The 'War On The Streets'

victor ludorum

This is a slightly overlong rant about something that has really gotten me worked up of late. Any insights would be more than welcome, but really I just needed to get it off my chest...

Why does everybody out on the street seem to hate everybody else? So many pedestrians seem to hate cyclists, so many cyclists seem to hate pedestrians, drivers hate cyclists, cyclists hate drivers, pedestrians hate drivers and it is reciprocated. Mini-cabs, RLJers, black cabs, people stepping into roads without looking, buses, pavement cyclists, white-vans...GAARRGGHH!!!

Why don't people seem to realise that they have responsibilities as well as rights, that they must bear a measure of responsibility for their own safety while using the roads? That if they show a little consideration, they are more likely to get a little consideration in return? That just because one individual, be they a cyclist, driver or pedestrian, has committed some offence does not mean that all cyclists, drivers or pedestrians are guilty and deserving of retribution or justified in doing likewise.

I feel ground down by the endless, and repetitive, litany of gross and petty abuses and general mean-spiritedness which people mete out to each other on a daily, hourly, basis. I'm not talking about really big acts that stem from an individual will to violence, or from gross incompetence - high-speed crashes, deaths (although I know that they on a sliding scale, and can result from minor causes). I just mean the general lack of consideration that seems to dominate the world of the commuter.

I don't want to get into blaming any one group of road users, because I think that all of the user groups must share a portion of the blame (albeit that pedestrians and cyclists are significantly more vulnerable...) but I can give an example from my own recent experience and obviously, I'm a cyclist, so my point of view is biased somewhat.

I was riding in a convoy of traffic towards some traffic lights, down the very busy Euston Road past Euston Station approaching some lights. I was in the primary position with less than a bike's length between me and the vehicle in front. The traffic lights changed to red when a minicab behind me suddenly sounded his horn because he wanted to occupy the part of the road I was in. I turned around, gave him a bemused look, looked at the static traffic, looked at the small space in front of me and shrugged my shoulders slightly.

While waiting, I could hear the minicab engine being revved and see in my peripheral vision as the cab rolled further and further forward. As the lights changed, I let the vehicle in front roll away a little so I could get a good view of the road surface (the Euston Road is in terrible condition, and I didn't want to fall down any of the potholes or the lethally wide grids that run parallel to the direction of the road) when the minicab roared up, pushed its way past and then stopped with me directly next to the passenger side window. It couldn't get any further forward than that, because I was only about six feet behind the vehicle in front of me, but evidently the minicab driver felt this was adequate for him to fit in.

Shocked, I turned and said 'What the bloody hell did you do that for?' (Really, I'm quite genteel that way) and his response was 'You shouldn't have been in the way!'.
'What do you mean I shouldn't have been in the way, there's nowhere for you to go!'.
His response was 'It's you whose going to end up in a box, behaving like that on the road.'

What in God's name makes a person willing to contemplate the possibility of killing another person simply in order to make it six feet further up a queue of standing traffic? There was nothing about him to suggest that he possessed sociopathic tendencies, or that he actually wanted me dead, but that was his justification for his actions.

But that extends to loads of other people, regardless of their mode of transport. Why?! For the love of God, why?!

If you have made it this far, thank you for your patience.

And another thing... how has the word 'cyclist' become almost inextricably linked to the word 'arrogant' in newspapers and letters pages?

George or Dick

Nothing compares to the simple pleasure of a bike ride.

el_presidente

isn't that half the fun though? like a real life version of frogger 8)

helz

Have you got any holidays booked? I think that's what you really need.

ride_whenever

Some drivers are angry because of congestion and stuff, it's daft to get stressed by these things, which is why i don't want a car at all...

victor ludorum

George or Dick wrote:

Nothing compares to the simple pleasure of a bike ride.

You got me there.

I think part of the sudden upwelling of frustration was that I was working from home yesterday, so I went for a sneaky ride in Richmond Park. The open roads, more considerate driving, the lower speed limit (but still overtaking me despite the fact that I was on, or occasionally over, the limit myself...), the sunshine and the sense of just generally doing something I enjoy contrasted with the ignorance and unpleasantness I experienced the second (the very second) I left the Sheen Gate and got back on the road proper.

graham_g

Half of what you describe there I'd just put down to living in London.

dang65

victor ludorum wrote:

Any insights would be more than welcome, but really I just needed to get it off my chest...

