Etape 2008

Smartbike

I think everyone is in danger of applying too much science here - believe me, when you are caning it at 45kph+ surrounded by several thousand riders for the first stretch, you will not even be able to check your average, let alone worry about it. Similarly, when you are crawling up the Tourmalet at 8kph, even if you know you should be going faster, you won't be able to.

The key here is in preparation BEFORE the day - if you can consistently and comfortably average 19kph+ (but ideally a bit more) for more than 7 hours over hilly terrain (including refuel stops etc) in your training runs then this should see you through on the day.

le_grimpeur

Muzak has been closest on the timings issue. The kph avg breakdown for the first four hours goes 26, 30, 26 20,then 10,10 15, 20, 10. Of course, the website does advise that these timings have yet to be confirmed - along with the police, but the L'Etape guide ( arrived in the post yesterday) sheds some light on the Elimination System. It states that two elimination points will be set up, the first around the 72k mark, the second around 132k. and that the exact positions of these elimination points will be communicated at a later date. So, it is clear.

And I wholeheartedly agree with Smartbike. If you're not used to travelling up to 45kph in a bunch - you soon will be.

If you don't regularly hit 30kph on the flat, I'd advise going out on the road with someone and practice sharing drafting. You'll then also realise how much energy you'll save. Hopefully that'll give you the confidence to allow yoursel to relax and ENJOY THE DAY

popette

le_grimpeur wrote:

Muzak has been closest on the timings issue. The kph avg breakdown for the first four hours goes 26, 30, 26 20,then 10,10 15, 20, 10. Of course, the website does advise that these timings have yet to be confirmed - along with the police, but the L'Etape guide ( arrived in the post yesterday) sheds some light on the Elimination System. It states that two elimination points will be set up, the first around the 72k mark, the second around 132k. and that the exact positions of these elimination points will be communicated at a later date. So, it is clear.

And I wholeheartedly agree with Smartbike. If you're not used to travelling up to 45kph in a bunch - you soon will be.

If you don't regularly hit 30kph on the flat, I'd advise going out on the road with someone and practice sharing drafting. You'll then also realise how much energy you'll save. Hopefully that'll give you the confidence to allow yoursel to relax and ENJOY THE DAY

Tell us more about the guide - where did you get it?

jhop

Smartbike wrote:

I think everyone is in danger of applying too much science .......
The key here is in preparation BEFORE the day - if you can consistently and comfortably average 19kph+ (but ideally a bit more) for more than 7 hours over hilly terrain (including refuel stops etc) in your training runs then this should see you through on the day.

This should be my 5th etape and the advice I was initially given and have subsequently passed on to others is that a hilly UK Audax 200K ride in total time of 8 hours ie actual average of 25kph is a good benchmark for confidently surviving within the limits at the etape. Alternatively similar achievements on one of the many UK Sportives is a good guide.
What home based rides can't do is prepare you for the heat!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

le_grimpeur

In answer to Popette's question, the guide was sent to me. I should explain. I live in France and thus applied as an individual. The guide arrived along with the official entry number. I guess yours wiil be forwarded on to you from whomever you have applied through.

rendo

Just had an email from Cyclomundo regarding the transfer from Hautacam to Pau the day before. bit disappointed in them charging for this, 12euros per person. not expensive, but considering the price of entry.
thankfully i won't be needing to use it.

portuguese mike

Yes, and annoyingly it doesn't have an option for collection from Tarbes Station - is that because that's where the hotels are?

richa

12 Euro transfer from Hautacam to Pau is for those staying near the start that want to drop their car near the finish.

You drive to Hautacam and then get a coach back to the start village. It takes several hours and is a very convenient service.

I used it last year. I was staying in Foix at the start. Parked my car a few hundred yards from the finish (with a coolbox containing my recovery drink and some goodies). then got the bus back to the start village and cycled to my hotel. Well worth the 12 euro.

kmahony

I've added some extra info to my earlier breakdown. Still based on a 7:20 start and in km.

7kg

Thanks for the information KMahony.

For a 7:30am start what time should we be eating brekkie?

le_grimpeur

Anyone else still worried about avg times? I suggest you 'get on yer bike', find a reasonable flat stretch, and try to achieve an average of 30 kph (18mph).

As to start time/breakfast time, the guide has a little caveat of 6:30 as the "End of the start line-up in number order', which means you will have leave enough time to be 'lined up'. The village opens for coffee at 5:00 am, so your query of brekkie eating obviously depends on how long it will take you to get to the start line up after your brekkie. But if the query is one of digestion, I'd leave one hour before the start to allow the food to digest, then a couple of bananas around 6:15

markmanner

Should I carry 4 water bottles? 2 on the bike and 2 in my jersey, or will I be able to fill up frequently enough that 2 will be sufficient? I plan on carrying the type of gels/bars/drink mix I will need.
Thanks, Mark

Floodcp

I will only be carrying 2 bottles. There should be ample oppurtunity to fill your bottles.

