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Powermeter help

rozzer32rozzer32 Posts: 3,408
edited February 2015 in Training, fitness and health
So I'm starting to look to buy a powermeter but there doesn't seem to be one that ticks all the boxes for me.

I have a normal road bike but my winter bike is also my cyclocross bike and I swap the wheels accordingly. I'd obviously like a power meter I could transfer between the bikes but I can't seem to find one that would fit me well.

Powertap - Limited to one wheel, my cross bike has 135 rear spacing and disc brake, road has 130 so no go.

Power2max, Quarq etc - I use 46/39 or 36 on my cross bike, 50-34 on my road. So when swapping between bikes I'd either have to swap chainrings or adjust front mech or both. Not the end of the world but still a bit of hassle.

Vector - Easily swappable between bikes but wouldn't be able to use when I go in cross mode.

Stages - Doesn't like water, not exactly cyclocross proof.

Now I'm not sure I'd race cross with the powermeter week in week out but it will be good to analyse the files and see where I can improve. Naturally I'd like to keep the price down (keep her indoors happy) and the Vector S appealed as you can update to both sides later, but I'd lose the ability to monitor cross races/training so not sure that's a great idea.

Anyone recommend a meter that might tick the boxes for me?
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Posts

  • meanredspidermeanredspider Posts: 12,550
    Are you sure that the Stages still has water ingress issues? I'm sure you could wrap the housing in insulation tape if you were worried. I have to say that mine has been drowned a fair few times and still works fine.

    I've never done cyclocross, but how useful is a power meter when you're actually racing?
    ROAD < Scott Foil HMX Di2, Volagi Liscio Di2, Jamis Renegade Elite Di2, Cube Reaction Race > ROUGH
  • jgsijgsi Posts: 5,026
    Are you sure that the Stages still has water ingress issues? I'm sure you could wrap the housing in insulation tape if you were worried. I have to say that mine has been drowned a fair few times and still works fine.

    I've never done cyclocross, but how useful is a power meter when you're actually racing?

    I would have said Stages... the pm data is for post race analysis.. none of us race 'stem staring' well not at amateur level.
  • rozzer32rozzer32 Posts: 3,408
    Are you sure that the Stages still has water ingress issues? I'm sure you could wrap the housing in insulation tape if you were worried. I have to say that mine has been drowned a fair few times and still works fine.

    I've never done cyclocross, but how useful is a power meter when you're actually racing?

    Yup. Couple more people over on the tt forum today have even had to send their replacement units back for the same battery drain issue. So still no fix it seems.

    Yea you don't look at it while racing really. It's more for when you're at home after and can analyse the race. How much time you spend in each zone, where your weaknesses are etc.
    ***** Pro Tour Pundit Champion 2020, 2018, 2017 & 2011 *****
  • NapoleonDNapoleonD Posts: 18,632
    I think you've hit the nail on the head. There's nothing that ticks all the boxes at the moment.
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  • brettjmccbrettjmcc Posts: 1,361
    I am in week 2 with my Rotor, which I won on eBay and is less than a year old (I know this because the factory QA card was marked as Jan 26, 2014). I won it significantly under your budget. In fact enough for me to build myself a set of Archetypes on DA hubs and CX-Rays...

    I have been searching for the 'right' power meter for a while, as like you my two main bikes are BB30 (QR and Cannondale). I had pretty much decided that I was going to get a Riken or if the price was right a Elsa from Quarq (there's some on eBay at the moment as well as TTF).

    However, the Rotor came up. I hadn't really considered it until it did, but now because of their UBB system, I can switch it between all of my bikes, so this has turned out to be a plus for me.

    If you are not truly convinced on the PM then maybe worth looking at the second hand market so you don't take such a hit if you decide it is not right.

    The only other option I can think of new is to look at the Elsa RS from Quarq. It has the new Shimano 4 bolt pattern on 110, but can then allow it to be swapped between 50 and 53 (or larger). Powermeter24 have these priced at €1327, but you need to buy rings. They have some good prices too on Rikens etc
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  • brettjmccbrettjmcc Posts: 1,361
    jgsi wrote:

    I would have said Stages... the pm data is for post race analysis.. none of us race 'stem staring' well not at amateur level.

    True, but I did find myself stem staring at club turbo on Tuesday now that I have the data :wink:
    BMC GF01
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  • meanredspidermeanredspider Posts: 12,550
    rozzer32 wrote:
    Yup. Couple more people over on the tt forum today have even had to send their replacement units back for the same battery drain issue. So still no fix it seems.

    Then, if it's water ingress that's causing it, tape it up. 3 loops of black insulating tape would do the trick. I've heard that Stages are very good for customer services if you have an issue. Better than no PM. And, when something more appropriate turns up, sell the Stages.
    ROAD < Scott Foil HMX Di2, Volagi Liscio Di2, Jamis Renegade Elite Di2, Cube Reaction Race > ROUGH
  • rozzer32rozzer32 Posts: 3,408
    Is there a crank pm where I can change rings without affecting its calibration?

    I don't think there is a pm that ticks all boxes so will have to get the one that will cause me the least hassle.

    Stages do seem good in that they send replacements but I'd rather not have issues in the first place.
    ***** Pro Tour Pundit Champion 2020, 2018, 2017 & 2011 *****
  • meanredspidermeanredspider Posts: 12,550
    rozzer32 wrote:
    Is there a crank pm where I can change rings without affecting its calibration?

    I don't think there is a pm that ticks all boxes so will have to get the one that will cause me the least hassle.

    Stages do seem good in that they send replacements but I'd rather not have issues in the first place.

    It takes 30s to re-zero the Stages and even that isn't necessary unless you remove the crank arm.