I think you may be seeing the glass as half empty there. There is plenty of conflict around, sure, but the vast majority of road users are considerate. They have to be if they want any chance of surviving. That's the proof to me. If everyone drove/walked/cycled like that minority of suicidal maniacs do then there would be permanent carnage on the roads. (I'm sure some would say there is carnage, but you know what I mean.)

Greg T

It is a great strangness that cars just want to be behind cars and not bikes.

Also the need to get to the next queue of traffic 3 seconds faster - you just wait three seconds more.

I was coming into Parson's Green this morning - slow bike ahead - looked behind - 50m behind blue van - out I came - took up primary + as it's narrow just under the bridge and just knew this van was going to be an arse.

Shock

The van was an arse.

Right behind me revving. When I pulled back over he came beside me and gave me the finger. I was ice cold - eyes straight ahead.

100m Down the road - he's stopped and flashing by I goes. He's a frustrated guy - he should take up a hobby and get out - cycling perhaps?


I once got cut up by a car and when I asked the guy what he was doing he said that I was dangerous.

How I was going to hurt him is in some doubt unless I crashed into him at seventy head on and came through his windscreen.

As the Black Eyed Peas say "Where is the Love?"

victor ludorum

Graham G wrote:

Half of what you describe there I'd just put down to living in London.

Ah, but it isn't just living in London...

I commute to Cambridge and its just as bad there. In fact, between the many hopeless cyclists, the oblivious pedestrians and the red-mist visioned mini-cabs its probably worse.

I've also ridden and been a ped in Bristol, there's no quarter given there and (to my mind) the drivers seem go faster than in London.]

I'm originally from Manchester, so I know what its as bad up there (guy left to die in hit and run has his legs run over by cars who can't even be bothered driving round his corpse, anybody?) I went to University in Scotland, so I have some experience of travelling by bike, foot and car in Edinburgh and Glasgow.

Before anybody suggests I'm just not used to the pressures of the Smoke, I've lived and commuted here for years. It isn't culture shock.

always_tyred

Most people hate their work.

Result - they are pi$$ed off on their way to work.

Most people spend too long at work.

Result - they are pi$$Sed off on their way home from work.

cee

I think it is because modern Britain is far too comfortable. Unemployment at an all time low, cars everywhere, we consume far more than ever, but still feel empty inside, so consume more....The media spins us into a frenzy about crime this and that (crime is actually been in steady decline over the last 5-10 years)

A couple of generations ago, the population had far more to worry about than the majority of us have ever had to.....

here endeth my tinpot sociology

Clever Pun

dang65 wrote:

victor ludorum wrote:

Any insights would be more than welcome, but really I just needed to get it off my chest...

I think you may be seeing the glass as half empty there. There is plenty of conflict around, sure, but the vast majority of road users are considerate. They have to be if they want any chance of surviving. That's the proof to me. If everyone drove/walked/cycled like that minority of suicidal maniacs do then there would be permanent carnage on the roads. (I'm sure some would say there is carnage, but you know what I mean.)

this

you remember the 1 tw@t, you forget about the loads of other cars that give you plenty of room or who wait patiently behind you

cee.. what about the kinfe crime epidemic in london a whole 14 people out of 7 millions have been stabbed and now you can shank someone on facebook... the countries going to hell in a handbasket....

going on the above about knife crime.... you have a 0.0002% chance of getting done, seriously what's the problem?

victor ludorum

dang65 wrote:

I think you may be seeing the glass as half empty there.

I can see why you might think that although, in fact, I'm actually a very glass-half-full kind of person. My cheerful optimism and good-humour are among my most annoying habits as far as other people are concerned...

But I have to point out that the 'majority' may be considerate and careful, but unfortunately they are a largely silent majority. It doesn't really matter if, out of every hundred people, 95 will pass you safely and considerately if the remaining 5 are willing to risk killing you to advance their journey by three seconds. Its the five who will stick in the memory.

