Making a mountain out of a molehill

MattFalle

Is it just me or are there people thinking far too much and making a massive chore out of the simplest things in the world at the moment on here?

I'm thinking the "how to wash your shorts" and "how do I carry water on my bicycle" threads.

kingstongraham

MattFalle said:

Is it just me or are there people thinking far too much and making a massive chore out of the simplest things in the world at the moment on here?

I'm thinking the "how to wash your shorts" and "how do I carry water on my bicycle" threads.

Definitely far too many people replying to a thread from 2012 about washing shorts that a spam bot unearthed.

Pross

They should have a "how do you post on an Internet thread" thread.

singleton

I'm in 2 minds on this.

On the one hand if you can't ask questions like that on a cycling forum, where can you ask them.

But on the other hand......

First.Aspect

What length socks should I wear?
How do I remove cycling shoes?
What sort of air should I pump my tyres up with?
Do polarised sunglasses make you faster?

veronese68

I'm amazed at how much some people overthink things, but am kind of relieved to see how much interest the man v goose thread is getting. Certainly more interesting than laundry.

ugo.santalucia

Overthinking is compulsory... cycling is a sport where there is a strong belief that the equipment dictates the pecking order, despite overwhelming evidence of the opposite. Evidence is cast aside and doubt nags over whether the latest slippy overshoe or the extra inch of rim will compensate for the lack of talent.

That is combined with the very British belief that if you try hard enough, you can achieve anything. It is obviously BS... a quick session at a VO2 max machine will immediately point out all the careers in sport you will never be able to pursue from as early an age as 16.

Once you come to term with mediocrity, then things become easier and you can avoid sweating the small stuff and concentrate on the bigger picture

pblakeney

ugo.santalucia said:

Once you come to term with mediocrity, then things become easier and you can avoid sweating the small stuff and concentrate on the bigger picture

I have never entered a cycling race in my life as I knew I wasn't good/dedicated enough, and I never intend to. Cycling is much more pleasurable as a result.

ugo.santalucia

pblakeney said:

ugo.santalucia said:

Once you come to term with mediocrity, then things become easier and you can avoid sweating the small stuff and concentrate on the bigger picture

I have never entered a cycling race in my life as I knew I wasn't good/dedicated enough, and I never intend to. Cycling is much more pleasurable as a result.

There is nothing wrong in being mediocre and racing. The problems start when you think that you can buy your way out of mediocrity.

There is nothing wrong in training hard to improve your position in the pecking order, the problems start when you think anyone can win if they train hard enough.

morstar

I race (badly) but resigned myself a long time ago to the fact that being front mid-pack or back mid-pack makes zero difference to anybody and that it’s not worth training like a pro for or spending alarming amounts of money on.
I race to enjoy it. It does give a bit of external motivation to keep going when the weather is pants.
I get pretty surprised at the amount of money people spend on kit they are convinced is making a massive difference to their results.

pblakeney

ugo.santalucia said:

pblakeney said:

ugo.santalucia said:

Once you come to term with mediocrity, then things become easier and you can avoid sweating the small stuff and concentrate on the bigger picture

I have never entered a cycling race in my life as I knew I wasn't good/dedicated enough, and I never intend to. Cycling is much more pleasurable as a result.

There is nothing wrong in being mediocre and racing. The problems start when you think that you can buy your way out of mediocrity.

There is nothing wrong in training hard to improve your position in the pecking order, the problems start when you think anyone can win if they train hard enough.

I'm yet to meet a "racer" who accepts their mediocrity.
I'm sure they exist, I just haven't met them. The ones I've met are serious saddos.

ballysmate

I can only dream of achieving mediocrity.
Doesn't alter my enjoyment though

ugo.santalucia

pblakeney said:

ugo.santalucia said:

pblakeney said:

ugo.santalucia said:

Once you come to term with mediocrity, then things become easier and you can avoid sweating the small stuff and concentrate on the bigger picture

I have never entered a cycling race in my life as I knew I wasn't good/dedicated enough, and I never intend to. Cycling is much more pleasurable as a result.

There is nothing wrong in being mediocre and racing. The problems start when you think that you can buy your way out of mediocrity.

There is nothing wrong in training hard to improve your position in the pecking order, the problems start when you think anyone can win if they train hard enough.

I'm yet to meet a "racer" who accepts their mediocrity.
I'm sure they exist, I just haven't met them. The ones I've met are serious saddos.

