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UCI to toughen rules

ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 27,933
in Pro race
Looks like they are going to ban descending on the top tube and riding with the elbows on the bars... What do you think?

I think it's fair and it's not even about safety, but rather giving good example... pointless to have rules on equipment meant to be used in one way, but then allowed to be used in a different way
left the forum March 2023
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  • mididoctorsmididoctors Posts: 16,372
    Riding on the top tube has been surprisingly incident free ... I have to admit it's not for me . .. I haven't seen either use by amateurs leading to anything either tbh ..
    "If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm
  • salsiccia1salsiccia1 Posts: 3,725
    ugo.santalucia said:

    Looks like they are going to ban descending on the top tube and riding with the elbows on the bars... What do you think?

    I think Igor and Gurbanguly have said they don't like it, et voila.

    It's only a bit of sport, Mun. Relax and enjoy the racing.
  • yorkshirerawyorkshireraw Posts: 1,628
    mididoctors said:

    Riding on the top tube has been surprisingly incident free ... I have to admit it's not for me . .. I haven't seen either use by amateurs leading to anything either tbh ..

    I have - a couple of total 'two-hats' on some of our local rides have caused near misses thinking they are Sagan. Got suitably told off.
  • N0bodyOfTheGoatN0bodyOfTheGoat Posts: 5,754
    edited December 2020
    I imagine that a few copy cat amateurs have come a cropper doing the pro virtual TT bar position by now.

    I've either read, heard or both that the only reason pros get away with the top tube "supertuck" is because of their low weight, someone like me at currently ~80Kg could cause a catastrophic tube failure if I went over a pothole while fully loading the top tube... I'd probably have a bit more to worry about for a nanosecond than the teeth I lost and the titanium plate inserted into my upper jaw under general after a collision at ~20mph tops almost seven years ago to the day.

    So I can see why they might ban it rather than plastering TV coverage with "dont try this at home kids!"
    ================
    2020 Voodoo Marasa
    2017 Cube Attain GTC Pro Disc 2016
    2016 Voodoo Wazoo
  • bobmcstuffbobmcstuff Posts: 11,115
    Some pros are getting towards 80kg (especially rouleurs and sprinters; i.e., the ones under most pressure to descend like loons to make time cuts) so I am not sure that is a particularly good reason.

    I've messed about doing it a few times and not fallen off - not for any particular purpose though. It felt more stable than I anticipated. Never bothered doing it in a group ride or on an actual steep hill, because generally on weekend ride I am not that bothered about getting an extra 2km/h down a hill!

  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 27,933
    The point is more fundamental in my opinion. The UCI is very specific on how a bike should look like and what should and should not have. A saddle is compulsory, therefore it needs to be used for seating.
    Equally, if you ban extensions and spinaci, then you should ban a riding position which is equivalent to having extensions. I use it a lot, it's faster, no question
    left the forum March 2023
  • No_Ta_DoctorNo_Ta_Doctor Posts: 12,973
    ugo.santalucia said:

    The point is more fundamental in my opinion. The UCI is very specific on how a bike should look like and what should and should not have. A saddle is compulsory, therefore it needs to be used for seating.
    Equally, if you ban extensions and spinaci, then you should ban a riding position which is equivalent to having extensions. I use it a lot, it's faster, no question

    A saddle is compulsory, but you don't need to sit on it - e.g. when you're climbing. I also remember someone who broke their saddle on a cobbled classic and rode standing for ages before they could get a bike swap - anyone got the vid?

    As for extensions, I guess it comes down to whether they're banned for safety reasons or something else. If so then it makes sense to ban the forearm rest for the same reason.

    Wonder what they'll make of Asgreen's aero grip though?

    Asgreen inside-out grip
    “Road racing was over and the UCI had banned my riding positions on the track, so it was like ‘Jings, crivvens, help ma Boab, what do I do now? I know, I’ll go away and be depressed for 10 years’.”

    @DrHeadgear

    The Vikings are coming!
  • MattFalleMattFalle Posts: 11,644
    yorkshireraw said:

    mididoctors said:

    Riding on the top tube has been surprisingly incident free ... I have to admit it's not for me . .. I haven't seen either use by amateurs leading to anything either tbh ..

    I have - a couple of total 'two-hats' on some of our local rides have caused near misses thinking they are Sagan. Got suitably told off.
    what's a "two hat"?

    #intrigued
    .
    The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
  • MattFalleMattFalle Posts: 11,644
    ugo.santalucia said:

    The point is more fundamental in my opinion. The UCI is very specific on how a bike should look like and what should and should not have. A saddle is compulsory, therefore it needs to be used for seating.
    Equally, if you ban extensions and spinaci, then you should ban a riding position which is equivalent to having extensions. I use it a lot, it's faster, no question

    if ugo means the dangling your hands and forearms off the 'bars then yes, the MFs use this a lot - its fine, safe and faster.