In any case, what counts as selfish from the point of view of a cyclist differs very considerably to what seems selfish to a driver or a pedestrian, and there falls the shadow. It isn't necessarily willful dangerousness, just a lack of empathy.

Dunston_checks_in

It used to get to me too: 20 minor discourtesies every day and at least one attempt on your life. I know you probably know/do this already, but two things that have made a massive difference to me are:

a) Riding defensively. I reckon you can take 90% of the danger out of cycling by anticipating pinch points and imposing yourself on the road before they happen. Most drivers relax when you do this - it takes the 'shall I shan't I' decision away from them and they tend to fall in behind you. Some are volitle nutters of course as your OP demonstrates, but get round this by:

b) Zoning out. I try and treat the whole commute like an inanimate obstacle course rather than a series of confrontations with other human beings. I never make eye contact with drivers unless I want to make sure they know I'm there, and I (almost) never react to bad behaviour. Takes the emotion out of it most of the time.

I know I'm probably teaching you to suck eggs - some days it inevitably gets to all of us - but these are strategies that have helped make my commute into a pleasure most of the time (that and THE GAME of course ) rather than a stressful drawn out confrontation.

cupofteacp

It's quite simple,

People will not take responsibility for there own actions.

“I’m late to work because of everyone else, not that I left late”

“I’m stuck in traffic because there are too many cars, the fact I’m driving a car is irrelevant, how else can I get to work”

“I’m allowed to walk where I want others should watch out”

“I’m allowed to cycle where I want others should watch out”

The best advice I can give is become the "duck" or "rain drop on a window"

victor ludorum

Dunston_checks_in wrote:

It used to get to me too: 20 minor discourtesies every day and at least one attempt on your life. I know you probably know/do this already, but two things that have made a massive difference to me are:

a) Riding defensively. I reckon you can take 90% of the danger out of cycling by anticipating pinch points and imposing yourself on the road before they happen. Most drivers relax when you do this - it takes the 'shall I shan't I' decision away from them and they tend to fall in behind you. Some are volitle nutters of course as your OP demonstrates, but get round this by:

b) Zoning out. I try and treat the whole commute like an inanimate obstacle course rather than a series of confrontations with other human beings. I never make eye contact with drivers unless I want to make sure they know I'm there, and I (almost) never react to bad behaviour. Takes the emotion out of it most of the time.

I know I'm probably teaching you to suck eggs - some days it inevitably gets to all of us - but these are strategies that have helped make my commute into a pleasure most of the time (that and THE GAME of course ) rather than a stressful drawn out confrontation.

You make excellent points, especially about the importance of defensive riding. But my rant isn't just about drivers, its about all other road users.

My pregnant missus was almost wiped out by a cyclist on the pavement yesterday evening. He had all the right gear, was on a decent enough road bike, looked fit and healthy and was whizzing (I mean fast even for being on the road) along the pavement while going the wrong way up a one way street. Had I caught him I would have cheerfully torn him limb from limb (and I'm not a violent or angry person by nature).

At the next junction a guy in Dulwich Paragon shorts ran the red lights of the crossing while we were on it. He wasn't that close to us, but nevertheless...

When I've been pulled up at a red, I've had people yelling at me to get out of the way so that they can RLJ without having to slow down.

I saw an idiot trying to run up a barely foot-wide gap between a bus that was waiting at the lights and the curb, while talking on his mobile phone. Only for the lights to change and the bus to start moving. Leading to one of those unedifying start-stop bus-bike-bus-bike battle of wills ended with a swearing-fest that can stop traffic for 10 mintutes.

I'm sick of pedestrians who don't look and step into the road. I'm sick of the pedestrians who do look, see a cyclist, and step out anyway.

I'm tired of being told I shouldn't be on the road because I'm too slow (trust me, I'm not), because I don't pay road-tax (where to begin with the idiocy of that statement?), of being told that I shouldn't be on the pavement when I'm using a clearly marked cycle lane. I'm tired of people walking down a three foot wide, green painted cycle way when there's a 20 foot wide pavement immediately on the other side of the white line. I'm sick of bus and car drivers who drive right up your trumpet when you're in front, but then as soon as you let them past, crawl along using their phones or searching through their handbags/pockets, etc.

