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Giro Stage 21 'spoiler'

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  • frenchfighterfrenchfighter Posts: 30,642
    I keep wondering where Nibali would have finished if he rode. But I think it is the best decision for him to ride le Tour.
    Contador is the Greatest
  • ddraverddraver Posts: 24,974
    JRod also won two stages.

    Which is the only reason he is nt another minute behind Hej! Plus they ve all been Sit in sprint victories (not that I care, but...). Ryder has shown a lot more True Champion than JRod...
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • greasedscotsmangreasedscotsman Posts: 6,962
    Shame

    Why? Hesjedal was by far the best rider over the three weeks.

    He won by 16secs. So you are wrong. Not by far. Actually by hardly anything. Just by a better tt performance over 30km.

    Not quite, it was a better performance over 3,476km. :roll:
  • ddraverddraver Posts: 24,974
    J-Rod does nt read your posts Rick!!

    Mind you he looks happy enough up there....
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • afx237viafx237vi Posts: 12,630
    edited May 2012
    To defend FF, he said well done to Hesjedal... but it is debatable whether Hesjedal was "by far" the best. He won, he deserves it, but it was very close. He was better in some areas, J-Rod was better in others.
  • TMRTMR Posts: 3,986
    iainf72 wrote:
    So who's won the red jersey?

    The most consistent finisher. J-Rod

    Hmmm...

    Well congratulations to him I suppose.
  • TMRTMR Posts: 3,986
    Disappointment with the red jersey result aside, I've really enjoyed watching this Giro. An amazing display of fitness by all concerned amid quite spectacular scenery.

    The last few days in the mountains have left me even more in awe of professional cyclists then I was already. They really are incredible.
  • inkyfingersinkyfingers Posts: 4,400
    afx237vi wrote:
    To defend FF, he said well done to J-Rod... but it is debatable whether Hesjedal was "by far" the best. He won, he deserves it, but it was very close. He was better in some areas, J-Rod was better in others.

    OK, "by far" was pushing it, but that's just semantics. The truth is that if J Rod had more balls he may have overcome his relative lack of TT ability.
    "I have a lovely photo of a Camargue horse but will not post it now" (Frenchfighter - July 2013)
  • frenchfighterfrenchfighter Posts: 30,642
    edited May 2012
    afx237vi wrote:
    To defend FF, he said well done to Hesjedal... but it is debatable whether Hesjedal was "by far" the best. He won, he deserves it, but it was very close. He was better in some areas, J-Rod was better in others.

    Yeah that's pretty much it.

    Before this Giro I had...0 photos of Ryder. He has been a pro since 2004 (US Postal) and an MTB rider for many years before that. 40 odd of Rodriguez, pro since 2001.

    Lets hope Ryder is now protected and rides for GT victory in years to come as well as other stage races. Any wins would be good - he has...3 to date. J-Rod has 30 odd to date.

    So kind of obvious to everyone that the pocket rocket is a better rider, consistently, by far.
    Contador is the Greatest
  • tailwindhometailwindhome Posts: 18,012
    afx237vi wrote:
    To defend FF, he said well done to J-Rod... but it is debatable whether Hesjedal was "by far" the best. He won, he deserves it, but it was very close. He was better in some areas, J-Rod was better in others.

    OK, "by far" was pushing it, but that's just semantics. The truth is that if J Rod had more balls he may have overcome his relative lack of TT ability.

    Think it's a bit harsh to say it was a lack of balls.

    He rode to his strengths and stayed with the climbers long after everyone on this forum thought he would have cracked. For him to attack better climbers from further out would have been stupid....

    He's been good value for his 2nd spot.

    Actually I think the finishing podium is a fair reflection
    Believe that a farther shore
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  • frenchfighterfrenchfighter Posts: 30,642
    Go Rambo.
    Contador is the Greatest
  • afx237viafx237vi Posts: 12,630

    OK, "by far" was pushing it, but that's just semantics. The truth is that if J Rod had more balls he may have overcome his relative lack of TT ability.

    Maybe, but he tried on the Mortirolo and was unable to make any gaps. That probably cost him a bit on the Stelvio, which isn't even his sort of climb to begin with.
  • petemadocpetemadoc Posts: 2,667
    Fantastic Giro, loved watching it from start to finish. My uncle was over from Canada this week so we were cheering Ryder on! Couldn't believe it when he attacked the other day when everyone just expected him to hang on and wait for the TT, great ride!
  • rick_chaseyrick_chasey Posts: 64,462 Lives Here
    ddraver wrote:
    J-Rod does nt read your posts Rick!!

    Mind you he looks happy enough up there....

