TDF 2020 - Stage 14: Clermont-Ferrand - Lyon 194km *Spoilers*
Comments
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Decent finish for both Trentin and GvA, no?fleshtuxedo said:Front group not got message yet, CCC drilling it needlessly...
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Belgians also noting ‘most riders are putting out PB numbers’ and recon it’s down to the enforced corona break.0
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The problem in the past was that if the actual Tour winner didn't also win the climber's jersey, he ended up pretty close and conversely the winner finished pretty high up on the GC. It was almost just like a variation on the GC. But it is supposed to be its own competition.Pross said:
Yeah, that's been devalued for years.inseine said:
Same problem with the climbers jerseyPross said:It would feel like a bit of a travesty if Sagan took green by being the best rider over the first half of hilly stages before dropping back and finishing with the sprinters. Bennett, WVA and even Hirschi are more deserving assuming they go the full distance.
I would upgrade cat 3 and 4 climbs (i.e. give them more points). This might make the competition, and the stages with the smaller climbs, more competitive, since those aspiring to win the polka dot jersey could then definitely not wait until the hors cat and cat 1 climbs, or a MTF, where one or two good days would leapfrog them over riders who had competed all the cat 3 and cat 4 climbs. After all, 70% of climbs are of the lower categories - the winner of the climber's jersey should be contesting them too.1 -
Triple points for first climb of the day, double for the high point of the stage if it isn’t the finish.jimmyjams said:
The problem in the past was that if the actual Tour winner didn't also win the climber's jersey, he ended up pretty close and conversely the winner finished pretty high up on the GC. It was almost just like a variation on the GC. But it is supposed to be its own competition.Pross said:
Yeah, that's been devalued for years.inseine said:
Same problem with the climbers jerseyPross said:It would feel like a bit of a travesty if Sagan took green by being the best rider over the first half of hilly stages before dropping back and finishing with the sprinters. Bennett, WVA and even Hirschi are more deserving assuming they go the full distance.
I would upgrade cat 3 and 4 climbs (i.e. give them more points). This might make the competition, and the stages with the smaller climbs, more competitive, since those aspiring to win the polka dot jersey could then definitely not wait until the hors cat and cat 1 climbs, or a MTF, where one or two good days would leapfrog them over riders who had competed all the cat 3 and cat 4 climbs. After all, 70% of climbs are of the lower categories - the winner of the climber's jersey should be contesting them too.0 -
I think someone will get a solution soonish thou ( not a disc fan)rick_chasey said:Disc brake wheel changes are slooooow
"If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm0 -
Bardet blood on the brain"If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm0
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Ouffff"If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm0
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"If WvA is allowed to go for the finish" . He's gone for every other one. Why wouldn't he? Why ask the Bora DS this after the usual five minute introductionary ramble to a question? What about asking about the main threats he sees today - that might elicit an interesting answer.mididoctors said:
At least we have choice ... Imagine only having duffers for years on end punctuated with suitcase of courage sherwen and legget .. I think hours of listening to anyone is grating after a while truth be toldTheBigBean said:The ITV commentary team annoys me.
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Yeah, just heard Boardman say that.0
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I keep waiting for Roglics legs to spin off his hips.0
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Lot of relatively low profile wheels today"If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm0
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It still encourages the philosophy of a small group going, fighting for the points and then sitting up dropping out of the back once caught (or worse still, riders that should be targeting the overall deliberately shipping time so they can chase the jersey).rick_chasey said:
Triple points for first climb of the day, double for the high point of the stage if it isn’t the finish.jimmyjams said:
The problem in the past was that if the actual Tour winner didn't also win the climber's jersey, he ended up pretty close and conversely the winner finished pretty high up on the GC. It was almost just like a variation on the GC. But it is supposed to be its own competition.Pross said:
Yeah, that's been devalued for years.inseine said:
Same problem with the climbers jerseyPross said:It would feel like a bit of a travesty if Sagan took green by being the best rider over the first half of hilly stages before dropping back and finishing with the sprinters. Bennett, WVA and even Hirschi are more deserving assuming they go the full distance.