Please don't mistake this for the whinging of a Meldrew-like man. I am honestly a considerate and patient person - I am noted for it. I believe profoundly and sincerely in turning the other cheek. I always try to see the other's point of view (My virtual catchphrase is 'To be fair...'. I'm just feeling a bit overwhelmed.

the_hundredth_idiot

I'm with Victor Ludorum on this (I think). All the car drivers (and even van drivers, eek) on my commute this morning were absolutely fine. The problem, merely 50 yards from turning into my office was some dumb-ass RLJ-ing cyclist who nearly took me out. And would have if I hadn't been paying a bit more attention than him.

Dunston_checks_in

My old boss used to have a 'First Law of Muppetry' which basically said that if it's possible for something to get f'cked up by people behaving like muppets then you need to assume this is going to happen all the time. Nothing vindictive about this - just the way things tend to work.

I think the same applies on the road. People (drivers, cyclists, peds) etc. do act like idiots - most of the time because they've got something else on their mind, or because they're in a rush or because they're just not thinking. Not that this is a good thing of course, but it is the way things tend to be.

Thing is, most people probably are decent, and most are generally considerate if they think about it. But we all slip up sometimes and this is magnified on the bike because you can feel so vulnerable and exposed. I think the thing to do is to try and put things in perspective, and realise that most such incidents lead to people feeling confused/sorry/guillty/frightened or whatever (often angry too of course) which means they can react in various unpredicatble ways after the event. I think we all have to realise this and work with it. Ultimately, getting wound up (though understandable) just perpetuates the cycle (as it were).

Good God. I sound like a sodding Bhuddist.

victor ludorum

helz wrote:

Have you got any holidays booked? I think that's what you really need.

No. Definitely.

But all those other people will still be there when I get back...

victor ludorum

Dunston_checks_in wrote:

Good God. I sound like a sodding Bhuddist.

The irony is, I am a sodding buddhist...

The first law of muppetry definitely applies. I remember a student teacher, a delightful woman, was giving me a lift in her car one time (my secondary school was split between two sites, and I had to travel between them for music lessons - I often cadged lifts with the staff) and she gave me perhaps the only truly useful lesson I ever learned at school (oo-er...) and it was 'When driving, always assume that every other road user is a dangerous idiot and prepare accordingly.' It was true then and its true now. Like I say, I think I'm just feeling a lit ground down by it recently.

Your observation about the tendency to anger is also spot on. As Tacitus put it, 'Proprium humani ingenii est odisse quem laeseris' (It is human nature to hate the one whom you have hurt.) I call it the 'London Apology' the mouthful of abuse you get from someone who's just screwed you over.

But despite my attempts to be even handed, none of this addresses the final question in my rant. Why are cyclists so frequently labelled as the wrongdoers in the media?

Greg T

victor ludorum wrote:

The irony is, I am a sodding buddhist

You do know that this isn't a BS approved helmet don't you

victor ludorum

it is very difficult to get good quality lycra robes as well... and if that staff isn't titanium, I don't want to know.

Bikerbaboon

the one that gets my goat every time is cycle advanced stop boxes, why do cars have to stop in them? every time i ask i ge the same answer from the goon dirving at the time. " i wanted to go through but there were cars in front and then the lights changed "

1) b4 he even went in to the box there were cars in the que and generaly only 2 will be able to turn right on a single light change ( make that 3 if you get the red light jumping late driver )

2) as far as im aware trafic lights do change.... i mean thats what they are there for its not a supprise every time. you know hte bbc are not going ot run with the story "car drivers in disarray over trafic light change shocker. "


dont even get me started with horse riders that have a go at you for passing to fast when you are stationary.