    Eh?
  • ddraverddraver Posts: 24,974
    Kids...
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • frenchfighterfrenchfighter Posts: 30,642
    Getty
    04b6ae421922e7fad9f86d4c109237e5-getty-511249102.jpg
    83ce2460a47e502730607fa90cf08fb1-getty-511249158.jpg
    c2e25502833adc0ce9e8abc426bb708f-getty-511248975.jpg
    Contador is the Greatest
  • cal_stewartcal_stewart Posts: 1,840
    As with cuddles in last years tour it's good to have a rider that is thought of as clean winning a GT. Also happy for Garmin. Poor Cav but to be fair I like the points on every stage. He should of gone for more of the tv sprints. 6weeks till the tour
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  • dave_1dave_1 Posts: 9,512
    great to see a Canadian rider win one of the big three races. Alex Steida led the TDF 1986, and Steve Bauer too +4th in 88 albeit he was clean according to Greg Lemond so maybe was really top 3 after Rooks admissions, but still Hesjedal has done it..
  • dougzzdougzz Posts: 1,833
    For whatever reason, better testing, bio passport, changing attitudes, me just being wrong, does the shift to more realistic performances in the mountains mean that TTing is becoming more dominant again in GTs. Andy Schleck lost to Bertie (on the road) and then to Cadel because of inferior TTing, and an inability to gap them sufficiently in the mountains. Scarponi and Basso would have both been favoured to gap the opposition in the mountains but failed, and J-Rod couldn't put enough time into Ryder to survive the TT.
    Personally I find TTing very dull and don't like to see 3 week tours decided by them. I feel a little unsatisfied that a race of 3,500 Kms and 90 hours is won by a few seconds, it seems wrong. Also, if races can be decided by such small amounts should riders be timed properly and not in groups, or does that just create mayhem at the bunch finishes.
  • dcjdcj Posts: 395
    j vaughters has a knack of producing great performances out of less than obvious candidates. first one was van de velde 4th in the tour, then bradley the same result, and now a grand tour win. maybe other results i forgot too.

    with hindsight you could maybe see it coming but it must be a gift he has.
  • greasedscotsmangreasedscotsman Posts: 6,962
    So kind of obvious to everyone that the pocket rocket is a better rider, consistently, by far.

    Not over the last 3 weeks he wasn't.
  • greasedscotsmangreasedscotsman Posts: 6,962
    dougzz wrote:
    Personally I find TTing very dull and don't like to see 3 week tours decided by them. I feel a little unsatisfied that a race of 3,500 Kms and 90 hours is won by a few seconds, it seems wrong. Also, if races can be decided by such small amounts should riders be timed properly and not in groups, or does that just create mayhem at the bunch finishes.

    Isn't it more entertaining when it's close? I don't think anyone really knew what the result was going to be going into that TT, isn't that what you would prefer to see? And I don't think the race was decided in the TT, the race is decided over the full 3,476 km. If you think back to stage 14 to Cervinia where Hesjedal gained 26 seconds on Rodriguez on the final climb, he wouldn't have won the race if he hadn't attacked there. It all adds up.
  • Tom BBTom BB Posts: 1,001
    Really pleased for Ryder, and a very good ride by J-Rod-best GT of his career and his TTing is seemingly much improved.

    Is it just me, or are we seeing much closer GT's in the last couple of years. Last Vuelta was very close between first and second, so was this Giro. Schleck and Bertie were very close in the TdF 2010 before we found out about Berties dodgy sirloin. Indicative of more defensive riding?
  • greasedscotsmangreasedscotsman Posts: 6,962
    Tom BB wrote:
    Is it just me, or are we seeing much closer GT's in the last couple of years. Last Vuelta was very close between first and second, so was this Giro. Schleck and Bertie were very close in the TdF 2010 before we found out about Berties dodgy sirloin. Indicative of more defensive riding?

    Not sure about the other races you mention but don't think there was very much defensive riding going on at this year's Giro. They were pretty much full gas through all of the mountain stages. Riders were not attacking, because they couldn't.
  • ddraverddraver Posts: 24,974
    Or cleaner riding??

    I don't like watching TTs at all - even today was a struggle - but I accept that they are an important part of establishing who is the best all round rider...plus without them you would just get one climbers stage won by the smallest guy and a whole load of eveyone watching each other. TTs give other types of Ryder (see what I did there) a chance which makes it more interesting. I like gt s with a mix of stages, cobbles, rolling stages and technical descents are needed too! Im not convinced bonus seconds are good tho...

    It says a lot about j-rods popularity that people are talking like this. No one minded when Evans beat Schleck...
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • dougzzdougzz Posts: 1,833
    Isn't it more entertaining when it's close? I don't think anyone really knew what the result was going to be going into that TT, isn't that what you would prefer to see? And I don't think the race was decided in the TT, the race is decided over the full 3,476 km. If you think back to stage 14 to Cervinia where Hesjedal gained 26 seconds on Rodriguez on the final climb, he wouldn't have won the race if he hadn't attacked there. It all adds up.
    Not for me, no. I don't want to see it won by a 'superhuman' performance and 30 minutes, but I do like to see the races won on the mountains, and ideally by 3 or 4 minutes so I feel there's real separation. Also, by ending with the TT it sort of rigs it in favour of the TTer, as he knows exactly what's required. It would be nicer to see it mixed up a little, have the TT before the two big final mountain stages, so that the TTer has to hang in there, and the climber knows how much he has to take back. I'm probably just being too picky. I did enjoy the race, and I'm pleased Hesjedal won, he seems like a good guy.
  • cal_stewartcal_stewart Posts: 1,840
    Well doesn't the mtn goat know with the tt coming up what he's got to do.
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  • iainf72iainf72 Posts: 15,784
    Does anyone know how many bonus seconds J-Rod took vs Ryder? I suspect that might make it look closer than it actually was.
    Fckin' Quintana … that creep can roll, man.
  • greasedscotsmangreasedscotsman Posts: 6,962
    Well doesn't the mtn goat know with the tt coming up what he's got to do.

    Yeah, I sort of agree with that, would it really make that much of a difference? It would favour someone who doesn't do a good TT after 3 weeks of racing, rather than 2, but that's about it. But I've no problem with giving it a try, I like a bit of variety!
  • greasedscotsmangreasedscotsman Posts: 6,962
    iainf72 wrote:
    Does anyone know how many bonus seconds J-Rod took vs Ryder? I suspect that might make it look closer than it actually was.

    Closer? I though Rodriguez took more, didn't he?
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