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Training not appearing to make much of a difference

phreakphreak Posts: 2,163
I seem to have hit something of a plateau with my cycling and was wondering if anyone had any advise. Last year my main event included the Stelvio, so most of my training was for efforts of that duration, so for instance a 90 minute steady session on the turbo @ roughly 80% of FTP. As they aren't that intense I'd usually do those 4 times a week.

This year my main event is the Maratona so more climbs but shorter, so I've tried changing training to do 30 minute sessions closer to 100% of FTP, culminating in 3x30 intervals (with 10 min rest in between @ 60% of FTP).

It feels like the training on the turbo is harder this year than last year, and I've done more good quality work, yet on the road I haven't really progressed at all compared to last year. I thought perhaps it might be a bit of fatigue due to the slightly higher workload but it's a bit disheartening to be running to stand still (so to speak).

Any ideas?

Posts

  • jgsijgsi Posts: 5,026
    ah well... join the club ;-)
    I think you need to catch up on Panorama this week...
  • DeVlaeminckDeVlaeminck Posts: 6,134
    Could be fatigue, I've done quite a lot this year but I don't feel I'm going as well as I would have done on that amount say 2-3 years ago, then again in my case it could be age catching up ! It could also be that the weather has been so unremittingly cold and windy it just feels like you aren't going as well as you are - though looking out the window Summer does seem to have arrived today.
    AFC Mercia women - sign for us
  • phreakphreak Posts: 2,163
    I did consider age (36 this year), but figured that I've only been doing this for about 6 years so must have a bit of improvement left. Going on the turbo isn't the easiest to do at the best of times but it's that bit harder when it doesn't appear to be doing a great deal.
  • mamba80mamba80 Posts: 5,086
    i ve also been training for the Maratona and i ve changed how i train for it, though i ve also been doing 20 and 30 min sessions on turbo and much much longer in the winter, but i ve also done alot of vo2 max stuff too plus long rides up 6 and 7 hours, i make sure i have an easier few days every 2 or 3 weeks, which i think are essential, for me, i ve made some good gains this year and seen averages go up and TT PB's drop.

    the next 3 weeks will be mainly 4 to 12 min vo2 stuff, i dont think very long turbo sessions or rides improve ftp and a higher ftp helps with climbing, also 30/30s and 40/20s when time is tight.

    i ve built my own plan using books from Hunter Allen and Joe Friel.
    for an endurance rider, fast twitch muscles are (apparently) recruited to be used as slow twitch ones when you are fatigued .... or so i ve read, could be b0ll0cks though, i ll tell you on the evening of the 5th july :)

    You ll love the final 20% climb up through la villa, (the wall of cats) you ve barely started to warm up after the descent of the valporola and then that :shock:
  • phreakphreak Posts: 2,163
    mamba80 wrote:
    i ve also been training for the Maratona and i ve changed how i train for it, though i ve also been doing 20 and 30 min sessions on turbo and much much longer in the winter, but i ve also done alot of vo2 max stuff too plus long rides up 6 and 7 hours, i make sure i have an easier few days every 2 or 3 weeks, which i think are essential, for me, i ve made some good gains this year and seen averages go up and TT PB's drop.

    the next 3 weeks will be mainly 4 to 12 min vo2 stuff, i dont think very long turbo sessions or rides improve ftp and a higher ftp helps with climbing, also 30/30s and 40/20s when time is tight.

    i ve built my own plan using books from Hunter Allen and Joe Friel.
    for an endurance rider, fast twitch muscles are (apparently) recruited to be used as slow twitch ones when you are fatigued .... or so i ve read, could be b0ll0cks though, i ll tell you on the evening of the 5th july :)

    You ll love the final 20% climb up through la villa, (the wall of cats) you ve barely started to warm up after the descent of the valporola and then that :shock:

    Aye, I'm a third timer and it's a fantastic route. Normally I'd train for 60 minute efforts, but apart from the Giau there isn't really anything requiring that amount of time, so I tried changing it to shorter efforts with a bit of recovery in between this year.

    Just not sure it's made much difference :lol: Of course, it may do when out there, as I'm going off times on my usual 'test' hill.
  • mamba80mamba80 Posts: 5,086
    Bahzob recommended over under routines or criss cross efforts, as does Friel and i ve found those really liven up the 30min to 1 hour turbo sessions - you ve 4 weeks to go, so still time to make a difference.

    Me and the GF have been there a few time too, keep coming back as no other event is quite as good.
  • ai_1ai_1 Posts: 3,060
    On a number of occasions when training fairly hard I've felt and performed pretty poorly for a period of a few weeks just before coming good and reaching a new best level of performance. However I suspect you're all more experienced than me so this observation may well have limited or zero value ;)
  • phreak wrote:
    Any ideas?
    Could be any number of things.

    Post a picture of your Performance Manager chart so we can see a helicopter view of your overall training patterns.
  • phreakphreak Posts: 2,163
    phreak wrote:
    Any ideas?
    Could be any number of things.

    Post a picture of your Performance Manager chart so we can see a helicopter view of your overall training patterns.

    I don't have a performance manager chart I'm afraid (and I'm not sure what one is). I keep a spreadsheet of various bits of my training and a good mental record of how I performed.
  • phreak wrote:
    phreak wrote:
    Any ideas?
    Could be any number of things.

    Post a picture of your Performance Manager chart so we can see a helicopter view of your overall training patterns.

    I don't have a performance manager chart I'm afraid (and I'm not sure what one is). I keep a spreadsheet of various bits of my training and a good mental record of how I performed.


    When I hit this wall (like I have recently) I take a week off of training and simply ride my bike for fun, as in that hurts a bit, back off. Or in this week's case, working all sorts of silly hours.

    I (think) I know when it is time to rest as my CTL on my PMC plateaus at around its usual season's peak and no amount of training harder will make it rise. After a couple of rides I find I am rejuvenated / refreshed, tiredness gone out of the legs, willing to start to train hard again and not quite so grumpy.

    If someone wants to tell me how to post a pic, I'll put up my PMC as an example.
    Live to ski
    Ski to live
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