The Pro Race XC thread ***SPOILERS***

ddraver
ddraver Posts: 26,318
edited August 2021 in Pro race
Now a British man can win we're interested in it, you know



First "race" of the World Cup has happened.



XCC is a 20min wattfest of the top 40 (or so - citation needed) to decide the start order of the main race on Sunday. Like CX, grid position is very important in XCO .

That said, no one like XCC and a lot of riders would happily see the back of it. Pidcock doesn't have enough elite level MTB points to even qualify for this so his aim on Sunday is to finish high enough to start the next one. Nino Schurter, the winner of... everything...for the last few years rarely performs well (by which I mean, finishes third)

In general, MvdP simply destroys the boys and PFP, the girls with the exception of our own Evie Richards who was a lesser victim of the points problem tonight. However not to worry as hell of a ride from long time but underappreciated Annie Last took 3rd.
We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver
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Comments

  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,318
    edited May 2021
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 13,085
    Cheers for this ddraver.
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  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 18,786
    Thanks for starting the thread.

    Are these on ES? or streamed somewhere?
    “New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!
  • andyp
    andyp Posts: 10,042
    Redbull.tv streams the races live and you can re-watch the races there.
  • andyp
    andyp Posts: 10,042
    Is there a procyclingstats.com equivalent for MTB? Somewhere where you can see results, look at the performances of riders over the past few seasons, etc.?
  • johnboy183
    johnboy183 Posts: 832
    Just to say that red bull tv app is free. I guess similar to the GCN app but with more content and not all cycling for those not aware of it
  • andyrac
    andyrac Posts: 1,117
    andyp said:

    Is there a procyclingstats.com equivalent for MTB? Somewhere where you can see results, look at the performances of riders over the past few seasons, etc.?

    Try this: https://www.xcodata.com/

    Sadly, MTB doesn't have anything like the coverage that road gets, so finding info/ articles isn't as easy.
    All Road/ Gravel: tbcWinter: tbcMTB: tbcRoad: tbc"Look at the time...." "he's fallen like an old lady on a cruise ship..."
  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 18,786
    andyp said:

    Redbull.tv streams the races live and you can re-watch the races there.

    Seems I have that as an app on the TV
    Excellent stuff
    “New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,125
    It looks like you can watch on the Red Bull website. The replay of the women's race is there:

    https://www.redbull.com/gb-en/events/uci-mountain-bike-world-cup-germany

    Live stream from 1.15 UK time
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 13,085
    This course is quite visually appealing. Is it a climbers course?
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  • tailwindhome
    tailwindhome Posts: 18,786
    Live stream on the App just a Red Bull graphic.

    Annoying
    “New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!
  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 13,085
    Working for me. Pidcock managed to get past around 50 riders so far, still on 1st lap, 25th at around 30".
    MvdP leading
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  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 13,085
    Pidcock finished the first lap in 14th, 7" down, but in the large leading group. That's a touch mad.
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  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,125
    Pidcock up to 6th. Van der Poel back in 14th. On lap three I think.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 13,085
    Blimey, 10 minutes watching the f1 start and it all goes off.

    Pidcock takes the steep line but loses out on it
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  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,125
    Pidcock's fading now. Still in sixth though
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • gsk82
    gsk82 Posts: 3,414
    He finished 5th. Mvdp 7th.

    The commentator said GB doesn't have a place at the Olympics and it depends on the other countries. How does that work?
    "Unfortunately these days a lot of people don’t understand the real quality of a bike" Ernesto Colnago
  • webboo
    webboo Posts: 6,087
    Piddock 6th from 11th row on the grid not too shabby that effort.
  • andyrac
    andyrac Posts: 1,117
    Amazing ride from Pidcock from 11th row; probably popped mid race, but recovered to 5th. Will now race the XCC next Friday, and get a nice spot for the XCO on Sunday, were he'll surely be a contender for the win.
    MvdP wasn't sure of his form beforehand, and these long climbs don't suit him.
    Clever ride from Koreztky, followed all race, and only lead when he had to.
    All Road/ Gravel: tbcWinter: tbcMTB: tbcRoad: tbc"Look at the time...." "he's fallen like an old lady on a cruise ship..."
  • gsk82
    gsk82 Posts: 3,414
    andyrac said:


    Clever ride from Koreztky, followed all race, and only lead when he had to.

    Wheel sucker

    "Unfortunately these days a lot of people don’t understand the real quality of a bike" Ernesto Colnago
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,125
    edited May 2021
    gsk82 said:

    He finished 5th. Mvdp 7th.

    The commentator said GB doesn't have a place at the Olympics and it depends on the other countries. How does that work?


    From what I can tell: the top 21 ranked countries qualify riders. But then there are four bonus places for the two countries which haven't qualified that finished highest in the 2019 Worlds and the 2019 U-23 Worlds. The next top teams from Africa, Americas and Asia also qualify a place.

    GB won't be in the top 21 countries. Their best bet is via the u23 race where they came 14th with ten countries ahead of them. So they need most of the those countries to be in the top 21 nations. Norway, Chile and Romania are the problem countries. Two of those need to be in the top 21.

    Edit: Looking at it further, I don't think GB will make it.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 13,085
    That sounds a bit mad to be pinning your Olympic hopes - and sacking off the road season - on
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  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,125

    That sounds a bit mad to be pinning your Olympic hopes - and sacking off the road season - on


    If he doesn't make it he can do the road race instead
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,318
    edited May 2021
    Blimey well this blew up, I didnt honestly expect any of you to watch it.