You could even run into a shop if you are really stuck

pedylan

le_grimpeur wrote:

Anyone else still worried about avg times? I suggest you 'get on yer bike', find a reasonable flat stretch, and try to achieve an average of 30 kph (18mph).

Good message - we are all getting a bit lost here. I have a flat 28 mile evening training circuit. I can get round this at 18.5mph (31kph) on my own and it represents a hard work out.

In a group in the Etape I would expect to be blasting along in the opening nearly 80km at 35kph for much of the time and feeling fine. If this happens, even with a number in the low 7000's i sincerely hope to be at the foot of Tourmalet well ahead of cut off times. Then we get much more time leeway and it will be a matter of using our training to survive on the climbs at an average speed that takes us to summit well within the time allocation. Then it's a long downhill blast (so looking forward to it ) and then the final pain of Hautacam.

So - train hard, get in a good fast group and dig in for the climbs. Personally the more I worry about elimination speeds and times the more the Etape becomes a stress point instead of a day to anticipate with relish.

Rich.H

LE_GRIMPEUR - does your guide give details of where the actual start is?

I have a hotel booked close to the racecourse / registration village but is the start there or the center of Pau?

Also, I assume from your post that we have to be in our start pen by 6.30am latest, irrespective of our bib number?


cheers

Rich

Ken Night

Floodcp wrote:

I will only be carrying 2 bottles. There should be ample oppurtunity to fill your bottles.

You could even run into a shop if you are really stuck

There shouldn't be a problem with water this year-the difficulties in 2006 were well aired in France, and there was no problem last year.

There are a pair of taps as you turn the corner in Campan, opposite the cafe on the other corner-iirc they are set into the church wall

At the water stops, drink a bottle while you fill your bidons, put a couple in your jersey

I rather like this pic descending the Lauteret in 2006-I got enough water!

If you want to get rid of empty bottles you've drunk on the bike, spectators will happily bin an empty bottle if you slide it towards them with the words "la poubelle s'il vous plait"

7kg wrote:

Thanks for the information KMahony.

For a 7:30am start what time should we be eating brekkie?

If you're staying in an hotel, breakfast will be provided at the required time-typically French, with no porridge and little muesli in sight-take your own

You also need to work out how to manage your other bodily functions which will all be brought forward as a result of the early start, early coffee and the nerves.

You certainly don't want to be "turtling" much of the way round and to have to stop for a number 2

le_grimpeur

The guide only gives "Parking du Jai-Alai - Bd Cami Salié, and since 6.30 is the end of the start line-up, I'd have thought the latest you need to get there is 6:00.

If it hasn't been relayed to you, you must go to the 'host village' in Pau at the Hippodrome de Pont-, Long to collect your bib number and transponder in person on the Friday or Saturday, and you'll also get final detailed maps of the start and finish areas

stjohnswell

kmahony wrote:

I've added some extra info to my earlier breakdown. Still based on a 7:20 start and in km.

Everyone loves a nice chart. Does this one include time off the bike for refreshment?

le_grimpeur

Don't know about everyone else, but having looked at the profile of the Tourmalet long time ago, I'd been telling everyone that the first climb is 24km, BUT it only kicks up 13km from the top!!! Result, eh? Not quite as good news about the Hautacam - 13km as opposed to 16. Can't help but feel a little bit cheated though

urrrrrrrrrs

well that was a fun few days recce !!! :shock:

I was with a friend of my cycling club,who knows the roads around the pyrenees like the back of his hands,raced here,speaks fluent french etc...Our base for the recce was Bagneres-de-Bigorre(BDB) which is at the foot of the Tourmalet/Aspin

This is what I can offer in the way of information

I really do trust my friend 100%,and he says that the start from Pau,is non-descript,flat and anyway with all the other competitors you'll be pushed along from the start,he decided that we should do 50km backwards from BDB ,this took us as far as the pretty little town of Nay and from there,we followed the etape route back to BDB thus giving us the 100k

the main things between Nay & BDB are those 2 blips on the route Labatmalle & Loucrup,they should not be underestimated,especially Loucrup.I honestly believe its gradient is about 6.5/7% and it just drags on with twists & turns for 2.5 k's,now everyone is different,people may weigh less or more,you may find it easier,I for one certainly didn't,eventually you crest the top of Loucrup and down the other side,which isn't as long as when you climbed it.!! from Loucrup to the village of Montgailllard there is a small hill to climb,but nothing to worry about

