increase MAP or increase rideable % of MAP?

tramotane

Hi I have been using power tap for 6 months now , mainly to monitor my training progress I do a monthly ramp test

one thing that i'd like to know is will increasing my MAP (currently 410watts) be more productive than increasing my 20 min threshold power which is about 85% of my MAP(348)

if i could increase my MAP by 5% and maintain 85% for 20mins it would give me an extra 17watts which is a lot.

Any ideas or suggestions on how to increase MAP?.

binlinus

I take it you mean "increase your 20 minute power" rather than your "20 minute threshold power". Threshold is usually shorthand for Functional Threshold Power (FTP) which typically a 1 hour TT.

I believe if you work on your MAP/Vo2Max your 20 minute power should also increase. I'm sure someone will tell me I'm wrong To train this you should ride at between 106 to 120 percent of your FTP if you are using Coggan's system
http://www.cyclingpeakssoftware.com/power411/levels.asp

I typically do 6 x 4 mins at VO2Max

Or you could try Ric's system
http://www.cyclecoach.com/pageID-downloadPages-Calculate_your_MAP_zones.htm

On Ric's page you can enter some date into the form and it'll calculate your training zones. In fact why not enter your stuff in and post your results on this thread.

You also need to train at threshold. Typically 2x20 mins with 15 mins rest in between.

Bin

Alex_Simmons/RST

tramotane wrote:

Hi I have been using power tap for 6 months now , mainly to monitor my training progress I do a monthly ramp test

one thing that i'd like to know is will increasing my MAP (currently 410watts) be more productive than increasing my 20 min threshold power which is about 85% of my MAP(348)

if i could increase my MAP by 5% and maintain 85% for 20mins it would give me an extra 17watts which is a lot.

Quite possibly but it depends. (Don't you hate that )

e.g. it may depend on:
- The protocol you are using to determine MAP
- Your goals
- Your chronic training load
- Your power profile

tramotane wrote:

Any ideas or suggestions on how to increase MAP?.

MAP is improved by, surprise surprise, some riding at and around MAP!
Efforts of 3-5 minutes at that level are pretty effective.

Lifting MAP doesn't necessarily or automatically tranlate into improve FTP - however, since it is the rate limiting mechanism, it makes sense at times to focus on it.

Toks

Alex, I remember reading somewhere that Andy C notices that his FT starts to drop off a touch after a period of VO2/MAP focus. I must admit after a 6/7 week focus on 5 x 5's I noticed little positive change in FT although to be fair I'm reliant on RPE and turbo trainer speed to judge this.

Would it be good to block train with 2x20's/SST's for a period to really rinse out FT gains before swithing to a VO2 max focus. What would be the factors that determine whether VO2max training will also bring up your FT?

Alex_Simmons/RST

Toks wrote:

Alex, I remember reading somewhere that Andy C notices that his FT starts to drop off a touch after a period of VO2/MAP focus. I must admit after a 6/7 week focus on 5 x 5's I noticed little positive change in FT although to be fair I'm reliant on RPE and turbo trainer speed to judge this.

Would it be good to block train with 2x20's/SST's for a period to really rinse out FT gains before swithing to a VO2 max focus. What would be the factors that determine whether VO2max training will also bring up your FT?

Quite possibly but it depends. (Don't you hate that ) - is there an echo in here?

Everyone is different, so it is hard to say for you specifically but if I had to generalise then I'd prob look at the ratio of FTP to MAP, if it's high, then including a focus on VO2 Max / MAP may be beneficial. But it can be hard to do that, include FTP efforts and build CTL....

tramotane

Alex_Simmons/RST wrote:

tramotane wrote:

Hi I have been using power tap for 6 months now , mainly to monitor my training progress I do a monthly ramp test

one thing that i'd like to know is will increasing my MAP (currently 410watts) be more productive than increasing my 20 min threshold power which is about 85% of my MAP(348)

if i could increase my MAP by 5% and maintain 85% for 20mins it would give me an extra 17watts which is a lot.

Quite possibly but it depends. (Don't you hate that )

e.g. it may depend on:
- The protocol you are using to determine MAP
- Your goals
- Your chronic training load
- Your power profile

my ramp test starts at 150 watts at steps up 25watts every 60secs approx

goals are increasing time trial speed in RR break away- even i'm a better sprinter!

chronic training load - i don't measure TTS as i have a love hate relationship with power!

power profile - sorry i don't know what that is.

by the sound of it riding at above MAP is going to help - but the pain!

thanks for all your responses

Alex_Simmons/RST

OK - that's the RST & British Cycling standard test for non-elite males. So the mean maximal 1 minute power is MAP.

Well improving breakaway capability when you are already a reasonable sprinter is a good thing - always easier to win a sprint with fewer combatants.

As to Chronic Trianing Load - you can still get an idea from your ride diary over the past 2 months but perhaps not as precise as using a metric such as TSS and the Performance Manager.

For power profile, see here:
http://www.cyclingpeakssoftware.com/pow ... rofile.asp

Don't need to ride above MAP, just some efforts around MAP 3-5 minutes long, with a good recovery in between.