Language, please!

First.Aspect

Underwhelmed is a word.

But what is whelmed...perhaps a transient inflection point not worthy of use.

shirley_basso

Look it up...it exists as a verb

First.Aspect

shirley_basso said:

Look it up...it exists as a verb

Gruntled is also a word but people don't use that any more either.

Nor do young folks maffick around as much as they used to.

briantrumpet

First.Aspect said:

shirley_basso said:

Look it up...it exists as a verb

Gruntled is also a word but people don't use that any more either.

Nor do young folks maffick around as much as they used to.

That's a back-formation. Disgruntled had been around since the 1630s, but gruntled only appeared 300 years later. Didn't really add a new sense to English... 'happy' or 'contented' do the job nicely.

surrey_commuter

briantrumpet said:

First.Aspect said:

shirley_basso said:

Look it up...it exists as a verb

Gruntled is also a word but people don't use that any more either.

Nor do young folks maffick around as much as they used to.

That's a back-formation. Disgruntled had been around since the 1630s, but gruntled only appeared 300 years later. Didn't really add a new sense to English... 'happy' or 'contented' do the job nicely.

I think gruntled is lower on the scale than contented.

Try complimenting people for looking shevelled

capt_slog

^^ Disgruntled, unkempt, ruthless etc are known as "orphaned words" or something similar.

I remember Susie Dent talking about it on the Rachel Riley show

Mad_Malx

capt_slog said:

^^ Disgruntled, unkempt, ruthless etc are known as "orphaned words" or something similar.

I remember Susie Dent talking about it on the Rachel Riley show

Love Susie Dent’s twitter feed. Real knack of politely sticking the boot in without naming the target.

briantrumpet

capt_slog said:

^^ Disgruntled, unkempt, ruthless etc are known as "orphaned words" or something similar.

I remember Susie Dent talking about it on the Rachel Riley show

I wonder if 'ineffable' is another one, given we never talk about something being 'effable'.

First.Aspect

I don't find any of this explicable.

me-109

Isn't there a thread for that? Maybe go put a link back to here?

Mad_Malx

capt_slog said:

^^ Disgruntled, unkempt, ruthless etc are known as "orphaned words" or something similar.

I remember Susie Dent talking about it on the Rachel Riley show

She’s gormful.

masjer

Mad_Malx said:

capt_slog said:

^^ Disgruntled, unkempt, ruthless etc are known as "orphaned words" or something similar.

I remember Susie Dent talking about it on the Rachel Riley show

She’s gormful.

I'm not sure if that would make her happy, or not.

Pross

Use of 'in' as a prefix - usually makes something opposite (competent / incompetent etc.). However, use it in front of flammable and it is subtly different (flammable can be set on fire / inflammable can catch fire spontaneously). Yet another quirk to trip up common sense!

briantrumpet

Pross said:

Use of 'in' as a prefix - usually makes something opposite (competent / incompetent etc.). However, use it in front of flammable and it is subtly different (flammable can be set on fire / inflammable can catch fire spontaneously). Yet another quirk to trip up common sense!

'In' of course, isn't always a negative... invigorate, intense, etc. - plenty of other examples.

Interesting reversal in fortunes between the two.

briantrumpet

There's a nice parallel with 'candescent' and 'incandescent'. Both mean the same sort of thing. Again, the 'in' is not a negation.

First.Aspect

briantrumpet said:

There's a nice parallel with 'candescent' and 'incandescent'. Both mean the same sort of thing. Again, the 'in' is not a negation.

Sure, but one is falling out of use. I guess it will be inflammable, eventually, that burns out.

rjsterry

I guess it's easiest to think of it as three separate prefixes meaning in, on or not, that all happen to be spelt 'in-'.

Inquire/enquire has always bothered me. Another victim of unstressed vowels, I guess.

thedirector135

Bring back the medieval ff !!

rjsterry

Have just read that belligerent and rebel share the same Latin root for war. Like so many things, it's bleedin' obvious when someone shows you.

First.Aspect

rjsterry said:

Have just read that belligerent and rebel share the same Latin root for war. Like so many things, it's bleedin' obvious when someone shows you.

