Sportive cycling standard poor
Comments
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How about these as some group riding FAQ's ?
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php?t=87401
US-oriented, so left & right are the other way round...0 -
"Imagine that you're a semi"
Needs more translation than just left versus right I think
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Interesting range of views and I can understand and have a degree of sympathy with both sides re club cylists' expectations of group riding etiquette in sportives.
I'm sure there are many people like me who would like to join a club, but can't due to work and family comittments. I would love to join a club, but as I finish work at 7.30 pm every weekday and have a young family I only get a chance to go out at weekends and half days.
If I want to do a 50 or 60 mile run and still keep the other half happy at weekends, I'm out at 6.30-7.00am ( what club has club runs that early?) After several years lone cycling, I started doing sportives last year and quickly picked up the etiquette of group riding but I still find it difficult at times--sometimes the group is so tightly bunched that if you're in the middle, by the time someone in front has pointed out a pothoe there is very little time for you to manoevre to avoid it *and* point it out to any riders behind.
In the 5 sportives I've been in so far I haven't seen any really bad cycling but in my last sportive 9 days ago I found it strange that if I tried to take my turn at the front, despite maintaining the pace, some riders would insist in passing me within seconds, always wanting to be at the front!
I did however enjoy it 10 days ago getting a my best placing so far and beating my previous best sportive average speed (17.3 mph) by 1.9 mph . I know its not a race , but there is a degree of challenge in these things - yes?
So, to any club riders out there - don't look down on us weekend warriors- many of us, I'm sure, would join a club if we could..0 -
cyclingvet wrote:So, to any club riders out there - don't look down on us weekend warriors- many of us, I'm sure, would join a club if we could..
Well said. Don't think this club vs non-club/ shaved vs unshaved/assos vs the rest is necessary or helpful. I think that you will find an awful lot of club riders only really ride at the weekend anyway.
Personally don't feel that there is much mystery to riding in a bunch. Basic courtesy to point out potholes/parked cars etc, avoid sudden stops and swerves and even to ride at the front from time to time. If you do want /need to "sit in" then a "thank you" to the people who have done the work is greatly appreciated. Having towed many people to the finish over the years it made all the difference when people said thanks. 0 -
i am all sweetness and light as well ... as a non-aggressive club cyclist (never owned assoss or a madone/cervelo).
the only point i really disagree with some people on here is etiquette re taking a turn at the front. "just sitting in" is of course treating it as a race ... why else would you sit in with a group that is too fast for you to take a turn?
If you ride in a group then you should do your turn. If you can't hack the pace, why not drop back to a slower group?0 -
Erm, because on sportives there probably isn't another one? Or if there is it might be going the same speed as the one you are in? Or because there might not be a decent group for two hours and you don't fancy cycling into the wind at 14mph on your own for that long? Loads of reasons to sit in really.0
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I stopped shaving my legs when it became tedious and I realised that I never got massaged and didn't fall off regularly enough to warrant it. I would question why many shavers bother, other than tribal identity or vainity?
On thru and off it is bad form to suck a wheel but a sharp word or quick increase in pace soon stops it. You just have to talk!
Pointing out obstructions and pot-holes reallly annoys me when people don't do it, similarly car-up and car-down shouts. But its a small price to pay for wider cycling participation and you just need to be more aware when riding with people you don't know.
I've ridden a madone for 3 years and its a fantastic frame, call me a lance-a-like if you want I couldn't give a sh1t.
As for joining a club, hell, I would LOVE the luxury. But working away from home during the week puts paid to that.
Maybe the best way to tackle the lack of knowledge in new riders is for the organisers to send "sportives for beginners" info when people sign-up? Lets not get shirty with people because they don't know stuff? I don't expect the guys at my local club to know what ESOA is, and thats what I'm suffering with when they're riding in the hills.........--
Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com0 -
skavanagh.bikeradar wrote:Erm, because on sportives there probably isn't another one? Or if there is it might be going the same speed as the one you are in? Or because there might not be a decent group for two hours and you don't fancy cycling into the wind at 14mph on your own for that long? Loads of reasons to sit in really.
in that case please just keep dropping back until you find your own level.
thankfully there are lots of people who are willing to do a turn, otherwise the sportif scene would, quite literally, grind to a halt 0 -
Cheers for that then. I look forward to seeing you in a sportive soon.0
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liversedge wrote:I don't expect the guys at my local club to know what ESOA is, and thats what I'm suffering with when they're riding in the hills.........
Me neither.
Which is it ?