Bassjunkieuk

What an interesting read this thread has been, I'm not to sure how I feel on this.
I fully understand what victor describes in the OP and his subsequent post's about other road users.
I personally think that part of the problem is that from people rushing around. I used to race around in my car, trying to get everywhere as fast as possible before I started commuting by bike. This was due to the fact that I was a mobile IT engineer. I was given various jobs to do during the day and then I had to collect parts from somewhere, take them to site to repair the computer and then carry on to the next job. I was expected to be able to clear at least 5 a day whilst contending with London traffic. Some day's I would get lucky and be out of central London and had it a bit easier but I was always looking to save time, so I got into this rather impatient mindset.

Since switching roles (over 2 years ago now) I have learned to be a lot calmer in my car, after all racing towards stopped traffic does nothing but waste petrol! The advice to treat other drivers (or road users in general I think) like idiots and expect the worse is rather fitting. After all if you expect bad behavior and see mostly good wouldn't you feel much better? Don't get me wrong I'll still have a moan at people if I feel they've wronged me - like the pillock on his phone that pulled out in front of me yesterday, assuming that as his mate was let out he'd be to...... he got a "Get off your phone" to which he managed to mumble "Shut up". On the flipside I also realize that I'm not perfect, although I hate to admit it I nearly ran into an old women toady in Kingston in the shared use area where the shops are because I was distracted looking for a bike shop (got to work in Thames Ditton only to realize I'd left my lock at home!). Thankfully I managed to execute a rather prompt emergency stop and unclip my SPD's, so I didn't fall over!

chuckcork

cee wrote:

I think it is because modern Britain is far too comfortable. Unemployment at an all time low, cars everywhere, we consume far more than ever, but still feel empty inside, so consume more....The media spins us into a frenzy about crime this and that (crime is actually been in steady decline over the last 5-10 years)

A couple of generations ago, the population had far more to worry about than the majority of us have ever had to.....

here endeth my tinpot sociology

I think its not modern Britain, I think maybe its the British? The rage (and I'm thinking of the movie 28 days later) of the British seems to be directed against anything and everything that slows them down or impinges upon their right to do whatever they want when they want to do it, which is to say selfish childish people with little patience. The media merely reflects this, though to suggest they encourage it would not be far wrong. it helps to sell papers and all kinds of crap we apparently can't do without. Like bigger MP3 players or shinier phones in the latest colours, or shiny disposable clothing made by slaves in some factory somewhere that we throw in the rubbish because charity bins are so nerdy.

By comparison in living in Co.Cork the lack of that same rage is palpable. My father was over in Ireland at the start of the year, he noticed the lack of it here. There is the odd twat but they're few and far between, I find the majority of motorists won't force a dangerous situation, the many who have been patient with me and who let me in where I need to be on the road, I reply by waving a thank you, and generally if I can I try and be considerate back. I just consider this part of being a road user, albeit a slower one.

I think of this also as a cycle of virtue. They let you in, you thank them, they feel happy because the cyclists acknowledged their consideration. I let them in, most of the time I get a thank you wave back.

No buddism required.

Where that leaves Mr Modeo/White Van man I don't know, maybe they just need a sense of perspective, and as noted realise that getting to the next red light 3 seconds faster is pointless.

Of course if they had that already they wouldn't, would they....

iainment

chuckcork wrote:

cee wrote:

I think it is because modern Britain is far too comfortable. Unemployment at an all time low, cars everywhere, we consume far more than ever, but still feel empty inside, so consume more....The media spins us into a frenzy about crime this and that (crime is actually been in steady decline over the last 5-10 years)

A couple of generations ago, the population had far more to worry about than the majority of us have ever had to.....

here endeth my tinpot sociology

I think its not modern Britain, I think maybe its the British? The rage (and I'm thinking of the movie 28 days later) of the British seems to be directed against anything and everything that slows them down or impinges upon their right to do whatever they want when they want to do it, which is to say selfish childish people with little patience. The media merely reflects this, though to suggest they encourage it would not be far wrong. it helps to sell papers and all kinds of crap we apparently can't do without. Like bigger MP3 players or shinier phones in the latest colours, or shiny disposable clothing made by slaves in some factory somewhere that we throw in the rubbish because charity bins are so nerdy.