I must point out that Labatmalle is more like the UK hills ,short & sharp

After turning right from the D937 at Montgaillard onto the D935 it is a very slight drag uphill all the way to BDB,also nothing to really worry about as even I got a good tempo,but on the outskirts of BDB there is a set of tram lines ,something to keep an eye out for on the run in !!! this is also a good time for eating & digesting foods & liquids before the Ascent of the Tourmalet

You'll be in & out of BDB within 5 minutes and from here on in the fun & games start .Passing a rushing mountain river on your left through a couple of villages that have slight inclimbs including the village of Campan,and then you hit a short sharp climb,before arriving into the village of St Marie-de -Campan and the start of the Tourmalet.I'll let you into a secret (already been posted ,I think)there is a small mountain spring,just as you turn right onto the Tourmalet,its perfectly good water & good time for a refill as the tourmalet lies ahead I used the springs twice and have had no side effects

The Tourmalet itself to start with is relatively easy,the first 4 K's, you have average gradients of nothing more than 5% with 1k at 2%,there is a petrol station on your left, and then after that it gets serious ,with the next k avg ,a nasty 9.5% ,it is at this point that my TRIPLE came into its own (spesh roubaix expert) as the next 6k's were hard,with no average below 7% and some nasty little drags,from this point onwards I personally didnt look at the views,my computer or behind me,I just concentrated on the road ahead and trying to keep some sort of tempo going, which i was reliably informed I was doing well.I should point out that my friend was in his car ,as he didnt fancy it, looking at the weather :shock: he also has climbed it numerous times ,so he had an excuse I DIDNT ,remember eveyones different,so something else may work for you,but that worked for me.

Unfortunately at 2k from La Mongie the weather was so severe,I had to Abandon,(in anycase the road was still closed from La Mongie onwards ,due to snow) not because of my legs or dehydration,but because i could hardly breath !!!,i was high in the clouds,pea-souper like conditions and the heavens opened and it was only 4c a drop of nearly 14c from Bagnere-De-Bigorre,i was so seriously gaspimg for air,i was almost in tears, I AM NOT KIDDING !!,re-gathered my senses after jumping in to the car,got warm and we tried to go into La mongie,but 5 yards was all you could see,we turned around and headed back down.So the final 6k's I am in the dark and will tackle it head on !!!

The following morning ,we drove to Prechac and picked the route up again thus missing the summit of the tourmalet, down past Luz Saint Saveur and onto Prechac(the foothills to the Hautacam)

Unlike the Tourmalet,the Hautacam is in your face from the off and I was onto my inner ring,not surprising as the first kilometre average gradient was 9%,the next kilometre average was 7%,slightly better !!,the next a nasty 10%,dont be fooled if the road appears to flatten out as you'll almost be climbing immaediately !!, I manage to find a bit of a tempo to keep me going,it really does help if you can get one,there is also another mountain spring on the lower slopes,so watch out,the next kilometre avg was 8% again work on a tempo if you can.The day i went up the hautacam i was at freedom and only had the noises of bees,cow bells and my breathing and had the road all to myself,obviuosly things will be different on july 6th and you may have to use the sharper hairpins more,whilst people descend from the finish,how the organisers are going to work this out I dont know,as some of the lower slopes are narrow etc...the next couple of k's are the same at 6% and its after this that you leave the shelter of the trees and last of the villages and are out in the open/vastness of the pyrenees.After this point, your over half way and can honestly think your almost there(I did) i even found the odd time to turn to my right and enjoy the spectacular views,they are truly awesome !!!.You still have a few k's of hard work with no average less than 7.5% in fact there is 1k of 10%,someone has said there is a gradient of 13%,i personally dont know where that is !!, its after the 3k mark to go that it gets ever so slightly kinder to you.Cross the cattle grid,2k to go average of 7%,but bizzarely i found a bit of speed as I knew I was almost there,smile on my face,1k to go,around the corner,BANG JOB DONE.The day i climbed the Hautacam,there was a big empty concrete,erm nothing,very dessolate place,but i'm sure come july 6th things will be a hell of a lot different.

Funniest thing is ,it took me 15 minutes to get down the Hautacam and once at the bottom I noticed a restaraunt with a sign saying.....
"GUINESS SERVED HERE"..who knows :?: :?: :?:

A couple of tips,which i'm sure you'll know,but if you dont....

SUN CREAM - check the forecast,i forgot to apply sun cream on my first day and caught mild sun stroke ,for which my 1st day was curtailed as i had to lie down etc......