Ethical Society of Austin http://www.esoa.org/
European Satellite Operators Association http://www.esoa.net/v2/
East Surrey Organists' Association http://www.esoa.org.uk/
European Office Supplies Alliance http://www.eosa.biz
Escuela de Oficiales de la Armada http://www.esoa.edu.ar/
Enterprise Service Oriented Architecture http://www.sap.com/uk/services/educatio ... /index.epx0 -
Enterprise Service Oriented Architectureandy_wrx wrote:
Me neither.liversedge wrote:I don't expect the guys at my local club to know what ESOA is, and thats what I'm suffering with when they're riding in the hills.........
Which is it ?
I didn't expect that bit to generate interest --
Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com0 -
I think this is the best idea. But it should be simple and not try and force people to have to take turns at the front. It should be simple stuff for safe riding eg. what does it mean when someone shouts 'nose'? What if you see a car coming towards you? If you see a pot-hole what do you say/do? etc, etc. Half a dozen things that are easy to remember and can't cause harm on the day.liversedge wrote:Maybe the best way to tackle the lack of knowledge in new riders is for the organisers to send "sportives for beginners" info when people sign-up?Why the name? Like the Hobbit I don't shave my legs0 -
liversedge wrote:Enterprise Service Oriented Architecture
I didn't expect that bit to generate interest
SAP ? bleuch ! :x
I prefer the East Surrey Organists' Association :P0 -
Why do and why should people feel they are "forced" or even expected to "do a turn" at the front?? How many times ITS NOT A RACE. So those of you that treat other riders as if it were one (who can only be thinking why should they give somone a free ride)
why on earth suggest dropping back to a slower group. As if you or anyone would do that in a REAL race?? I think not! Consistency please.0 -
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SteveR_100Milers wrote:Why do and why should people feel they are "forced" or even expected to "do a turn" at the front?? How many times ITS NOT A RACE. So those of you that treat other riders as if it were one (who can only be thinking why should they give somone a free ride)
why on earth suggest dropping back to a slower group. As if you or anyone would do that in a REAL race?? I think not! Consistency please.
Why do you think working together and doing your fair share of the work has to be limited to races?--
Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com0 -
Exactly, I think a gold time should be one that is impossible for at least 99% of riders to achieve solo.0
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i'm doing the northern rock cyclone in june, but only the 62 mile one. really looking forward to it after reading some of these posts, didn't realise riding a bike was so complicated. i'll be on the hybrid, sponsored by aldi and wearing my club top, newcastle utd being the club in question
always thought 'through and off' was to do with knitting or is it crochetting, or is it knit one pearl one, crikey i'm really confused now
anyway, tell me again, if there's a hole in the road, what is the protocol ?0 -
Avoid it!
And if you want to ride a hybrid and football kit, a pair of trainers and a handlebar bag, and 'sit in' in a group I'm riding in, you will be more than welcome. Hopefully you'd have a chat and the world will have become a better place for a few minutes and we all go home happy.0 -
skavanagh.bikeradar wrote:Avoid it!
... and point it out to your fellow riders - by pointing down at it as you approach it. A bit of a shout always helps the guys behind too. Nothing worse than riding into a pot-hole that the guy in front swerved past at the last minute!
Mor importantly is Keegan the right man - he reckons no top 4 next year so maybe he should be replaced with someone with more ambition?--
Obsessed is just a word elephants use to describe the dedicated. http://markliversedge.blogspot.com0 -
Christ please don't make sportives into races. Where's the fun in that?0
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Standards have certainly dropped. I hear that riders taking part often wear black socks....Le Blaireau (1)0
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SteveR_100Milers wrote:Why do and why should people feel they are "forced" or even expected to "do a turn" at the front?? How many times ITS NOT A RACE. So those of you that treat other riders as if it were one (who can only be thinking why should they give somone a free ride)
why on earth suggest dropping back to a slower group. As if you or anyone would do that in a REAL race?? I think not! Consistency please.
Some sportifs are in fact races. Does that mean your views don't apply to them?
While most sportifs might not officially be races, people coming on this forum screaming "it's not a race !!!" seem to be ignoring that the events are timed and for many people getting a good time is one of the focal points of their season something they've traned for, spent £ for, and put a lot of effort into.
I'd turn your argument on its head and say that those who "just sit in" are doing so precisely because they want the fastest time possible given their physical limitations ... which doesn't sound at all like racing does it?0 -
About sitting on your wheel and not taking a turn.
How do you know if the person behind you is competent and won`t catch your wheel if the pace changes or they do not concentrate ?
People assume it`s ok to latch onto your wheel and get an easy ride without asking or offering anything in return.
