Prince Andrew, the pedo and corroborated allegations

2

Comments

  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,615
    It doesn’t bother you he’s mates with a convicted nonce and sex trafficker?

    He’s got enormous privilege and the state foots the bill for his antics.
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 25,750
    edited December 2019
    No. It doesn’t.
    Up to the point where it is proven that he participated in illegal activities. Then the gloves are off.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • pblakeney said:

    pblakeney said:


    What have I convicted him of? Being a prince and being mates with and staying over with a convicted nonce?

    Come on.

    That's not biased. That's fact. He has literally done this and went on TV to say so.

    The trouble that none of that is actually illegal.
    Who's saying it is?

    Christ. What I am saying is, as a prince he represents the state and with his literal privilege comes responsibility, and so he is being rightfully getting pressed on why he was doing it and what that says about his judgement.
    Sorry, but until there is evidence produced in court to illegal proceedings then I don't give two flying figs.
    Once there is, bring down the full force of the court.
    You should explain your theory about “no court = no wrongdoing” to Harry Dunn’s parents
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,615
    pblakeney said:

    No. It doesn’t.
    Up to the point where it is proven that he participated in illegal activities. Then the gloves are off.

    Shame Prince Andrew didn't have the same attitude to the convicted nonce Epstein, isn't it?
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 25,750

    pblakeney said:

    pblakeney said:


    What have I convicted him of? Being a prince and being mates with and staying over with a convicted nonce?

    Come on.

    That's not biased. That's fact. He has literally done this and went on TV to say so.

    The trouble that none of that is actually illegal.
    Who's saying it is?

    Christ. What I am saying is, as a prince he represents the state and with his literal privilege comes responsibility, and so he is being rightfully getting pressed on why he was doing it and what that says about his judgement.
    Sorry, but until there is evidence produced in court to illegal proceedings then I don't give two flying figs.
    Once there is, bring down the full force of the court.
    You should explain your theory about “no court = no wrongdoing” to Harry Dunn’s parents
    That’s different. The police wanted to proceed but the government intervened. And continue to do so.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 25,750

    pblakeney said:

    No. It doesn’t.
    Up to the point where it is proven that he participated in illegal activities. Then the gloves are off.

    Shame Prince Andrew didn't have the same attitude to the convicted nonce Epstein, isn't it?
    Still a moral argument which has no place in law. By gloves off, I meant the law.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • pblakeney said:

    pblakeney said:

    pblakeney said:


    What have I convicted him of? Being a prince and being mates with and staying over with a convicted nonce?

    Come on.

    That's not biased. That's fact. He has literally done this and went on TV to say so.

    The trouble that none of that is actually illegal.
    Who's saying it is?

    Christ. What I am saying is, as a prince he represents the state and with his literal privilege comes responsibility, and so he is being rightfully getting pressed on why he was doing it and what that says about his judgement.
    Sorry, but until there is evidence produced in court to illegal proceedings then I don't give two flying figs.
    Once there is, bring down the full force of the court.
    You should explain your theory about “no court = no wrongdoing” to Harry Dunn’s parents
    That’s different. The police wanted to proceed but the government intervened. And continue to do so.
    I hate the royals so much I have not read much about this, but my understanding is that he committed no crimes in the UK. There is a good chance that he committed crimes in the USA and if a member of the public would be grabbed when he next landed in there.

    It was fairly recently that the UK changed the law so that you could be prosecuted for having sex with a minor overseas even if it was not illegal in the country where the crime (?) was committed. Could I check that you had no problem with men going overseas to have sex with children? and if so what is the difference? is it the status of the offender? age of the victim? gender of the victim?

    Same with trafficking, do you see anything wrong with the asian gangs in northern cities? would it be OK if they were members of royalty in a foreign country?
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 25,750
    If it was up to me then all these activities would be illegal worldwide and no one would be above the law.
    It is not up to me.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • haydenm
    haydenm Posts: 2,997
    Without going into too much detail I don't think Epstein was technically a 'pedophile' but it's probably not worth getting into that, and I also don't want to google it on the work network...
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,615
    edited December 2019
    haydenm said:

    Without going into too much detail I don't think Epstein was technically a 'pedophile' but it's probably not worth getting into that, and I also don't want to google it on the work network...