By comparison in living in Co.Cork the lack of that same rage is palpable. My father was over in Ireland at the start of the year, he noticed the lack of it here. There is the odd fool but they're few and far between, I find the majority of motorists won't force a dangerous situation, the many who have been patient with me and who let me in where I need to be on the road, I reply by waving a thank you, and generally if I can I try and be considerate back. I just consider this part of being a road user, albeit a slower one.

I think of this also as a cycle of virtue. They let you in, you thank them, they feel happy because the cyclists acknowledged their consideration. I let them in, most of the time I get a thank you wave back.

No buddism required.

Where that leaves Mr Modeo/White Van man I don't know, maybe they just need a sense of perspective, and as noted realise that getting to the next red light 3 seconds faster is pointless.

Of course if they had that already they wouldn't, would they....

I'm moving from London to Kerry next month and find the same as you when cycling in Ireland. So I'm looking forward to less aggressive cars on my commute to Tralee.

victor ludorum

Bikerbaboon wrote:

the one that gets my goat every time is cycle advanced stop boxes, why do cars have to stop in them? every time i ask i ge the same answer from the goon dirving at the time. " i wanted to go through but there were cars in front and then the lights changed "

1) b4 he even went in to the box there were cars in the que and generaly only 2 will be able to turn right on a single light change ( make that 3 if you get the red light jumping late driver )

2) as far as im aware trafic lights do change.... i mean thats what they are there for its not a supprise every time. you know hte bbc are not going ot run with the story "car drivers in disarray over trafic light change shocker. "


dont even get me started with horse riders that have a go at you for passing to fast when you are stationary.

Of course, it isn't actually illegal for a driver to stop in an ASL if you are in a traffic queue, even if it is painfully obvious that you aren't going to be able to exit it (a la box junctions). But it is (as far as I am aware) an offence to enter them if the light is red before the car arrives.

It is annoying when they pull into ones which don't have cyclists already in them. I suspect that part of the motivation is preventing cyclists from being able to get in front. It is even more annoying when they come to a stop in them when they already are occupied. (I have been known to lean down to an open window and say sympathetically, 'Wow, that looks heavy. It must be an absolute bugger to pedal. Still, i expect that's the last time you buy a used car from a Flintstone.')

BattoowooGreekgreek

cee wrote:

By comparison in living in Co.Cork the lack of that same rage is palpable.

/quote]

I'm moving from London to Kerry next month and find the same as you when cycling in Ireland. So I'm looking forward to less aggressive cars on my commute to Tralee.

I witnessed plenty of road rage in Dublin at rush hour when I lived out there years ago, all the fun of the fair - plenty of verbal abuse, horns blaring , a couple of fist fights, etc . . .

You are comparing rural vs urban , I don't think its a British trait as much to do with being in highly populated areas and having your own space.

That is what makes people more chilled IMO , try cycling in a truly rural area of Britain and the peoples attitude is similar to Kerry , Cork etc ( beautiful part of the world btw - good luck on the move there ). I think its just being removed from the rat race, not having to rush and compete for space everywhere.

victor ludorum

The thing is, I have nothing but the greatest respect for working drivers. It is hard and stressful. On the rare occasions when I have taken a black cab I have been impressed by their courtesy and knowledge. However, the second I'm on a bicycle, all of that disappears (admittedly, I'm not a customer then, but cutting me up, forcing their way past and attempted traffic queue jumping doesn't actually profit them either.)

That's what frustrates me. It isn't that someone is screwing me, or other people over, it is that all of this self-centred screwing over doesn't actually profit anyone. Not even the perpetrator.

andrewc3142

Well, I spend between 2 and 4 hours a day commuting, about half in central London and the other half in suburbs/Surrey.

The last time I had anything remotely resembling an "incident" was about a year ago when a van moved across lanes without looking, but no big deal since I thought he would and had made allowance for it.

I find riding very relaxing and non-stressful. I don't get worked up about things and (as far as I've noticed) neither to others get any more worked up about me than than the usual rather sad apoplectic state of puce perma-rage of some road users (car drivers, WVM, cyclists alike).

I'm genuinely interested and a littel puzzled to see that others seem to have so many problems, on a daily basis.

Stay cool.