Those who look at the numbers and understand them, tend to accept mediocrity, those who don't, tend to believe in fairies... it's the same in every walk of life.

veronese68

I've only entered one race, a CX, my aim was not to come last. I had every excuse in the book just in case. I succeeded in not coming last. But I was still smiling which must mean I wasn't trying hard enough. But it was good fun.
Starting with low expectations definitely helped.

morstar

My first TT I made long post about in the amateur race section over a decade ago.
I did come last!
3 years later, I had become front of mid pack on the results list. I.e. significantly faster but not fast enough to ever win or be noticeable in any way shape or form.
To become more competitive would have started to cost proper money and I still wouldn’t have won anything.
So I went and did other stuff that interested me. Knowing where to accept your limits and where to push them is a useful skill.

ugo.santalucia

morstar said:

My first TT I made long post about in the amateur race section over a decade ago.
I did come last!
3 years later, I had become front of mid pack on the results list. I.e. significantly faster but not fast enough to ever win or be noticeable in any way shape or form.
To become more competitive would have started to cost proper money and I still wouldn’t have won anything.
So I went and did other stuff that interested me. Knowing where to accept your limits and where to push them is a useful skill.

Looking at people's numbers, going from Zero-aero to full aero kit, assuming you can ride the latter, is worth roughly 10-15 seconds per mile on a flat course... things become more muddled if the course is not flat.
So that means that on a 10, if my PB is 24:20, then I should in theory be able to do a short 22. It's still nowhere near good enough to win a race, even a club race, let alone an Open.
The number of folks who can go under 21 is huge and you are only really decent at National level if you can do a 10 in under 20 minutes. Only maybe 20 riders in the country riders can go under 19 and maybe there's a handful that on the right course, on the right day might be able to do a long 17.

morstar

ugo.santalucia said:

morstar said:

My first TT I made long post about in the amateur race section over a decade ago.
I did come last!
3 years later, I had become front of mid pack on the results list. I.e. significantly faster but not fast enough to ever win or be noticeable in any way shape or form.
To become more competitive would have started to cost proper money and I still wouldn’t have won anything.
So I went and did other stuff that interested me. Knowing where to accept your limits and where to push them is a useful skill.

Looking at people's numbers, going from Zero-aero to full aero kit, assuming you can ride the latter, is worth roughly 10-15 seconds per mile on a flat course... things become more muddled if the course is not flat.
So that means that on a 10, if my PB is 24:20, then I should in theory be able to do a short 22. It's still nowhere near good enough to win a race, even a club race, let alone an Open.
The number of folks who can go under 21 is huge and you are only really decent at National level if you can do a 10 in under 20 minutes. Only maybe 20 riders in the country riders can go under 19 and maybe there's a handful that on the right course, on the right day might be able to do a long 17.

This. I got down to a short 23 on road bike with tribars, skin suit and aero helmet. Plus targeted training but modest volume.
I reckoned I could probably / maybe go sub 22 with a lot of work and expense and would still be thoroughly anonymous. I achieved what I had set out to do which was go sub24.

I remember the week after I went under 24 mins (having spent 3 years getting there), some lad just turned up in a flapping shirt on a cheap road bike for his first TT and rode 24:02.

I am well aware of my limitations.

ballysmate

I don't need to know my limitations.
I have a wife to remind me.

DeVlaeminck

Yes I remember a guy turning up and doing a 57 for a 25 on a cheap road bike, box section wheels etc - first ever "race" he'd done.

The moment I always think back to when the gulf in ability between me and the athletically gifted is when a guy who rode the TTT in Seoul who did our chain gang - he was 40 odd by this time - was checking his phone at the back of the group - it was lined out I was race fit but pretty much on the limit - he sticks the phone in his pocket and just casually rides up the front and ups the pace.

pinkbikini

pblakeney said:

ugo.santalucia said:

pblakeney said:

ugo.santalucia said:

Once you come to term with mediocrity, then things become easier and you can avoid sweating the small stuff and concentrate on the bigger picture

I have never entered a cycling race in my life as I knew I wasn't good/dedicated enough, and I never intend to. Cycling is much more pleasurable as a result.

There is nothing wrong in being mediocre and racing. The problems start when you think that you can buy your way out of mediocrity.

There is nothing wrong in training hard to improve your position in the pecking order, the problems start when you think anyone can win if they train hard enough.

I'm yet to meet a "racer" who accepts their mediocrity.
I'm sure they exist, I just haven't met them. The ones I've met are serious saddos.

