TdF 2020 Alaphillipe and Pinot

jimmyjams

RichN95. said:

The problem is there are six French teams in this race, five with mostly French riders. ASO have indulged them too much for too long.
They'll always get a Tour slot, the sponsors will keep stumping up the cash, so the riders aren't under pressure to perform. Plus three of the teams have been run by the same three people for nearly a quarter of a century with little success.

Don't all national tours sometimes include a noticeable percentage of home teams? (And anyway surely there are only 5 French teams this year, 3 with every right to be there?)
I quite like that French teams have kept to mostly home riders, keeping the French spirit. It was something many people liked about Euskatel too, with their Basque emphasis, and which Spanish, Belgian and Italian teams generally still do.

Cash is a main problem French teams have in that their sponsors don't actually 'stump up' that much compared to what a dozen other teams get from sponsors – Ag2r's budget used to be only a third that of Sky, that of Cofidis and FDJ even less (though the FDJ budget has gone up a little since Groupama joined in).

specialgueststar

Disappointed? The day they won the stage, leading the KOM , Martin attacks the front group and Bardet takes a bit of time on the line they are 3rd and 4th on GC Barguil is working well with Quintana on a French team..Patcher. Gaudu coming up. Pinot banged his back but I know it's more than that here. That waiting for the next big thing is embedded from the late 90's when they generally held the post Festina line and others didn't. But they've kept their structure ( including the feeder teams and races) and integrity and that's more sporting and important. Disappointed? Non

davidof

orraloon said:

Why did Alaphilippe pull that 4 sec break away stunt today? Surely you know your state and ride accordingly? Didn't even have the camera bike full on at the time.

According to his missus he wanted to see if he could drop Yates and retake yellow. He was frustrated to be in the GC group but not able to go anywhere. When he saw Yates was still hanging on he decided Yellow wasn't a reasonable aim for him and he decided to take it easy, leave some clear blue water with the GC riders so they would let him go on a break for another stage win.

pinno

Maybe it's simply a case of the media piling on expectations on JA. I mean, when Sagan wore yellow, no-one ever suggested that he was a challenger for the overall.

Alaphillipe has all the attributes to make a great classics rider over different terrain. He's punchy, can climb and can sprint.

iainf72

gsk82 said:

RichN95. said:

DeadCalm said:

In fairness, Sivakov is more French than Froome is British. Sivakov was born in France and has (and continues) to pay French taxes.

Definitely. He's about as Russian as Froome is British though.

I've got a mate who moved to Oz a few years ago. His son will never live in Britain, but he's bringing him up as British and as far as I'm concerned he'll always be British

And he will be. He'll also more than likely consider himself British too.

Froome can't win. Can't be Britsh, can't be Kenyan.

DeVlaeminck

gsk82 said:

RichN95. said:

DeadCalm said:

In fairness, Sivakov is more French than Froome is British. Sivakov was born in France and has (and continues) to pay French taxes.

Definitely. He's about as Russian as Froome is British though.

I've got a mate who moved to Oz a few years ago. His son will never live in Britain, but he's bringing him up as British and as far as I'm concerned he'll always be British

I wonder if his son will consider himself British ?

Matti66

iainf72 said:

gsk82 said:

RichN95. said:

DeadCalm said:

In fairness, Sivakov is more French than Froome is British. Sivakov was born in France and has (and continues) to pay French taxes.

Definitely. He's about as Russian as Froome is British though.

I've got a mate who moved to Oz a few years ago. His son will never live in Britain, but he's bringing him up as British and as far as I'm concerned he'll always be British

And he will be. He'll also more than likely consider himself British too.

Froome can't win. Can't be Britsh, can't be Kenyan.

With some. Yes thats true , but there will be Equally lots who see him as British who grew up in Kenya . Plenty of English born and bred identify as Irish or Scottish / Welsh I don't see any difference with Froome , it’ s just a stick to Troll with .

rick_chasey

iainf72 said:

gsk82 said:

RichN95. said:

DeadCalm said:

In fairness, Sivakov is more French than Froome is British. Sivakov was born in France and has (and continues) to pay French taxes.

Definitely. He's about as Russian as Froome is British though.

I've got a mate who moved to Oz a few years ago. His son will never live in Britain, but he's bringing him up as British and as far as I'm concerned he'll always be British

And he will be. He'll also more than likely consider himself British too.

Froome can't win. Can't be Britsh, can't be Kenyan.

Always the same.

iainf72

DeVlaeminck said:

gsk82 said:

RichN95. said:

DeadCalm said:

In fairness, Sivakov is more French than Froome is British. Sivakov was born in France and has (and continues) to pay French taxes.

Definitely. He's about as Russian as Froome is British though.

I've got a mate who moved to Oz a few years ago. His son will never live in Britain, but he's bringing him up as British and as far as I'm concerned he'll always be British

I wonder if his son will consider himself British ?

Most likely will. yes.

I was born in another country to Scottish parents and only moved to the UK in my mid 20's but I've always considered myself British. Speaking to others in a similar situation it's quite often true, but I think it might depend where you were born.

Pross

Wrong thread again!

jimmyjams

iainf72 said:

DeVlaeminck said:

gsk82 said:

RichN95. said:

DeadCalm said:

In fairness, Sivakov is more French than Froome is British. Sivakov was born in France and has (and continues) to pay French taxes.

Definitely. He's about as Russian as Froome is British though.

I've got a mate who moved to Oz a few years ago. His son will never live in Britain, but he's bringing him up as British and as far as I'm concerned he'll always be British

I wonder if his son will consider himself British ?

Most likely will. yes.