    They also tried the sitting on the tube bit for a laugh and weren't really into so can't be bothered.

    if it works for you though then crack on.


    They can't imagine any frame failures though.

    #speedy
    .
    The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
  • orraloonorraloon Posts: 12,149
    MattFalle said:

    yorkshireraw said:

    mididoctors said:

    Riding on the top tube has been surprisingly incident free ... I have to admit it's not for me . .. I haven't seen either use by amateurs leading to anything either tbh ..

    I have - a couple of total 'two-hats' on some of our local rides have caused near misses thinking they are Sagan. Got suitably told off.
    what's a "two hat"?

    #intrigued
    Perhaps remove the OH?
  • ddraverddraver Posts: 26,094
    Fundamentally I don't see any of it working. what are the going to do, write an incredibly detailed description of how you put your hands and censored on a bike (...yes 🙄)

    By race 2 People are going to have found a way round it, then there will be some controversy about someone in the break doing it and winning P-R being given a 200chf fine, which is totally worth it,or being DQd, which is totally OTT.

    It's about looking like they care about rider safety but not actually having to...you know...do anything.
    We're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
    - @ddraver
  • MattFalleMattFalle Posts: 11,644
    No_Ta_Doctor said:

    ugo.santalucia said:

    The point is more fundamental in my opinion. The UCI is very specific on how a bike should look like and what should and should not have. A saddle is compulsory, therefore it needs to be used for seating.
    Equally, if you ban extensions and spinaci, then you should ban a riding position which is equivalent to having extensions. I use it a lot, it's faster, no question

    A saddle is compulsory, but you don't need to sit on it - e.g. when you're climbing. I also remember someone who broke their saddle on a cobbled classic and rode standing for ages before they could get a bike swap - anyone got the vid?

    As for extensions, I guess it comes down to whether they're banned for safety reasons or something else. If so then it makes sense to ban the forearm rest for the same reason.

    Wonder what they'll make of Asgreen's aero grip though?

    Asgreen inside-out grip
    the Asgreen grip is used all the time tbh - we thought everyone did?

    #nothingweirdthere
    .
    The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
  • MattFalleMattFalle Posts: 11,644
    orraloon said:

    MattFalle said:

    yorkshireraw said:

    mididoctors said:

    Riding on the top tube has been surprisingly incident free ... I have to admit it's not for me . .. I haven't seen either use by amateurs leading to anything either tbh ..

    I have - a couple of total 'two-hats' on some of our local rides have caused near misses thinking they are Sagan. Got suitably told off.
    what's a "two hat"?

    #intrigued
    Perhaps remove the OH?
    soz geezer, innit. still confused.

    #waddyasaybruv?
    .
    The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
  • pblakeneypblakeney Posts: 24,033
    mididoctors said:

    Riding on the top tube has been surprisingly incident free ... I have to admit it's not for me . .. I haven't seen either use by amateurs leading to anything either tbh ..

    I tried it once. Definitely faster and nothing untoward.
    Terribly uncomfortable though, my legs did not appreciate it*. Never again.

    *Probably as I was still supporting my weight for fear of potential damage down below.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • orraloonorraloon Posts: 12,149
    MattFalle said:

    orraloon said:

    MattFalle said:

    yorkshireraw said:

    mididoctors said:

    Riding on the top tube has been surprisingly incident free ... I have to admit it's not for me . .. I haven't seen either use by amateurs leading to anything either tbh ..

    I have - a couple of total 'two-hats' on some of our local rides have caused near misses thinking they are Sagan. Got suitably told off.
    what's a "two hat"?

    #intrigued
    Perhaps remove the OH?
    soz geezer, innit. still confused.

    #waddyasaybruv?
    I hypothesise the following:

    Two hat

    #simplez
  • ProssPross Posts: 38,825
    No_Ta_Doctor said:

    ugo.santalucia said:

    The point is more fundamental in my opinion. The UCI is very specific on how a bike should look like and what should and should not have. A saddle is compulsory, therefore it needs to be used for seating.
    Equally, if you ban extensions and spinaci, then you should ban a riding position which is equivalent to having extensions. I use it a lot, it's faster, no question

    A saddle is compulsory, but you don't need to sit on it - e.g. when you're climbing. I also remember someone who broke their saddle on a cobbled classic and rode standing for ages before they could get a bike swap - anyone got the vid?

    As for extensions, I guess it comes down to whether they're banned for safety reasons or something else. If so then it makes sense to ban the forearm rest for the same reason.

    Wonder what they'll make of Asgreen's aero grip though?