I would upgrade cat 3 and 4 climbs (i.e. give them more points). This might make the competition, and the stages with the smaller climbs, more competitive, since those aspiring to win the polka dot jersey could then definitely not wait until the hors cat and cat 1 climbs, or a MTF, where one or two good days would leapfrog them over riders who had competed all the cat 3 and cat 4 climbs. After all, 70% of climbs are of the lower categories - the winner of the climber's jersey should be contesting them too.0 -
Send them a strongly worded email ...TheBigBean said:
"If WvA is allowed to go for the finish" . He's gone for every other one. Why wouldn't he? Why ask the Bora DS this after the usual five minute introductionary ramble to a question? What about asking about the main threats he sees today - that might elicit an interesting answer.mididoctors said:
At least we have choice ... Imagine only having duffers for years on end punctuated with suitcase of courage sherwen and legget .. I think hours of listening to anyone is grating after a while truth be toldTheBigBean said:The ITV commentary team annoys me.
"If I was a 38 year old man, I definitely wouldn't be riding a bright yellow bike with Hello Kitty disc wheels, put it that way. What we're witnessing here is the world's most high profile mid-life crisis" Afx237vi Mon Jul 20, 2009 2:43 pm0 -
Would make the beginning more fun.Pross said:
It still encourages the philosophy of a small group going, fighting for the points and then sitting up dropping out of the back once caught (or worse still, riders that should be targeting the overall deliberately shipping time so they can chase the jersey).rick_chasey said:
Triple points for first climb of the day, double for the high point of the stage if it isn’t the finish.jimmyjams said:
The problem in the past was that if the actual Tour winner didn't also win the climber's jersey, he ended up pretty close and conversely the winner finished pretty high up on the GC. It was almost just like a variation on the GC. But it is supposed to be its own competition.Pross said:
Yeah, that's been devalued for years.inseine said:
Same problem with the climbers jerseyPross said:It would feel like a bit of a travesty if Sagan took green by being the best rider over the first half of hilly stages before dropping back and finishing with the sprinters. Bennett, WVA and even Hirschi are more deserving assuming they go the full distance.
I would upgrade cat 3 and 4 climbs (i.e. give them more points). This might make the competition, and the stages with the smaller climbs, more competitive, since those aspiring to win the polka dot jersey could then definitely not wait until the hors cat and cat 1 climbs, or a MTF, where one or two good days would leapfrog them over riders who had competed all the cat 3 and cat 4 climbs. After all, 70% of climbs are of the lower categories - the winner of the climber's jersey should be contesting them too.
Don’t think it’s realistic to expect anything else. It’s a different competition so it’ll have different tactics0 -
Sure, I'm quite happy about it as I'm not a fan of semi-rest days. It's the attrition that will hopefully make the last week interesting. I just suspect those challenging for GC won't be enjoying it. Seems to have calmed down now though anyway.mididoctors said:
Maybe but all this patron GC priority stuff is so last century now .. no ... Make em fight it out and increase the number of variables GC tacticians have to contend with . You have a team help you win yellow and strategise round don't you? This new evolving format creates unpredictability. I am in favourPross said:Bora aren't going to be popular with the GC teams if they keep this going to the finish.
Ha Kennaugh saying same as I type!0 -
Any particular reason? It did seem an odd day to ride on the front with that finish climb. Maybe they knew Bernal wasn't at his best and wanted to control things a bit.rick_chasey said:Belgians *scathing* of ineos tactics yesterday.
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I'm fighting a losing battle. "Expert" pundits have contaminated every sport.mididoctors said:
Send them a strongly worded email ...TheBigBean said:
"If WvA is allowed to go for the finish" . He's gone for every other one. Why wouldn't he? Why ask the Bora DS this after the usual five minute introductionary ramble to a question? What about asking about the main threats he sees today - that might elicit an interesting answer.mididoctors said:
At least we have choice ... Imagine only having duffers for years on end punctuated with suitcase of courage sherwen and legget .. I think hours of listening to anyone is grating after a while truth be toldTheBigBean said:The ITV commentary team annoys me.
I found it really interesting when Strauss retired and joined the Sky cricket commentary team. He was able to explain the tactics rather than declare them wrong.