But here we are with many ‘racers’ on this forum saying they were mediocre. I was also seriously mediocre and enjoyed racing a bike for many years - it wasn’t important to my self-esteem to win races (luckily) but it was great fun. The majority of people I raced with/against were very modest.

There must be a parallel universe somewhere for Bikeradar posters.

pblakeney

pinkbikini said:

pblakeney said:

ugo.santalucia said:

pblakeney said:

ugo.santalucia said:

Once you come to term with mediocrity, then things become easier and you can avoid sweating the small stuff and concentrate on the bigger picture

I have never entered a cycling race in my life as I knew I wasn't good/dedicated enough, and I never intend to. Cycling is much more pleasurable as a result.

There is nothing wrong in being mediocre and racing. The problems start when you think that you can buy your way out of mediocrity.

There is nothing wrong in training hard to improve your position in the pecking order, the problems start when you think anyone can win if they train hard enough.

I'm yet to meet a "racer" who accepts their mediocrity.
I'm sure they exist, I just haven't met them. The ones I've met are serious saddos.

But here we are with many ‘racers’ on this forum saying they were mediocre. I was also seriously mediocre and enjoyed racing a bike for many years - it wasn’t important to my self-esteem to win races (luckily) but it was great fun. The majority of people I raced with/against were very modest.

There must be a parallel universe somewhere for Bikeradar posters.

I said they must exist. I also said that I hadn't met them. Still haven't.
Racing at a mediocre level baffles me since I don't see the point in spending the cash and effort to achieve nothing while the racers I've met don't even enjoy it.

Pross

I aspired to mediocrity when I raced regularly. Truth is I never got close, finishing in the bunch was my main aim.

ugo.santalucia

I'd like to win an age group medallion at the National Hill Climb championship one day. Don't think it's going to happen soon. Next year I'll enter the 50-54 age group, which is still very strong... maybe I stand a chance in the 55-59, more realistically in the 60-64 if I stick to it (and others don't).

MattFalle

There was a bloke on here a few weeks ago who was going for an age group WR for the hour - perhaps if you dropped him a line you could get some mutual end goal training in together?

ugo.santalucia

MattFalle said:

There was a bloke on here a few weeks ago who was going for an age group WR for the hour - perhaps if you dropped him a line you could get some mutual end goal training in together?

He was a time waster...

MattFalle

Surely a time gainer?

Tbf, he was approaching it all scientifically, logically, he had a racing and club background, knew the sport well, had contacts, a training plan, a fixed goal.

ok, his comms needed polishing but you and him both seem to have the same mentality of goal achievement and winning - and you both have an audax background so you can break that awkward ice.....

MattFalle

I'd have a think about it if I were you - means of achieving your goals....

ugo.santalucia

MattFalle said:

I'd have a think about it if I were you - means of achieving your goals....

One would argue that the Hour Record and a Hill Climb have almost nothing in common.
I might be interested in the Hour Record one day, but looking at the current performances, that won't happen before I am 80.

kingstongraham

If you just have the right calculations, I think you'll find he was faster than Wiggins.

MattFalle

ugo.santalucia said:

MattFalle said:

I'd have a think about it if I were you - means of achieving your goals....

One would argue that the Hour Record and a Hill Climb have almost nothing in common.
I might be interested in the Hour Record one day, but looking at the current performances, that won't happen before I am 80.

i would say they lots and lots in common - both need a training plan, hours of company for riding, weights, discussions re nutrition, mutual experiences, sharing equipt, mental and physical resilience, etc.

Sounds like you can talk the talk. We call call it talking a good Selection.

Coulda
Shoulda
Woulda

ugo.santalucia

MattFalle said:

ugo.santalucia said:

MattFalle said:

I'd have a think about it if I were you - means of achieving your goals....

One would argue that the Hour Record and a Hill Climb have almost nothing in common.
I might be interested in the Hour Record one day, but looking at the current performances, that won't happen before I am 80.

i would say they lots and lots in common - both need a training plan, hours of company for riding, weights, discussions re nutrition, mutual experiences, sharing equipt, mental and physical resilience, etc.

Sounds like you can talk the talk. We call call it talking a good Selection.

Coulda
Shoulda
Woulda

Surprisingly, I am not very sociable...

Does the guy have a Strava account? He did appear to be a bit of a loose cannon and wouldn't be surprised if he struggled to do a 25 in an hour, aero bits and all.