    Asgreen inside-out grip
    I don't get the point of that grip. It looks really uncomfortable and doesn't seem to make you any narrower.
  • webboowebboo Posts: 5,859
    It gets your forearms horizontal which is more aero.
  • itboffinitboffin Posts: 20,050
    The bravest I’ve been is resting my arms parallel to the ground but keeping my little finger hooked under the brake lever for an unexpected dip or bump which is common
    Rule #5 // Harden The censored Up.
    Rule #9 // If you are out riding in bad weather, it means you are a badass. Period.
    Rule #12 // The correct number of bikes to own is n+1.
    Rule #42 // A bike race shall never be preceded with a swim and/or followed by a run.
  • ProssPross Posts: 38,825
    webboo said:

    It gets your forearms horizontal which is more aero.

    You can do that with your hands on the hoods though.
  • webboowebboo Posts: 5,859
    Yes you can, as you can in the drops but it’s harder to be strict. Where as those other positions it tends to make them horizontal by default.
  • RichN95.RichN95. Posts: 27,087
    edited December 2020
    No_Ta_Doctor said:



    A saddle is compulsory, but you don't need to sit on it - e.g. when you're climbing. I also remember someone who broke their saddle on a cobbled classic and rode standing for ages before they could get a bike swap - anyone got the vid?


    I think Kurt Arle Arvesen did the last 40km of Roubaix without a saddle once, but he was out the back and missed the time cut, so no video. I think Jens Voight lost his saddle in Paris one Tour.
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • RichN95.RichN95. Posts: 27,087
    Will they also ban riding no handed, which happens more than elbows thing?
    Twitter: @RichN95
  • gethincerigethinceri Posts: 1,461
    Yes, definitely.
  • gsk82gsk82 Posts: 3,382
    webboo said:

    Yes you can, as you can in the drops but it’s harder to be strict. Where as those other positions it tends to make them horizontal by default.

    It's effectively reducing the length of your arms by touching them up, instead of having them hang down.
    "Unfortunately these days a lot of people don’t understand the real quality of a bike" Ernesto Colnago
  • MattFalleMattFalle Posts: 11,644
    Pross said:

    No_Ta_Doctor said:

    ugo.santalucia said:

    The point is more fundamental in my opinion. The UCI is very specific on how a bike should look like and what should and should not have. A saddle is compulsory, therefore it needs to be used for seating.
    Equally, if you ban extensions and spinaci, then you should ban a riding position which is equivalent to having extensions. I use it a lot, it's faster, no question

    A saddle is compulsory, but you don't need to sit on it - e.g. when you're climbing. I also remember someone who broke their saddle on a cobbled classic and rode standing for ages before they could get a bike swap - anyone got the vid?

    As for extensions, I guess it comes down to whether they're banned for safety reasons or something else. If so then it makes sense to ban the forearm rest for the same reason.

    Wonder what they'll make of Asgreen's aero grip though?

    Asgreen inside-out grip
    I don't get the point of that grip. It looks really uncomfortable and doesn't seem to make you any narrower.
    its also quite comfy as it moves body weight around - you can lock yourself in position quite nicely especially with flat aero bars - MF has the carbon Prime ones and they are really wide and flat and lovely on the tops so lots of room for arm and ciggie packet taped on.
    .
    The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
  • MattFalleMattFalle Posts: 11,644
    Also means you can just relax if you're on one of those roads that just goes on forever.
    .
    The camera down the willy isn't anything like as bad as it sounds.
  • pblakeneypblakeney Posts: 24,033
    RichN95. said:

    Will they also ban riding no handed, which happens more than elbows thing?

    gethinceri said:

    Yes, definitely.

    Collecting and using musettes is going to get tricky.
    As is putting on gilets (see the TdF this year) and gloves.

    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • yorkshirerawyorkshireraw Posts: 1,628
    orraloon said:

    MattFalle said:

    yorkshireraw said:

    mididoctors said:

    Riding on the top tube has been surprisingly incident free ... I have to admit it's not for me . .. I haven't seen either use by amateurs leading to anything either tbh ..

    I have - a couple of total 'two-hats' on some of our local rides have caused near misses thinking they are Sagan. Got suitably told off.
    what's a "two hat"?

    #intrigued
    Perhaps remove the OH?
    Yep, or say it quickly.
  • ugo.santaluciaugo.santalucia Posts: 27,933
    I don't see any difficulty in describing what the allowed riding positions should be... rules are well nailed in the TT scene... if you are paid to ride your bike, you can read a couple of pages on how you are supposed to do it... how much health and safety censored are we supposed to read in our jobs?

    The thing is, if you allow people to be creative with their riding position, then why not allowing manufacturers to be creative with their bike design?

    Riding with no hands brings no performance improvement, it's a thing riders do when they need to multitask.... nobody wants to see a rider in a breakaway getting off the bike to take off his rain coat... I don't think it needs to be regulated
    left the forum March 2023
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