    Err he is a nonce. Officially. Pleased guilty to sexually abusing a 14 yr old.
  • haydenm
    haydenm Posts: 2,997

    haydenm said:

    Without going into too much detail I don't think Epstein was technically a 'pedophile' but it's probably not worth getting into that, and I also don't want to google it on the work network...

    Err he is a nonce. Officially. Pleased guilty to sexually abusing a 14 yr old.
    Pedophile has quite a specific physiological definition, nonce probably doesn't. There is another word for being attracted to people between the ages of 14 and 17 but I can't remember what it is. Doesn't change a thing legally, I just like being a pain in the backside on internet forums...
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    So, basically Rick, you're saying that the Royals shouldn't be friendly with convicted criminals. How far down should that go? Who is allowed to be friends with criminals?

    In this country, once your sentence is spent, you're regarded as having done your time. In my mind, there is nothing wrong with being friends with a convicted criminal - providing you don't participate in, encourage or endorse their illegal actions (assuming you have knowledge of them - reporting them if they continue) - so, if you assume PA just had a few drinks / meals with Epstein then nothing wrong there.

    Obviously the accusations are far greater and PA is at best, a bit of a pillock to have allowed himself to be put in that situation.
    As I said earlier - for the alleged incident in this country - it's up to any law enforcement to prove that a) the incident took place and b) she wasn't willing or she was coerced into the act - bearing in mind, the alleged incident took place when "Just Say No" was still in reference to school kids taking drugs.

  • webboo
    webboo Posts: 6,087
    slowbike said:

    So, basically Rick, you're saying that the Royals shouldn't be friendly with convicted criminals. How far down should that go? Who is allowed to be friends with criminals?

    In this country, once your sentence is spent, you're regarded as having done your time. In my mind, there is nothing wrong with being friends with a convicted criminal - providing you don't participate in, encourage or endorse their illegal actions (assuming you have knowledge of them - reporting them if they continue) - so, if you assume PA just had a few drinks / meals with Epstein then nothing wrong there.

    Not strictly true certain offences are never spent. I.e.Sex Offenders registrar.
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,615
    Not all crimes are equal, nor are all convicts equal, nor is all context equal.
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498
    webboo said:

    slowbike said:

    So, basically Rick, you're saying that the Royals shouldn't be friendly with convicted criminals. How far down should that go? Who is allowed to be friends with criminals?

    In this country, once your sentence is spent, you're regarded as having done your time. In my mind, there is nothing wrong with being friends with a convicted criminal - providing you don't participate in, encourage or endorse their illegal actions (assuming you have knowledge of them - reporting them if they continue) - so, if you assume PA just had a few drinks / meals with Epstein then nothing wrong there.

    Not strictly true certain offences are never spent. I.e.Sex Offenders registrar.
    SOR isn't an indication of a current offender - it's there to be a record of the whereabouts and details of someone who has been ordered to be placed on the register.

    If an offender is released on licence then I'd agree - their sentence isn't spent.
  • slowbike
    slowbike Posts: 8,498

    Not all crimes are equal, nor are all convicts equal, nor is all context equal.

    ? Meaningless waffle ...
  • hopkinb
    hopkinb Posts: 7,129
    edited December 2019
    haydenm said:

    There is another word for being attracted to people between the ages of 14 and 17 but I can't remember what it is. Doesn't change a thing legally, I just like being a pain in the backside on internet forums...

    Ephebophile.

    Nonce is prison slang for any sex offender, though particularly one guilty of offences against children.

    Epstein was an ephebophiliac, and also a nonce. At the upper age range of ephebophilia, you wouldn't necessarily end up as a nonce, though depending on your own age, you probably wouldn't be socially acceptable/popular when stepping out with your "friend".
  • haydenm
    haydenm Posts: 2,997
    hopkinb said:

    haydenm said:

    There is another word for being attracted to people between the ages of 14 and 17 but I can't remember what it is. Doesn't change a thing legally, I just like being a pain in the backside on internet forums...

    Ephebophile.

    Nonce is prison slang for any sex offender, though particularly one guilty of offences against children.