So mini babybel is a really aggressive cheese?

laurentian

Anybody else heard or seen the word "upmost" being used in place of "utmost" . . . ?

rjsterry

laurentian said:

Anybody else heard or seen the word "upmost" being used in place of "utmost" . . . ?

First.Aspect

rjsterry said:

laurentian said:

Anybody else heard or seen the word "upmost" being used in place of "utmost" . . . ?

I just watch the Aprentice episode (sorry had to endure...) where Arctic became Artic.

Even in the pitch the contestants couldn't get the first "c" to come out.

briantrumpet

laurentian said:

Anybody else heard or seen the word "upmost" being used in place of "utmost" . . . ?

https://eggcorns.lascribe.net/english/1067/upmost/

laurentian

briantrumpet said:

laurentian said:

Anybody else heard or seen the word "upmost" being used in place of "utmost" . . . ?

https://eggcorns.lascribe.net/english/1067/upmost/

So it's a word that is "almost mainstream". I just thought it was wrong!

briantrumpet

laurentian said:

briantrumpet said:

laurentian said:

Anybody else heard or seen the word "upmost" being used in place of "utmost" . . . ?

https://eggcorns.lascribe.net/english/1067/upmost/

So it's a word that is "almost mainstream". I just thought it was wrong!

It is still 'wrong', but eventually, if enough people use the wrong word, it becomes at least 'acceptable', however much the pedants scream. At the moment, 'upmost' is still not common enough for that.

rjsterry

briantrumpet said:

laurentian said:

briantrumpet said:

laurentian said:

Anybody else heard or seen the word "upmost" being used in place of "utmost" . . . ?

https://eggcorns.lascribe.net/english/1067/upmost/

So it's a word that is "almost mainstream". I just thought it was wrong!

It is still 'wrong', but eventually, if enough people use the wrong word, it becomes at least 'acceptable', however much the pedants scream. At the moment, 'upmost' is still not common enough for that.

It's not pedantry to expect people to be able to speak their own language.

First.Aspect

First.Aspect said:

rjsterry said:

laurentian said:

Anybody else heard or seen the word "upmost" being used in place of "utmost" . . . ?

I just watch the Aprentice episode (sorry had to endure...) where Arctic became Artic.

Even in the pitch the contestants couldn't get the first "c" to come out.

Apprentice.

That was an unfortunate error, all things considered.

briantrumpet

rjsterry said:

briantrumpet said:

laurentian said:

briantrumpet said:

laurentian said:

Anybody else heard or seen the word "upmost" being used in place of "utmost" . . . ?

https://eggcorns.lascribe.net/english/1067/upmost/

So it's a word that is "almost mainstream". I just thought it was wrong!

It is still 'wrong', but eventually, if enough people use the wrong word, it becomes at least 'acceptable', however much the pedants scream. At the moment, 'upmost' is still not common enough for that.

It's not pedantry to expect people to be able to speak their own language.

Pragmatic pedantry knows when to give up on the incoming tide and remove your wind break to somewhere higher on the beach.

I can see me eventually having to accept my dislike of the US usage "To protest the verdict", though I will still permit myself to say I don't like it. The modern pronunciation of 'margarine' is 'wrong', but as everyone says it with a soft G, it's now right, if you don't want people thinking you're weird.

TheBigBean

briantrumpet said:

rjsterry said:

briantrumpet said:

laurentian said:

briantrumpet said:

laurentian said:

Anybody else heard or seen the word "upmost" being used in place of "utmost" . . . ?

https://eggcorns.lascribe.net/english/1067/upmost/

So it's a word that is "almost mainstream". I just thought it was wrong!

It is still 'wrong', but eventually, if enough people use the wrong word, it becomes at least 'acceptable', however much the pedants scream. At the moment, 'upmost' is still not common enough for that.

It's not pedantry to expect people to be able to speak their own language.

Pragmatic pedantry knows when to give up on the incoming tide and remove your wind break to somewhere higher on the beach.

I can see me eventually having to accept my dislike of the US usage "To protest the verdict", though I will still permit myself to say I don't like it. The modern pronunciation of 'margarine' is 'wrong', but as everyone says it with a soft G, it's now right, if you don't want people thinking you're weird.

Too often the test. I never know what to call the singular of dice. Either weird or wrong.