I was born in another country to Scottish parents and only moved to the UK in my mid 20's but I've always considered myself British. Speaking to others in a similar situation it's quite often true, but I think it might depend where you were born.

My daughter did as her PhD topic how the children of parents immigrating to any land may have a confused sense of identity and thus what social problems may evolve. She was primarily looking at working class families and also where the families don't move back to their origin, even if they once intended to do so (so her conclusions wouldn't perhaps apply to you, Iainf72).

But I'd say that the way gsk82's friend is bringing up his children (to be british even though they will likely never live in Britain) will likely backfire. In his case (UK and Australia) there is culturally less difference than between Australia and some other countries, but evenso I think most people like to have an association with where they were born.

RichN95.

To add to this. I have a friend who is friends with Froome's brothers - went to school with them. He says they are Kenyan unless it's convenient to be British.

specialgueststar

What's all this got To do with anything?

shirley_basso

Siakov isn't french or something

DeVlaeminck

iainf72 said:

DeVlaeminck said:

gsk82 said:

RichN95. said:

DeadCalm said:

In fairness, Sivakov is more French than Froome is British. Sivakov was born in France and has (and continues) to pay French taxes.

Definitely. He's about as Russian as Froome is British though.

I've got a mate who moved to Oz a few years ago. His son will never live in Britain, but he's bringing him up as British and as far as I'm concerned he'll always be British

I wonder if his son will consider himself British ?

Most likely will. yes.

I was born in another country to Scottish parents and only moved to the UK in my mid 20's but I've always considered myself British. Speaking to others in a similar situation it's quite often true, but I think it might depend where you were born.

Yes I think there may be a difference between being born in Australia of British parents and being born say in Kenya just for reasons of language, culture even often predominant ethnicity (no I'm not assuming all Brits are white).

I suspect most people born in Australia of British parents don't consider themselves British - my cousins over there certainly don't.

iainf72

jimmyjams said:

iainf72 said:

DeVlaeminck said:

gsk82 said:

RichN95. said:

DeadCalm said:

In fairness, Sivakov is more French than Froome is British. Sivakov was born in France and has (and continues) to pay French taxes.

Definitely. He's about as Russian as Froome is British though.

I've got a mate who moved to Oz a few years ago. His son will never live in Britain, but he's bringing him up as British and as far as I'm concerned he'll always be British

I wonder if his son will consider himself British ?

Most likely will. yes.

I was born in another country to Scottish parents and only moved to the UK in my mid 20's but I've always considered myself British. Speaking to others in a similar situation it's quite often true, but I think it might depend where you were born.

My daughter did as her PhD topic how the children of parents immigrating to any land may have a confused sense of identity and thus what social problems may evolve. She was primarily looking at working class families and also where the families don't move back to their origin, even if they once intended to do so (so her conclusions wouldn't perhaps apply to you, Iainf72).

But I'd say that the way gsk82's friend is bringing up his children (to be british even though they will likely never live in Britain) will likely backfire. In his case (UK and Australia) there is culturally less difference than between Australia and some other countries, but evenso I think most people like to have an association with where they were born.

Interesting topic your daughter looked at I think. And I think it clearly does cause problems in some cases. In my case, I knew South Africa wasn't for me from an early age and if I hadn't ended up in the UK, it would've been somewhere else.

I think if your British and you move somewhere, your children will experience a lot of upbringing that culturally references what they know and that plays into their identity. I've had this discussion with my in-laws a bit. "what sort of things did your mum cook?" and then are surprised when the answer is "mince and tatties"

rick_chasey

iainf72 said:

jimmyjams said:

iainf72 said:

DeVlaeminck said:

gsk82 said:

RichN95. said:

DeadCalm said:

In fairness, Sivakov is more French than Froome is British. Sivakov was born in France and has (and continues) to pay French taxes.

Definitely. He's about as Russian as Froome is British though.

I've got a mate who moved to Oz a few years ago. His son will never live in Britain, but he's bringing him up as British and as far as I'm concerned he'll always be British

I wonder if his son will consider himself British ?

Most likely will. yes.

I was born in another country to Scottish parents and only moved to the UK in my mid 20's but I've always considered myself British. Speaking to others in a similar situation it's quite often true, but I think it might depend where you were born.

My daughter did as her PhD topic how the children of parents immigrating to any land may have a confused sense of identity and thus what social problems may evolve. She was primarily looking at working class families and also where the families don't move back to their origin, even if they once intended to do so (so her conclusions wouldn't perhaps apply to you, Iainf72).

But I'd say that the way gsk82's friend is bringing up his children (to be british even though they will likely never live in Britain) will likely backfire. In his case (UK and Australia) there is culturally less difference than between Australia and some other countries, but evenso I think most people like to have an association with where they were born.

Interesting topic your daughter looked at I think. And I think it clearly does cause problems in some cases. In my case, I knew South Africa wasn't for me from an early age and if I hadn't ended up in the UK, it would've been somewhere else.

I think if your British and you move somewhere, your children will experience a lot of upbringing that culturally references what they know and that plays into their identity. I've had this discussion with my in-laws a bit. "what sort of things did your mum cook?" and then are surprised when the answer is "mince and tatties"

You do sort of feel an outsider on both sides of the fence, or at least, I certainly do.

My house was very much the Netherlands despite being in the UK - that was the language we spoke, the telly we had on (until I was over 12 or so) and so was the food.

So Ned feels very much like home, only, I'm treated like the Brit when I'm there; to the point where I often end up in this ridiculous charade where I speak Dutch to them and they'll speak English to me.

And ultimately because i never properly lived there, there's always nuances of the culture I just miss. I wasn't educated there, etc.