    Epstein was an ephebophiliac, and also a nonce. At the upper age range of ephebophilia, you wouldn't necessarily end up as a nonce, though depending on your own age, you probably wouldn't be socially acceptable/popular when stepping out with your "friend".
    That's the badger. There's lots of legal internet sites with '18 year old' categories and I doubt many of the people watching are 18 themselves...
  • john80
    john80 Posts: 2,965
    I have got to laugh at the hang em and flog them brigade on here and there flip flopping. Have any of these girls reported a crime against them in the USA carried out by Andrew? The idea that knowing Epstein or spending any time with him makes you an accessory to anything he does is a bit far fetched. I have a lot more time for people that report the crime and go through the difficulties of a police investigation than those whose first complaint appears to be a media outlet.

    Since the beginning of time plenty of 17 year olds have got laid. Rich men and good looking women have been doing the manipulating since time began.
  • haydenm
    haydenm Posts: 2,997
    john80 said:

    I have got to laugh at the hang em and flog them brigade on here and there flip flopping. Have any of these girls reported a crime against them in the USA carried out by Andrew? The idea that knowing Epstein or spending any time with him makes you an accessory to anything he does is a bit far fetched. I have a lot more time for people that report the crime and go through the difficulties of a police investigation than those whose first complaint appears to be a media outlet.

    Since the beginning of time plenty of 17 year olds have got laid. Rich men and good looking women have been doing the manipulating since time began.

    What Epstein did was a bit more than 17 year olds getting fingered behind the bike sheds at the sixth form prom...

    The first complaints weren't in the media, the number of girls who reported him to the police are thought to be the tip of the iceberg.

    I agree that knowing someone who then commits a crime doesn't make you an accessory but staying at their house after they were convicted doesn't look great for PR. It would be pretty bad if you were innocent and one of your mates was convicted then everyone came out against you. I probably wouldn't hang around with them after though personally
  • john80
    john80 Posts: 2,965
    haydenm said:

    john80 said:

    I have got to laugh at the hang em and flog them brigade on here and there flip flopping. Have any of these girls reported a crime against them in the USA carried out by Andrew? The idea that knowing Epstein or spending any time with him makes you an accessory to anything he does is a bit far fetched. I have a lot more time for people that report the crime and go through the difficulties of a police investigation than those whose first complaint appears to be a media outlet.

    Since the beginning of time plenty of 17 year olds have got laid. Rich men and good looking women have been doing the manipulating since time began.

    What Epstein did was a bit more than 17 year olds getting fingered behind the bike sheds at the sixth form prom...

    The first complaints weren't in the media, the number of girls who reported him to the police are thought to be the tip of the iceberg.

    I agree that knowing someone who then commits a crime doesn't make you an accessory but staying at their house after they were convicted doesn't look great for PR. It would be pretty bad if you were innocent and one of your mates was convicted then everyone came out against you. I probably wouldn't hang around with them after though personally
    If i had the time i would dig through the syria thread and see how many of those would not hang out with epstein but would get those in syria back home because presumably they are a better bet to hang out with. Selective causes i suppose.
  • john80 said:

    haydenm said:

    john80 said:

    I have got to laugh at the hang em and flog them brigade on here and there flip flopping. Have any of these girls reported a crime against them in the USA carried out by Andrew? The idea that knowing Epstein or spending any time with him makes you an accessory to anything he does is a bit far fetched. I have a lot more time for people that report the crime and go through the difficulties of a police investigation than those whose first complaint appears to be a media outlet.

    Since the beginning of time plenty of 17 year olds have got laid. Rich men and good looking women have been doing the manipulating since time began.

    What Epstein did was a bit more than 17 year olds getting fingered behind the bike sheds at the sixth form prom...

    The first complaints weren't in the media, the number of girls who reported him to the police are thought to be the tip of the iceberg.