Anyway, I'll stop ranting!0 -
Yeah, it's probably rose tinted glasses but it feels like it used to genuinely be the best climber that won it until Virenque came along. Probably being unfair though.rick_chasey said:
Would make the beginning more fun.Pross said:
It still encourages the philosophy of a small group going, fighting for the points and then sitting up dropping out of the back once caught (or worse still, riders that should be targeting the overall deliberately shipping time so they can chase the jersey).rick_chasey said:
Triple points for first climb of the day, double for the high point of the stage if it isn’t the finish.jimmyjams said:
The problem in the past was that if the actual Tour winner didn't also win the climber's jersey, he ended up pretty close and conversely the winner finished pretty high up on the GC. It was almost just like a variation on the GC. But it is supposed to be its own competition.Pross said:
Yeah, that's been devalued for years.inseine said:
Same problem with the climbers jerseyPross said:It would feel like a bit of a travesty if Sagan took green by being the best rider over the first half of hilly stages before dropping back and finishing with the sprinters. Bennett, WVA and even Hirschi are more deserving assuming they go the full distance.
I would upgrade cat 3 and 4 climbs (i.e. give them more points). This might make the competition, and the stages with the smaller climbs, more competitive, since those aspiring to win the polka dot jersey could then definitely not wait until the hors cat and cat 1 climbs, or a MTF, where one or two good days would leapfrog them over riders who had competed all the cat 3 and cat 4 climbs. After all, 70% of climbs are of the lower categories - the winner of the climber's jersey should be contesting them too.
Don’t think it’s realistic to expect anything else. It’s a different competition so it’ll have different tactics0 -
Time the climbs and points for fastest riders. A few people breaking out of the bunch as they try to get the best time might shake things up. Might make it harder for the GC boys to control, as well.0
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Ouch. Hope he gets better soon.
Presumably this happens to loads of people though, and not being top sportspeople they just don't get scanned?0 -
Tactics were different then too.Pross said:
Yeah, it's probably rose tinted glasses but it feels like it used to genuinely be the best climber that won it until Virenque came along. Probably being unfair though.rick_chasey said:
Would make the beginning more fun.Pross said:
It still encourages the philosophy of a small group going, fighting for the points and then sitting up dropping out of the back once caught (or worse still, riders that should be targeting the overall deliberately shipping time so they can chase the jersey).rick_chasey said:
Triple points for first climb of the day, double for the high point of the stage if it isn’t the finish.jimmyjams said:
The problem in the past was that if the actual Tour winner didn't also win the climber's jersey, he ended up pretty close and conversely the winner finished pretty high up on the GC. It was almost just like a variation on the GC. But it is supposed to be its own competition.Pross said:
Yeah, that's been devalued for years.inseine said:
Same problem with the climbers jerseyPross said:It would feel like a bit of a travesty if Sagan took green by being the best rider over the first half of hilly stages before dropping back and finishing with the sprinters. Bennett, WVA and even Hirschi are more deserving assuming they go the full distance.
I would upgrade cat 3 and 4 climbs (i.e. give them more points). This might make the competition, and the stages with the smaller climbs, more competitive, since those aspiring to win the polka dot jersey could then definitely not wait until the hors cat and cat 1 climbs, or a MTF, where one or two good days would leapfrog them over riders who had competed all the cat 3 and cat 4 climbs. After all, 70% of climbs are of the lower categories - the winner of the climber's jersey should be contesting them too.
Don’t think it’s realistic to expect anything else. It’s a different competition so it’ll have different tactics0 -
Bora still nailing this and the time to bennet is going out all the time
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That was in the days that best TTer won the tour.Pross said:
Yeah, it's probably rose tinted glasses but it feels like it used to genuinely be the best climber that won it until Virenque came along. Probably being unfair though.rick_chasey said:
Would make the beginning more fun.Pross said:
It still encourages the philosophy of a small group going, fighting for the points and then sitting up dropping out of the back once caught (or worse still, riders that should be targeting the overall deliberately shipping time so they can chase the jersey).rick_chasey said:
Triple points for first climb of the day, double for the high point of the stage if it isn’t the finish.jimmyjams said:
The problem in the past was that if the actual Tour winner didn't also win the climber's jersey, he ended up pretty close and conversely the winner finished pretty high up on the GC. It was almost just like a variation on the GC. But it is supposed to be its own competition.Pross said:
Yeah, that's been devalued for years.inseine said:
Same problem with the climbers jerseyPross said:It would feel like a bit of a travesty if Sagan took green by being the best rider over the first half of hilly stages before dropping back and finishing with the sprinters. Bennett, WVA and even Hirschi are more deserving assuming they go the full distance.
