Is a creaky bike a defect ?
Comments
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thecycleclinic wrote:Great if the rotor bb worked for you bit that's a sample of one.
A thread fit bb is required. My experience of rotor Bob's is the bearing wear fast. I have got 4000k. Out of there expensive ceramic bbs and the last 1000km was on worn bearings. They are shite. The bb in my mtb is not much better.
Number if years is irrelevant and I have noticed many people think the bearings are fine if the cranks spin freely and that's not so. A worn braid g grumbles and can be heard. Bearing drag when there is no load may be very low. Apply load though and it very high and that's what noisey bearings that spin freely with no load should be replaced. What do I know though, I only studied engineering.
I hardly think that's good enough is it! Completely irrelevant field :? I think OP should get his BB shell threaded and put one of me in there.0 -
Bearings are designed to be interference on the shaft and clearance on the static outer. On a bike it's done rather opposite, into a thin walled aluminium housing. That's why they creak.ShimanoBottomBracket wrote:thecycleclinic wrote:Great if the rotor bb worked for you bit that's a sample of one.
A thread fit bb is required. My experience of rotor Bob's is the bearing wear fast. I have got 4000k. Out of there expensive ceramic bbs and the last 1000km was on worn bearings. They are shite. The bb in my mtb is not much better.
Number if years is irrelevant and I have noticed many people think the bearings are fine if the cranks spin freely and that's not so. A worn braid g grumbles and can be heard. Bearing drag when there is no load may be very low. Apply load though and it very high and that's what noisey bearings that spin freely with no load should be replaced. What do I know though, I only studied engineering.
I hardly think that's good enough is it! Completely irrelevant field :? I think OP should get his BB shell threaded and put one of me in there.0 -
I've read that italian bike brands have the highest margin, it is an export driven industry which sells poorly in its own country where the average price of bikes sold is very low. A quick google of Kuota bikes brings up information about the bike frames being made in the far east. In the past it was by a company called Martec and a quick google of their quality brings up some forum responses stating poor quality carbon fibre frames. Today it could be a different factory maybe Cambodia or maybe Bangladesh you just don't know when the brand is effectively an importer. I guess my point is, it is quite possible that bike is inferior quality to a bike maybe half that price or even less. It's pretty much a lifestyle brand possibly selling on heritage.
I've watched a few durianrider youtube videos recently where he bought a frame directly from the factory for about $500 austrailian dollars but was aware of an importer selling the same frame for about $3000 and had proof that they were the exactly the same frame.
I just feel you need to be wary out there. There is always someone trying to make a huge margin. I've read postings where people have bought Planet X carbon frames and forks for £300 and used an older or cheap donor bike to create a final carbon fibre bike for something like £600 and the bike has been sub 9kg maybe sub 8kg and fault free.
I wouldn't spend £3,500 on a road bike even if I was a billionaire but if I did I would expect it to be near perfect and expect to get a wonderful retail experience. £3,500 is huge money just for pretty much a frame and a couple of wheels. I personally would struggle to justify spending more than £1,000 to be honest unless I was an amazing professional cyclist who really needed those minimal gains.
When I pretended to be a buyer of carbon fibre frames about 3 years ago I was quoted about £80 each for carbon fibre frames from open moulds. That was factory door price before you add on all the extra costs of importing etc. I have no idea if that was cheap or expensive as I only asked out of curiosity and didn't get multiple quotes. Nowadays carbon fibre frames are coming out of countries like Bangladesh with even lower labour rates and no EU anti-dumping additional taxes.
My point is they put a huge margin on these frames so customer service should be amazing.0 -
Bonzo Banana wrote:I wouldn't spend £3,500 on a road bike even if I was a billionaire
Nor me. I'd spend loads more than that.2020/2021/2022 Metric Century Challenge Winner0 -
Marketing taxes salaries shipping storage returns administration Q A sales profit.0
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CarbonClem wrote:Bonzo Banana wrote:I wouldn't spend £3,500 on a road bike even if I was a billionaire
Nor me. I'd spend loads more than that.
And get a broken Chris Froome thrown in for free.0 -
Bonzo Banana wrote:Nowadays carbon fibre frames are coming out of countries like Bangladesh with even lower labour rates and no EU anti-dumping additional taxes.