Personally i feel i would rather work with groups if you can . I would rather see the group do through and off to see if they are decent riders . I don`t want to hit the floor because some one can`t handle the pace and is on their limit , that`s when accidents happen.
Do your turn or bu**er off until you find a group at your level then do your bit. If you aren`t treating it like a race, albeit against yourself and the clock then there`s no ned to jump in with a group who speed past.Enthusiasm over ability every time0 -
So apartacuscp you don't like me sitting on your wheel.
You can ride faster and drop me. You can slow down so much that I give up and overtake. Your choice.
Me, I can ride where I like, how fast I like. Well, not quite as fast as I like, as fast as I can having little fitnesss and less talent,
I do promise not to sprint for the traffic sign though. And I will chat.0 -
DaveyL wrote:Standards have certainly dropped. I hear that riders taking part often wear black socks....
Argyll even, in the pro peloton.0 -
spartacuscp wrote:About sitting on your wheel and not taking a turn.
How do you know if the person behind you is competent and won`t catch your wheel if the pace changes or they do not concentrate ?
People assume it`s ok to latch onto your wheel and get an easy ride without asking or offering anything in return.
Personally i feel i would rather work with groups if you can . I would rather see the group do through and off to see if they are decent riders . I don`t want to hit the floor because some one can`t handle the pace and is on their limit , that`s when accidents happen.
Do your turn or bu**er off until you find a group at your level then do your bit. If you aren`t treating it like a race, albeit against yourself and the clock then there`s no ned to jump in with a group who speed past.
LMAO .. and thank you for making me look reasonable.
We should both get some jerseys run up with "do your turn or bu'''er off" on them.0 -
wildmoustache wrote:SteveR_100Milers wrote:Why do and why should people feel they are "forced" or even expected to "do a turn" at the front?? How many times ITS NOT A RACE. So those of you that treat other riders as if it were one (who can only be thinking why should they give somone a free ride)
why on earth suggest dropping back to a slower group. As if you or anyone would do that in a REAL race?? I think not! Consistency please.
Some sportifs are in fact races. Does that mean your views don't apply to them?
While most sportifs might not officially be races, people coming on this forum screaming "it's not a race !!!" seem to be ignoring that the events are timed and for many people getting a good time is one of the focal points of their season something they've traned for, spent £ for, and put a lot of effort into.
I'd turn your argument on its head and say that those who "just sit in" are doing so precisely because they want the fastest time possible given their physical limitations ... which doesn't sound at all like racing does it?[/quote]
That's exactly one of the big attractions of RRing, not always the strongest rider wins.
I think there is a real danger that people take sportives way too seriously, after all if you want to test yourself against others then there are plenty of proper races to do that in, events in which you have every rigyt moan and bitch about other riders. I'm all for doing turns and doing your bit in such an event, but only when everyone enters an event where that is expected, i.e. a properly organised road race. A sportif is not aimed at that level, and is supposed to attract cyclists of all backgrounds, a lot of whom either don't want to be part of the race culture, or are afraid of it. To be hoinest all this talk of it being a race and everyone enetering must treat it as one is really off putting to beginners. And as for sporives being races, well I don't know of any that are billed as races, so I'd be interested to know which ones are officially races.0 -
liversedge wrote:SteveR_100Milers wrote:Why do and why should people feel they are "forced" or even expected to "do a turn" at the front?? How many times ITS NOT A RACE. So those of you that treat other riders as if it were one (who can only be thinking why should they give somone a free ride)
why on earth suggest dropping back to a slower group. As if you or anyone would do that in a REAL race?? I think not! Consistency please.
Why do you think working together and doing your fair share of the work has to be limited to races?
I don't per se, only that if you EXPECT everyone to know what and what not to do, and turn it into another form of road racing will put weekend warriors and newbies off completely. If you want to get serious, then get your BC license out or go Testing. Sportives are supposed to be fun, not a bleedin training camp for everyone!0 -
liversedge wrote:skavanagh.bikeradar wrote:Avoid it!
... and point it out to your fellow riders - by pointing down at it as you approach it. A bit of a shout always helps the guys behind too. Nothing worse than riding into a pot-hole that the guy in front swerved past at the last minute!
Mor importantly is Keegan the right man - he reckons no top 4 next year so maybe he should be replaced with someone with more ambition?
if you mean is Keegan the right man for the football team - no, there is no right man, we will never win anything, but that's ok. and that top 4 thing was just him trying to get some more money, he's obsessed with money
if you mean is Keegan the right man for a sportive - judging by his classic performance on Superstars, i think not
anyway, back to sportive protocol - would slinging a banana skin over a hedge whilst on the move be frowned upon ?0