    Yup - it's disappointing that people are still getting issues with their Stages but they have sold a huge number so some reports are inevitable. The unit is so small that I guess the door ends up being small and a bit fiddly which is why people might be getting issues with the O-ring.
    ROAD < Scott Foil HMX Di2, Volagi Liscio Di2, Jamis Renegade Elite Di2, Cube Reaction Race > ROUGH
  • NapoleonDNapoleonD Posts: 18,632
    I was looking at Rotor until I saw the DCRainmaker write up on it being inaccurate and worse, inconsistent.
    I love my PT but you're tied to one wheel.

    I'm now mulling over a P2M.
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  • meanredspidermeanredspider Posts: 12,550
    The whole thing is all about compromise.

    I needed something that would work with a compact and standard double crank and with rim and disc-braked wheels. In practical terms that just left me with Stages and Vector. With Vector being twice the price, needing a torque wrench to swap, and running Keo pedals (when all my other pedals are SPD-SL), I went with Stages. But it is a series of compromises depending upon your needs.
    ROAD < Scott Foil HMX Di2, Volagi Liscio Di2, Jamis Renegade Elite Di2, Cube Reaction Race > ROUGH
  • If you are brave there is a cheap(ish) option new to the market - http://4iiii.com/product/precision/
    Early reports are positive from pre-production samples, but you would be buying without being able to read any real world tests. However, at $474 inc postage to UK it is significantly cheaper than other options. Would mean either swapping crankarm or buying one for each bike.
  • brettjmccbrettjmcc Posts: 1,361
    NapoleonD wrote:
    I was looking at Rotor until I saw the DCRainmaker write up on it being inaccurate and worse, inconsistent.
    I love my PT but you're tied to one wheel.

    I'm now mulling over a P2M.

    Nap to be fair he also was testing on the r7 software and he also says he has heard better reports on people using the r8 release; they are now on r9. I've just asked him if he has any updates, as he said he would last September, but not seen anything since.
    BMC GF01
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    Cannondale Synapse SL (gone)
    I like Carbon
  • NapoleonDNapoleonD Posts: 18,632
    brettjmcc wrote:
    NapoleonD wrote:
    I was looking at Rotor until I saw the DCRainmaker write up on it being inaccurate and worse, inconsistent.
    I love my PT but you're tied to one wheel.

    I'm now mulling over a P2M.

    Nap to be fair he also was testing on the r7 software and he also says he has heard better reports on people using the r8 release; they are now on r9. I've just asked him if he has any updates, as he said he would last September, but not seen anything since.

    Yeah, the lack of updates is unlike Ray. But seeing as there's proven stuff out there :/
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  • rozzer32rozzer32 Posts: 3,408
    Think it will be a stages. Powermeter24 have got them at good prices thanks to the falling euro. A power2max would probably be £400 more buy the time I buy chain rings and bbs.

    Yes there's a risk Ill have issues but at least I know stages would replace it.

    4iii does look interesting. But I think it's a bit early to commit to one yet. I'd probably like to wait 12-18 months and see how they are.
    ***** Pro Tour Pundit Champion 2020, 2018, 2017 & 2011 *****
  • brettjmccbrettjmcc Posts: 1,361
    He replied saying that he had other stuff to review instead. I think the initial Rotor experience left a sour taste; just shows how important it is to ensure companies get products right first time these days. Consumers can now longer be real world test beds.

    All said and done, I have mine now, I have no reference points to go on it seems to be OK for the couple of rides I have done and you follow me on Strava, so you can have a look at the data. When you download to Connect as well, you also get your balance data as well. I'll be hones, I won it with a new set of rings for £640, which I thought was pretty good, given that I am seeing Rikens go for more. The new firware release on the Quarqs have also removed the need for a magnet, but some of the reviews have said it sometimes doesn't work OK. Have fun choosing :)
    BMC GF01
    Quintana Roo Cd01
    Project High End Hack
    Cannondale Synapse SL (gone)
    I like Carbon
  • djhermerdjhermer Posts: 328
    Very happy with my rotor after 2 months and c.1200 miles. It reads a bit low though :wink:

    I've come from a powertap and haven't noticed any abnormalaties or inconsistencies. I also have someone else analysing the data who hasn't flagged an issue. It's relatively good value, it looks good and can be swapped between bikes by a biff like me.
  • rozzer32rozzer32 Posts: 3,408
    I think rotor missed a trick with their LT system. If they did an upgrade kit like garmin where you could buy the left then upgrade to the right at a later date then I'd be all over it.
    ***** Pro Tour Pundit Champion 2020, 2018, 2017 & 2011 *****
  • I had occasion to take my 8 year old second hand SRM for service and the company were fantastc. Really happy with the device too, on rotor cranks.

    I also swap between 2bikes, I just have a set of bearing cups in each, takes 5 minutes.
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  • rozzer32rozzer32 Posts: 3,408
    Just to update.

    I went for a Power2Max in the end. Sram rival crank with classic meter and chainrings for £560. Seemed a no brainer for me. Yes I'll have to swap chainrings but it's only an extra 5 minute job. And seeing as I'd be switching pedals between speedplay and spd anyway doesn't make a huge difference.
    ***** Pro Tour Pundit Champion 2020, 2018, 2017 & 2011 *****
  • Just to add to the thread.
    I raced throughout the cross season just ended with a stages PM. Its my XT arm from my XC bike
    No issues
    I raced all the XC season before that with it and had issues, definitely from water ingress, and it was replaced before the CX season.

    As people have said, the data is for viewing afterwards, but It is of limited use, for CX especially. If you come up against a running course, none of that off the bike time is accounted for obviously. Still a fascinating insight to the power production in a CX race though.

    In saying that, I will probably do without it next CX season in the quest for matching bikes and money saving


    I only ever went for a stages crank as there is no other option for XC racing unless you go big bucks
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