    As you've discovered the races (DH too) are streamed live on redbull.tv. (Rob Warner's commentary is going to add an interesting slant to the Kirby threads).

    It is farcical for me to give any insight on XC racing but here goes. Over the past 10 years courses have become more and more technical and are now seriously challenging. Climbs are seriously steep and descents would stump many a UK trail centre rider. Gone are the days when they were basically dusty CX courses. Likewise, races have gotten shorter and shorter so they re now about 1hr 15 - 30 mn. So not quite within glycogen levels like CX but still balls out the whole way. Think max HR and tunnel vision the whole way round.

    Though they do go fast enough to get a drafting effect, this is obviously minimal on the ascents and being on the front can often be more desirable as it allows you to pick your lines and look further up the trail. Obviously on the downhill, overtaking opportunities are limited hence there is often a mini (but nevertheless, full-on) sprint into each section. If you're good at climbing but bad at descending you can trap the better descenders behind you by being first over the top of the hill. (part-time roadie/XCO rider Annika Langvad was a perfect example of this. Marianne Vos was too. MvdP and Pidcock are relatively unique in their ability to take it to the XCO people on the descent. Though I guess you could argue that they re actually XCO riders who 'dabble' with the road rather than vice versa)

    In terms of mechanicals and feeding, these can only take place at designated zones so, like CX, any mechanicals must be nursed around to the next zone (even if it happens 100m out from the previous zone). Likewise, bottles can only be given out there - though mostly these are only ever a quick swig. Unlike CX however, you cannot swap a bike so mechanicals must be mended during the race (wheels can be swapped). When you factor in riding technical descents while blowing out your..., you can see why managing your bike can be very important. This is what did for Sagan in his Olympic experience...

    I must say that - like only watching the last 5km of a sprint stage - you can usually get a good impression of what happened by watching the first and last laps of a race. Especially as when the highlights go up, redbull.tv provides a timeline on the stream with important moments flagged (start/Finish, Laps, crashes, overtakes etc)
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,318
    Given it was miserable yesterday, today was for getting out myself so I didn't see anything live.

    A stunning ride from Pidcock to get on the podium (XCO podiums have 5 places for...reasons?!?) and a rare sprint loss for Nino. Not sure what happened to MvdP, the heat maybe?
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • andyp
    andyp Posts: 10,042
    He said he had minor problems with his back in a post race interview.
  • RichN95.
    RichN95. Posts: 27,125
    edited May 2021
    ddraver said:

    (XCO podiums have 5 places for...reasons?!?)


    Now this bit I know. Back in 1994 there was a World Cup race in Cairns, Australia. And a local Australian 17 year old came in 5th on his WC debut. The organisers were so impressed by this and wanting to promote MTB in Australia that they asked the UCI to extend the podium to five riders. And for some reason they have continued doing this for World Cup races ever since
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • No_Ta_Doctor
    No_Ta_Doctor Posts: 13,085
    Well I watched a few minutes of the xco in London 2012 and thought it was a bit meh. This was definitely a different animal.

    I didn't see what happened to MvdP, but heard he blew up like a novice jnr. He worked bloody hard to come back. Commentators (preferred the German to the Kirbyesque guy) seemed to think he was keen to keep Pidcock out of it early.

    Pidcock at one point was 2nd, but chose the high line on a climb to try and overtake. He lost 4 or 5 positions and blew himself up. From there he dropped like a stone and had to work back up, putting in an immense last couple of laps. MvdP had pretty much reached his back wheel at one point, before he kicked on again.

    Will be interesting to see how he does with a decent start place, though I think this course suited him really well for climbing.

    Watch it on replay :wink:
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  • andyrac
    andyrac Posts: 1,117
    Next week won't suit him as much as this week, but he'll have a nice starting position, so won't blow up trying to get to the front.
    However, I think he's doing Leogang - if it's the same layout as last year's World Champs course, he'll be in his element; long climbs which will favour him - he could possibly do what Lecomte did in the women's race today....
    All Road/ Gravel: tbcWinter: tbcMTB: tbcRoad: tbc"Look at the time...." "he's fallen like an old lady on a cruise ship..."
  • ddraver
    ddraver Posts: 26,318
    edited May 2021
    In the girls,

    The new french padawan, 21 year old, Loana Lacomte rode off on the first climb chased by the masters PFP and Kate Courtney (who has the best pain face in Cycling) and properly stretched the race out. (Loana looking to qualify for the Olympics - PFP being guaranteed a place already)

    The french slowly pulled away from each other and the rest of the field with LL getting close to a minute over PFP who had 30s over the chasers comprising yankees Kate Courtney, Haley Batten and Dutch Anna Terpstra (no relation - unbelievably because...they kinda look alike even).

    This gap pretty much held steady from lap 4 to the finish with PFP unable to draw back the young apprentice whilst also being too strong for Team USA. An ecstatic Hayley Batten also putting the older (albeit not much) Kate Courtney (#SparkleWatts) to the sword for her first WC podium.

    A rather jolly sprint finish for 13th for Jolanda Neff and Maja Wackowska who have both spent a lot of time on the top step

    Annie Last unfortunately unable to follow up Fridays performance in the main race. Evie Richards also struggling to hold the pace. Both finished outside the top 20 even...







    Interesting that the UCI have not banned the TT position - or even the hands on the top of the suspension fork position - for MTBers
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver