Tubular or tubeless for racing
I am a junior cyclist and am looking for a new wheelset. I am planning on using it exclusively for racing because I have already got a alloy wheelset for training. I have a rim brake bike and I am looking at carbon wheelsets. I am wondering whether I should buy a tubular or a clincher/tubeless ready wheelset. I know that tubular wheelsets are lighter and maybe safer when it comes to punctures but I can see that the market is moving away from tubulars. I want a light wheelset since I like climbing, but I have heard that a tubeless setup has a lower rolling resistance. Does the lower rolling resistance outweigh the higher weight and what is your advice for a race specific carbon rim brake wheelset - tubular or tubeless? Thank you.
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I would say tubeless is better for you... I can see people having to abandon a race because of a flat, that would normally be avoided with tubeless. The benefits of tubulars are mainly seen on an alpine stage, where descending on a flat tyre is safer if it's glued, but realistically, how much descent are you going to do as a junior? I wouldn't think that weight or rolling resistance matter too much either, so I would really prioritise your chances of actually being in the race... so tubelessleft the forum March 20230
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tubular
run flat, lighter, easier to use.
if worried about punctures just dlsm some sealant in.The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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But then the sealant goes dry in the off season and you have to bin a perfectly usable tyre...MattFalle said:tubular
run flat, lighter, easier to use.
if worried about punctures just dlsm some sealant inleft the forum March 20230 -
no.
i whacked sealant in mine 3 years ago. all is still fine.
its a bicycle tyre not the space shuttle
Tubular..The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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I think both have pros and cons. The major issue is the puncture factor, as MF and Ugo have discussed. I have never put sealant in a tubular like MF so cannot comment on its effectiveness. I have had large cuts in tubeless tires which would not seal, so if that happens your race could be over anyway.
If it is a race wheel, then personally I would proritise stiffness/aero over weight or rolling resistance as this will give you the best efficiency with watts saved. Something around 45mm rim depth would be a good sweet spot IMO.1 -
Tubular. It’s what everyone was using in races, TTs and hill climb comps for years and years until someone said ‘ah but tubeless - buy tubeless’.
Wee bottle of Tufo Extreme Sealant and a CO2. Job done.1 -
Oh and buy Vittoria Corsa Control tubs. Absolutely awesome rubber.1
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this exactlythegreatdivide said:Tubular. It’s what everyone was using in races, TTs and hill climb comps for years and years until someone said ‘ah but tubeless - buy tubeless’.
Wee bottle of Tufo Extreme Sealant and a CO2. Job done.
.The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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and before domrone says " but but but glue"
nah
tape 'em on
perfect and takes 5 mins per tub.The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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Last time I used a can of spray sealant, it went everywhere and not much inside the tube… I probably just about manager to get 10 psi, enough to slowly roll down the hill and back to the car… I wasn’t overly impressed and no longer buy the stuffleft the forum March 20230
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nope, used it a few times snd never had problem. its quite popular as well, so others may also have used it succesfullyugo.santalucia said:Last time I used a can of spray sealant, it went everywhere and not much inside the tube… I probably just about manager to get 10 psi, enough to slowly roll down the hill and back to the car… I wasn’t overly impressed and no longer buy the stuff
sounds like operator error..The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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at the end of the day though, tubs get you laid, and thats what matters
#isthatatubinyourpocketorareyoupleasedtoseeme,?.The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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What’s wrong with riding tyres and tubes. Puncture in a domestic road race and usually it’s race over. Spare tube in back pocket, borrow a pump from the nearest Marshall to get you back to race HQ. High cat races might have a following car with spare wheels.0
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For amateur racing, about the only place I would be using tubs these days would be in closed circuit races. For open road races, with variable surfaces, I'd be using clinchers, either tubed or tubeless. Either way, the differences in weight and performance are absolutely minimal, to the point where it doesn't really matter what you use. You're not going to lose the race because you didn't have tubs.
Whichever you use - if you puncture - your race is likely to be over anyway...0 -
Agree, hence why tubeless is the smartest choice, as they will reduce your chances of a puncture by quite some marginimposter2.0 said:For amateur racing, about the only place I would be using tubs these days would be in closed circuit races. For open road races, with variable surfaces, I'd be using clinchers, either tubed or tubeless. Either way, the differences in weight and performance are absolutely minimal, to the point where it doesn't really matter what you use. You're not going to lose the race because you didn't have tubs.
Whichever you use - if you puncture - your race is likely to be over anyway...
left the forum March 20230 -
IMO as a junior just pick up something that's carbon, deep, and cheap. If it's someones old tubulars they are flogging off second hand it will be fine. If going new then tubeless has its advantages but nothing night and day. But whatever you get will get thrown about / crashed and it's always faster to fling your bike into corners than worry about scratching your £1000 wheels / frame / grouset.0
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Personally I find tubular a faff but there are lots of cheap tubular rim brake wheels on eBay so if you don't mind glueing tyres on rims that might be the way to go.
As a junior racer maybe someone a bit older might help you get the hang of glueing tubs or I suppose tape is another option - probably easier.
You can use sealant in tubs - not sure how it affects rolling resistance if at all .
[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]1 -
As de v says
tubular taped on with sealant
quicker
easier
gets you laid
#allboxesticked.The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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I don't see why or how it would affect rolling resistance at all. But the issue with sealant in tubs is:DeVlaeminck said:
You can use sealant in tubs - not sure how it affects rolling resistance if at all .
a) the sealant might not seal sufficiently. I had sealant in a tub once, which began to blow out once it was inflated over 70psi - and while 70psi might get you home, I wouldn't want to be starting a race on it.
b) given the above - none of the tub repairers will touch a tub if it has sealant in it. So unless the sealant repairs the hole adequately, you might as well chuck £70-80 down the drain every time you puncture.
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unless a) you don't get many punctures and b) you race on Sprinters c) the sealant works d)this could be a potential problem with any tyre with sealant
tubs rock
tubs get you laid
use tubs.The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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It could. But replacing a tubeless tyre will probably cost you about half the price of a tub, to which you might also need to add the cost of more glue or tape.MattFalle said:d)this could be a potential problem with any tyre with sealant
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He could use Tufo tubs - apparently can't be repaired traditionally but their sealant is supposed to offer a permanent repair - that said it is advised for a post puncture application though I think they had a different sealant for precautionary application.
Personally I just use clinchers and tubes as I just find them simple - I did train and race on tubs for a while though back when I first got into cycling it's doable but these days I just like to ride the bike and I seem to enjoy fettling much less than I used to.
I'll probably get round to trying tubeless on my MTB at some point and if I like it maybe the road bike.
[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
I guess the point of junior racing is to see if you are better than your peers... it's a bit early to look for marginal gains in the form of expensive kit... I would like to think that at that level or indeed at any level, it's the best athlete that succeeds, as opposed to the one with the deepest pockets. Once you reach the pinnacle, let the race for the latest innovation begin.
I think the OP should look at the most reliable option, you really don't want to drive (or be driven) 50 miles to a race, have a flat in the first 5 miles and drive back home wondering why you didn't use tubeless...left the forum March 20230 -
Ironically, it was a Tufo tub I was talking about above.. Although to be fair, I don't know what type of sealant it had in it, as it came free on a pair of s/h wheels...DeVlaeminck said:He could use Tufo tubs - apparently can't be repaired traditionally but their sealant is supposed to offer a permanent repair - that said it is advised for a post puncture application though I think they had a different sealant for precautionary application.
Personally I just use clinchers and tubes as I just find them simple - I did train and race on tubs for a while though back when I first got into cycling it's doable but these days I just like to ride the bike and I seem to enjoy fettling much less than I used to.
I'll probably get round to trying tubeless on my MTB at some point and if I like it maybe the road bike.
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Ugo - junior racing is every bit as serious/competitive as national/international level racing. You only have to look at some of the junior performances in the tour series to see the quality there..ugo.santalucia said:I guess the point of junior racing is to see if you are better than your peers... it's a bit early to look for marginal gains in the form of expensive kit...
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tape is about £3 a roll for 2 wheels - less than a bag of chips.imposter2.0 said:
It could. But replacing a tubeless tyre will probably cost you about half the price of a tub, to which you might also need to add the cost of more glue or tape.MattFalle said:d)this could be a potential problem with any tyre with sealant
.The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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ugougo.santalucia said:I guess the point of junior racing is to see if you are better than your peers... it's a bit early to look for marginal gains in the form of expensive kit... I would like to think that at that level or indeed at any level, it's the best athlete that succeeds, as opposed to the one with the deepest pockets. Once you reach the pinnacle, let the race for the latest innovation begin.
I think the OP should look at the most reliable option, you really don't want to drive (or be driven) 50 miles to a race, have a flat in the first 5 miles and drive back home wondering why you didn't use tubeless...
tubeless is offering nothing more than any other option - you're going through one of your obsession stages.The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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buy the best to look/perform the best to be the bestimposter2.0 said:
It could. But replacing a tubeless tyre will probably cost you about half the price of a tub, to which you might also need to add the cost of more glue or tape.MattFalle said:d)this could be a potential problem with any tyre with sealant
.The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
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So what. It's still a potential additional cost, which is the point I was making.MattFalle said:
tape is about £3 a roll for 2 wheels - less than a bag of chips.imposter2.0 said:
It could. But replacing a tubeless tyre will probably cost you about half the price of a tub, to which you might also need to add the cost of more glue or tape.MattFalle said:d)this could be a potential problem with any tyre with sealant
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