    I agree that knowing someone who then commits a crime doesn't make you an accessory but staying at their house after they were convicted doesn't look great for PR. It would be pretty bad if you were innocent and one of your mates was convicted then everyone came out against you. I probably wouldn't hang around with them after though personally
    If i had the time i would dig through the syria thread and see how many of those would not hang out with epstein but would get those in syria back home because presumably they are a better bet to hang out with. Selective causes i suppose.
    What on earth are you on about?
  • haydenm
    haydenm Posts: 2,997
    Jeremy.89 said:

    john80 said:

    haydenm said:

    john80 said:

    I have got to laugh at the hang em and flog them brigade on here and there flip flopping. Have any of these girls reported a crime against them in the USA carried out by Andrew? The idea that knowing Epstein or spending any time with him makes you an accessory to anything he does is a bit far fetched. I have a lot more time for people that report the crime and go through the difficulties of a police investigation than those whose first complaint appears to be a media outlet.

    Since the beginning of time plenty of 17 year olds have got laid. Rich men and good looking women have been doing the manipulating since time began.

    What Epstein did was a bit more than 17 year olds getting fingered behind the bike sheds at the sixth form prom...

    The first complaints weren't in the media, the number of girls who reported him to the police are thought to be the tip of the iceberg.

    I agree that knowing someone who then commits a crime doesn't make you an accessory but staying at their house after they were convicted doesn't look great for PR. It would be pretty bad if you were innocent and one of your mates was convicted then everyone came out against you. I probably wouldn't hang around with them after though personally
    If i had the time i would dig through the syria thread and see how many of those would not hang out with epstein but would get those in syria back home because presumably they are a better bet to hang out with. Selective causes i suppose.
    What on earth are you on about?
    This. I'd take that teenager back so she can face UK justice for breaking UK law, something which some 'burn her' simpletons just can't get their head around. Prosecuting terrorists and being mates with known sexual offenders aren't really the same thing...
  • rick_chasey
    rick_chasey Posts: 72,615
    John has form on topics like this.

    He's also of the 'if you wear a skirt and are out on your own you're asking for it' genre of men.
  • Good job there's no thread on the violence perpetrated against women in Uttar Pradesh, India, Pakistan and other parts of that region right now. He'd probably froth at the mouth getting his comments out. Like that Bollywood film producer who made those tweets telling women to give their rapists a condom and not to resist so they won't hurt you.

    Is that too far off topic?
  • The Rookie
    The Rookie Posts: 27,812
    edited December 2019
    Let's not forget all the 'convincing' evidence that came from 'Nick'..... how much did that cost the Met police in wasted investigations and now compensation?

    All those describing anything about the UK police and laws in the UK, clearly know so little about the allegations they should really have refrained from making a total 4r5e of themselves by posting.

    THE ALLEGATIONS CONCERNED WHAT HAPPENED IN THE USA TO A US CITIZEN.
    Currently riding a Whyte T130C, X0 drivetrain, Magura Trail brakes converted to mixed wheel size (homebuilt wheels) with 140mm Fox 34 Rhythm and RP23 suspension. 12.2Kg.
  • DeVlaeminck
    DeVlaeminck Posts: 8,738
    Maybe I'm wrong but I thought at least one woman has alleged she was coerced into having sex with Andrew in the UK?

    In any case this is a bit more than him using his wealth and status to pull much younger women - that's how some of you are presenting it. Epstein has been convicted of some serious offences and there are plenty saying that was the tip of the ice berg. Andrew has been accused of being party to that and I think any neutral would look at the evidence and conclude it's likely she's telling the truth. Why else would he have stayed at the house, he claims not to have been a great friend, this "too honourable" excuse is utterly unconvincing, I mean come on it may not be beyond reasonable doubt but it looks extremely suspicious and his tv interview only made it appear more so.
    [Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]
  • haydenm
    haydenm Posts: 2,997
    He couldn't possibly have done it, he was visiting the world famous Salisbury Cathedral with its 123m tall spire that day.
  • david7m
    david7m Posts: 636
    Dont forget he cant sweat.
  • john80 said:

    I have got to laugh at the hang em and flog them brigade on here and there flip flopping. Have any of these girls reported a crime against them in the USA carried out by Andrew? The idea that knowing Epstein or spending any time with him makes you an accessory to anything he does is a bit far fetched. I have a lot more time for people that report the crime and go through the difficulties of a police investigation than those whose first complaint appears to be a media outlet.

    Since the beginning of time plenty of 17 year olds have got laid. Rich men and good looking women have been doing the manipulating since time began.

    Yeah, nobody remembers the Crimson Duchess now.