I would upgrade cat 3 and 4 climbs (i.e. give them more points). This might make the competition, and the stages with the smaller climbs, more competitive, since those aspiring to win the polka dot jersey could then definitely not wait until the hors cat and cat 1 climbs, or a MTF, where one or two good days would leapfrog them over riders who had competed all the cat 3 and cat 4 climbs. After all, 70% of climbs are of the lower categories - the winner of the climber's jersey should be contesting them too.
Don’t think it’s realistic to expect anything else. It’s a different competition so it’ll have different tactics0 -
He needs a tap on the headmididoctors said:Bardet blood on the brain
BASI Nordic Ski Instructor
Instagramme0 -
Think you underrate Virenque (albeit his tactic in his last 2 years was to go for the smaller climbs, a tactic he learnt from Jalabert's successes in 2001 and 2002).Pross said:
Yeah, it's probably rose tinted glasses but it feels like it used to genuinely be the best climber that won it until Virenque came along. Probably being unfair though.rick_chasey said:
Would make the beginning more fun.Pross said:
It still encourages the philosophy of a small group going, fighting for the points and then sitting up dropping out of the back once caught (or worse still, riders that should be targeting the overall deliberately shipping time so they can chase the jersey).rick_chasey said:
Triple points for first climb of the day, double for the high point of the stage if it isn’t the finish.jimmyjams said:
The problem in the past was that if the actual Tour winner didn't also win the climber's jersey, he ended up pretty close and conversely the winner finished pretty high up on the GC. It was almost just like a variation on the GC. But it is supposed to be its own competition.Pross said:
Yeah, that's been devalued for years.inseine said:
Same problem with the climbers jerseyPross said:It would feel like a bit of a travesty if Sagan took green by being the best rider over the first half of hilly stages before dropping back and finishing with the sprinters. Bennett, WVA and even Hirschi are more deserving assuming they go the full distance.
I would upgrade cat 3 and 4 climbs (i.e. give them more points). This might make the competition, and the stages with the smaller climbs, more competitive, since those aspiring to win the polka dot jersey could then definitely not wait until the hors cat and cat 1 climbs, or a MTF, where one or two good days would leapfrog them over riders who had competed all the cat 3 and cat 4 climbs. After all, 70% of climbs are of the lower categories - the winner of the climber's jersey should be contesting them too.
Don’t think it’s realistic to expect anything else. It’s a different competition so it’ll have different tactics
But there were occasionally others before him who did similar, several in the 1970s, Vallet in 1982, even Claveyrolat in 1990, who was a competent climber but not the best, used the same tactic.0 -
Is this not exactly what David M does, he fortells possible tactics and explains them as they are happening. I love his input, possibly best sports expert broadcasting just now.TheBigBean said:
I'm fighting a losing battle. "Expert" pundits have contaminated every sport.mididoctors said:
Send them a strongly worded email ...TheBigBean said:
"If WvA is allowed to go for the finish" . He's gone for every other one. Why wouldn't he? Why ask the Bora DS this after the usual five minute introductionary ramble to a question? What about asking about the main threats he sees today - that might elicit an interesting answer.mididoctors said:
At least we have choice ... Imagine only having duffers for years on end punctuated with suitcase of courage sherwen and legget .. I think hours of listening to anyone is grating after a while truth be toldTheBigBean said:The ITV commentary team annoys me.
I found it really interesting when Strauss retired and joined the Sky cricket commentary team. He was able to explain the tactics rather than declare them wrong.
Anyway, I'll stop ranting!0 -
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Tony Martin drilling it on the front now0
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Anyone else getting "massive crash" vibes here?0