LIGHTWEIGHT JACKET - even on the hottest day,it can still be cold on the descents & you'll feel it ,get one of those jackets that folds up into the size of a tennis ball and can fit in one of your jersey pockets

FOR THE BOYS - Sudocreme,for around you know where ,believe you me,it does help,obviously for the girls i cant comment

AND MOST IMPORTANTLY ,KEEP DRINKING - on my 100k ride on the first day,it was rather hot (24c) and the sweat was pouring off me and onto my black shorts,which showed up the sweat salts,take some electrolyte tablets that dissolve in your water bottles,they take up no room and are bloody good !!!! it helped me

most importantly,enjoy yourself,I for one will ,and should the unthinkable happen,at least you've given it your best shot

pedylan

Cracking post urrrrrrrrs, adds greatly to the knowledge base. I'll be studying it again as the time draws near.

Cheers

dombo6

Great post urrrrrrrrrs, thanks for the info

Peakraider

One thing about Lourcup...
When you get to the sign that says Loucrup, spin, don't gear up, because you dip and then go up for a couple hundred yards immediately.

A lot of people will be in the wrong gear if they don't spot that.

Also -- urrrrs, totally agree: those tram/train lines on the way into BdB look dodgy for group riding. Let's hope they're covered.

Aperitif 51

As part of urrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrs (there's an extra big rs in there somewhere :P ) UK training and support group, I am pleased to post his recent exploits in visual form - for your delectation, starting with a target panel... :shock:



- not looking so steep from farther away - the panel that is... :twisted:



and here's himself - pre-stressed, with concrete determination (and butt) 8)



...a prayer in passing... :roll:



And, if a picture paints a thousand words (most of them expletives...) :twisted:



Good luck everyone!

urrrrrrrrrs

Aperitif 51 wrote:

And, if a picture paints a thousand words (most of them expletives...) :twisted:

F**KING HELL.F***,F***,f*** :?:

stjohnswell

great report urrrrrrrs & aperitif

APIII

Just to add to urrrrrrrs great post on the Tourmalet. I managed to get to the top on Friday (I think this was the first day it had been opened beyond La Mongie). The guy I was with had ridden it once before and told me once I'd got to La Mongie the worst bit was over. Of course, he was lying through his teeth, as the last few k's, the gradient was pretty relentless. There was still a lot of snow at the top. I took this photo about 200-300 metres from the summit (apologies for the b/w pic - I'd just got a new camera and seemed unable to get the thing to take a colour picture).



If you can find a spot to put on your descending gear just before you reach the summit, it might be a good idea as there isn't a huge amount of space at the top and the wind was really blowing from the other side. The first few k's on the descent weren't very enjoyable due to the very poor road surface (snow ploughs make a mess of the roads). I don't know if they plan to resurface any of it. Hopefully they do. After that though, it opens out onto a very fast, smooth descent - this will probably be the most fun part of the day!

Not much to add regarding the Hautacam. My gps was showing a short stretch of 12-13% about 2/3rds of the way up which hurt like hell, but once you're past that you're almost there.

Oh, and the tram lines in Bagnorre - as the others have said, be very careful. Hopefully they will cover them up.

diarmuid

Just read the whole thread on the Etape. A friend and myself are cycling this years etape also and like le_grimpeur are living in France. We are way at the back of the group with start numbers in the 8000's! Doh. At least there will be no mad rush to get a good spot as we are screwed from the off!

We have been putting in a good bit of training and fortunately there are loads of big mountains (roads to 2800m) near us so we are not short of climbing practice. However we have zero expierence of cycling in large groups. My question is, do you need to get expierence in cycling in a pelaton or is it just a case of hanging on the wheel of someone else. Is it generally a line or a bunch? (I'd imagine the latter is a much bigger challenge)

Next question: Do people bring backpacks or try and fit everything into pockets and seat bags?

thenumber8

diarmuid wrote:

Next question: Do people bring backpacks or try and fit everything into pockets and seat bags?

General rule should be that you carry weight on your bike rather than on you. Any extra clothing should fit in your jersey pockets along with your food. Any inner tubes, tyre levers, tools that you carry should be in a saddle bag or in your pockets. I can only recommend it (coz it's up to you at the end of the day) but I reckon you will severly regret using a backpack should you decide to.

crown_jewel

Not sure whether this has been noted in the Forum yet, but the Etape organizers clearly intend to divide the road up Hautacam to let finishers descend. Should be interesting.

See the press kit: http://www.letapedutour.com/2008/ETDT/p ... presse.htm