Who is making CF frames in Bangladesh..?0 -
thecycleclinic wrote:That means the shop has to measure things like bore I'd and cup o.d.
I don't work in a bike shop but tolerances of press fit are pretty tight (+0.025/-0mm) and I doubt your average mechanic would have a micrometer capable of working to that.
Besides which, using a micrometer is easy compared to getting a "touch" on an internal bore.
I'd have more confidence that the BB is more accurate than the frame
But what do I know, I only studied engineering and have been in it for 26 years...Advocate of disc brakes.0 -
Quite a lot of willy waving going on. Not much different from my opinion is better than your opinion because I race and you don't.
Isn't it fairly well established that press fit BBs can be problematic and represent a significant disimprovement over threads, for the tiniest of supposed advantages?
Not entirely sure how this helps the OP, other than he now knows who to ask about any engineering problems.0 -
Yeah, I recently replaced the barrings in my Praxis BB30 Bottom Bracket because of creaking. Then went out on it last weekend and if anything, the creaking was worse. I then tested with my winter wheels and long story short, it turns out it was my skewers. :oops:Kingstonian wrote:The problem with bikes is it can be so bloody difficult to track down where a squeak or clunk is coming from. Case in point is that I had a very feint squeak in one of my bikes, I looked at chain, cranks, bottom bracket, rear cassette and still couldn't track it down, eventually after much searching it turned out to be the rear hub which needed servicing.
@OP, do you have an spares or know anyone with parts you could test with, just to rule out other causes? I know you shouldn't have to do this, but you aren't getting much luck with the shop and at least you might be able to narrow it down for them.0 -
My last comment was sightly tongue in cheek...
The rest stands.Advocate of disc brakes.0 -
Bike is at Kuota HQ for review and repair.
Don't think I will ever be happy with it now.
It's a C2w bike - right now I feel as soon as it legally mine it will be up for sale.
Employer wants an independent inspection when it gets back to me.
Loads more gone on - than I am prepared to post here.0 -
How did you manage to get a £3500 bike on the C2W scheme?0
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You've always been able to, but most companies couldn't be bothered with the extra paperwork.Flasher wrote:How did you manage to get a £3500 bike on the C2W scheme?
The employer's limit has been removed now, only last month though.Cyclescheme wrote:The Cycle to Work scheme has had a default limit of £1,000 since it began 20 years ago. The reason for this isn’t the scheme itself, which doesn’t specify a maximum value, but rather consumer credit rules.
Cycle to Work is a tax-exempt loan scheme. Any employer offering it must be covered by a consumer credit licence authorised by the Financial Conduct Authority (FCA). Most employers don’t have a licence of their own. Instead, they use the Cycle to Work Group Credit Licence, issued for exactly this purpose by the Government. Its limit? You guessed it: £1,000.
https://www.cyclescheme.co.uk/community ... -scheme-bi0 -
Imposter wrote:Bonzo Banana wrote:Nowadays carbon fibre frames are coming out of countries like Bangladesh with even lower labour rates and no EU anti-dumping additional taxes.
Who is making CF frames in Bangladesh..?
A company called Meghna has been making them since 2014.
https://www.bike-eu.com/sales-trends/ni ... sh-1019466
Seems to be favoured by some European brands mainly because of no EU dumping additional duties. Started with low end bikes, moved to mid price bikes and now looks like high end bikes will be made there. A race to the bottom as always in the pursuit of a profit margin. When the Bangladesh workforce become highly skilled and experienced in a few years and want a higher wage they will start making them somewhere else more cheaply. Bangladesh clothing has gone up in price due to strikes and wage demands etc and some production has moved to Sri Lanka. Possibly bike manufacturing may follow.
https://www.thedailystar.net/business/n ... es-1632277
I guess that is why I'm a big fan of Giant, they are an actual bike manufacturer not just assembler and they are still manufacturing in Taiwan (high end) and mainland China (mid and entry level) and have resisted moving to Cambodia, Vietnam, Bangladesh etc, so far at least. Take Halfords bikes which I'm not knocking as great value but their Carrera models used to be made in Taiwan, then mainland China, then Vietnam and currently Cambodia and no doubt when Halfords believe they are of sufficient quality will move to Bangladesh or Sri Lanka. They probably already use Bangladesh or Sri Lanka for their Apollo range.0 -
Bonzo Banana wrote:Imposter wrote:Bonzo Banana wrote:Nowadays carbon fibre frames are coming out of countries like Bangladesh with even lower labour rates and no EU anti-dumping additional taxes.
