to do again!!

    As amaferanga said, the worst can happen is I walk (or turn the bike around and head home) and lose my dignity (again); but I'll do it mid week when there is unlikely to be anyone around.
  • LeighBLeighB Posts: 326
    A lot depends on how many miles are in your legs when you start the climb; every time I have gone over Hardknott (from West side) I have done between 30 and 90 hilly miles. The highest gearing I have used is 40 chain ring with 28 freewheel on my winter bike. I’ve been over Hardknott & Wrynose from both sides and its bad to say which is the hardest way as every time I have gone over Wrynose first (East to West) I have covered less miles. Your level of fitness/strength will also determine what gear you can pull up these hills; if your strong and determined you will get over on a 39 x 23 but your setting yourself a tough goal. I am doing the Dave Lloyd ride in September and I will be on 36 x 28 gearing.
  • AnonymousAnonymous Posts: 79,667
    Yeah....when I see threads like this it really does make me wonder?....why would someone try and use 'pro' gearing on a climb like this?....

    Personally, Hardknott from Eskdale is my absolute nemesis, Ive been over it around 10 times....and everytime it puts me on the very edge, and I use a 30 x 27, and 90% who tackle this fearsome beast are way overgeared and fail completely, Ive did the FWC a few times and its hilarious, guys jump off the bike just after the cattle grid....and thats only 100 meters up the road and before it really kicks....you cannot compare this climb to any other in the UK....Rosedale Chimney and a few other NY Moor climbs are very steep aswell but Hardknotts like 2 of them stacked on top of each other.....and keeping that kind of strain up for such a long time is an exceptional experience.,,,its the most extreme effort Ive ever did.

    Dave Lloyd Challenge is back on for 150 riders....it tackles the famous 2 from the opposite side...and I agree with Leigh...its every bit as tough...Wrynose from Langdale is another sufferfest which will permanently stain the memory...it never lets up and gets steeper and steeper...

    Have a wee read here...hope these help...

    FWC
    http://www.sportivecentral.com/index.ph ... 310&page=1

    REVERSE
    http://www.sportivecentral.com/index.ph ... 339&page=1
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