Who is making CF frames in Bangladesh..?
A company called Meghna has been making them since 2014.
https://www.bike-eu.com/sales-trends/ni ... sh-1019466
Seems to be favoured by some European brands mainly because of no EU dumping additional duties. Started with low end bikes, moved to mid price bikes and now looks like high end bikes will be made there. A race to the bottom as always in the pursuit of a profit margin. When the Bangladesh workforce become highly skilled and experienced in a few years and want a higher wage they will start making them somewhere else more cheaply. Bangladesh clothing has gone up in price due to strikes and wage demands etc and some production has moved to Sri Lanka. Possibly bike manufacturing may follow.
https://www.thedailystar.net/business/n ... es-1632277
I guess that is why I'm a big fan of Giant, they are an actual bike manufacturer not just assembler and they are still manufacturing in Taiwan (high end) and mainland China (mid and entry level) and have resisted moving to Cambodia, Vietnam, Bangladesh etc, so far at least. Take Halfords bikes which I'm not knocking as great value but their Carrera models used to be made in Taiwan, then mainland China, then Vietnam and currently Cambodia and no doubt when Halfords believe they are of sufficient quality will move to Bangladesh or Sri Lanka. They probably already use Bangladesh or Sri Lanka for their Apollo range.
Yep I will be shifting to Giant once I can - carbon defy looks a nice bike - I almost brought it last time - you live and learn.0 -
kingrollo wrote:Bonzo Banana wrote:Imposter wrote:Bonzo Banana wrote:Nowadays carbon fibre frames are coming out of countries like Bangladesh with even lower labour rates and no EU anti-dumping additional taxes.
Who is making CF frames in Bangladesh..?
A company called Meghna has been making them since 2014.
https://www.bike-eu.com/sales-trends/ni ... sh-1019466
Seems to be favoured by some European brands mainly because of no EU dumping additional duties. Started with low end bikes, moved to mid price bikes and now looks like high end bikes will be made there. A race to the bottom as always in the pursuit of a profit margin. When the Bangladesh workforce become highly skilled and experienced in a few years and want a higher wage they will start making them somewhere else more cheaply. Bangladesh clothing has gone up in price due to strikes and wage demands etc and some production has moved to Sri Lanka. Possibly bike manufacturing may follow.
https://www.thedailystar.net/business/n ... es-1632277
I guess that is why I'm a big fan of Giant, they are an actual bike manufacturer not just assembler and they are still manufacturing in Taiwan (high end) and mainland China (mid and entry level) and have resisted moving to Cambodia, Vietnam, Bangladesh etc, so far at least. Take Halfords bikes which I'm not knocking as great value but their Carrera models used to be made in Taiwan, then mainland China, then Vietnam and currently Cambodia and no doubt when Halfords believe they are of sufficient quality will move to Bangladesh or Sri Lanka. They probably already use Bangladesh or Sri Lanka for their Apollo range.
Yep I will be shifting to Giant once I can - carbon defy looks a nice bike - I almost brought it last time - you live and learn.
I honestly don't think you will be displeased about the quality, purely from a manufacturing viewpoint they are the best mass-produced frames in the world, state of the art in fact and their factories have excellent quality control and I believe one of the lowest failure rates in the industry. They also offer a lifetime frame and fork guarantee and the highest weight limits. I honestly don't run a Giant cycle dealership although it does read that way. I just follow the industry and Giant are greatly admired as the best manufacturer. I feel if everything else is right about the Giant bike you are considering, geometry, groupset, pricing etc then the fact it is a Giant is a huge bonus. I would try to avoid any proprietary components though where you cannot replace parts easily. It's a feature of many high end bikes where they get to profiteer on parts that can only be obtained from them. Many brands do this on their higher end bikes and I'm not a fan of it. I guess its more a mountain bike or e-bike thing but you do see some proprietary components on some high end road bikes.0
