100km comfortably

funkydisciple

Hello,

So, yesterday i went for a 100km ride...I have done5 100km rides in the past 5 months and every time it gets to about 40miles my legs start to feel really heavy that i cant put in as much effort as i did before it.

For 40 miles I avg’d 17,.5mph. I was pacing myself too, i wasnt sprinting or going too hard. I was on the drops and just maintaining the speed that felt like not much effort. Only when the road went up slightly that i would put in the extra power to maintain the speed. Most of 100km rides i have done have been mostly flat. With about 1800ft climbing usually.

I thought it might be a. Nutrition thing so i took a lot more energy bars, bananas and made sure i had plenty of water. I ate within an hour of eating and kept eating for an hour. I had 2 energy bars and kept sipping on my energy drink and electrolyte drink during my ride.

By the time i got home i was that slow i avg’d 14.9mph for the 100km.

What am i doing wrong? I thought that by now that i’ve Done 5 100km ride that i should be used to it. I ride my bike to work everyday (15mile round trip). I am on the heavy side, about 105kg. I have been reading, to increase endurance i should be going out for some training rides that involve interval training. I haven’t really done that before. I just always go out for a ride and try to maintain a high speed. When I dont do 100km i normally go out for 30mile rides and always come back with a. Decent avg.

Any advice please?

Darius_Jedburgh

I've done 4 100km rides this week. Max drink has been 3/4 of a bottle of SIS Go and no feed stops.
We are all different but it's only 4 hours or so and I can last after a decent breakfast without stopping to cram myself. Average speed is in the 16/17mph bracket, on windy days.
I suspect you may be over thinking things. Go and enjoy the ride without trying to follow some so called ideal training scenario. A lot of riding is in the head.

timothyw

If you want 100km to be easy, do some 140km rides.

It sounds like your body is used to riding from your glycogen reserves, rather than fat - 7.5 miles is not enough to really get the endurance motor burning, so you are untrained for longer efforts.

That, or you are simply going too fast. Aim for a 16mph average over the 100km and build from there, don't try and sustain your 30 mile speed over twice the distance.

Riding your morning commute fasted (ie before breakfast) might help. Mainly though, you just need more miles.

cougie

That must mean you were doing about 13mph for the remainder of the ride ? That's a hell of a comedown.

Sounds like you are enough but what speed do you normally do for 100k ?

If you go out too fast then for sure you'll slow down by the end.

OnTheRopes

Well, 5 100k rides in the past 5 months is not enough to maintain your endurance if the only other rides you do are 7.5 miles twice a day. Although 15mph average is nothing to be ashamed of, quite good really for an untrained rider.
You don't need to do, or even consider interval training to improve your endurance all you need to do is ride more quite honestly.
You should be riding 3 or 4 times a week and building your endurance up over the weeks until you are doing a 3 hour ride every week and a few shorter rides of at least an hour. Intensity should be Zone 2 ( can still chat - JUST) or zone 3 (feels quite hard).
Then throw a few 4 hour rides in and you will be there.

joe_totale-2

To me it doesn't sound like you're pacing yourself properly. If you have a heart rate monitor then use it to make sure you stay within Zone 2/3.
If not then try riding a mile an hour slower, I bet if you rode at 16mph then you wouldn't crash and burn like you've been doing.

lettingthedaysgoby

You’re setting off too fast.

Aim for 15 mph. Do that a couple of times. See how it feels. Then 16. Etc.

webboo

I have done 100K many, many times. If I push it it’s never comfortable when I’m on my own. The answer is just to to** it off and not worry how long it takes.

N0bodyOfTheGoat

Not enough detail to draw any meaningful conclusions IMO, especially when analysing a ride simply by average speed.

Could be all sorts of things at play, such as...
Your "form" was negative before the ride, so your legs weren't that fresh
Wind direction and speed relative to your route
Attacking any notable climbs too hard
Going above your LTHR too often
etc.

funkydisciple

NitrousOxide wrote:

Not enough detail to draw any meaningful conclusions IMO, especially when analysing a ride simply by average speed.

Could be all sorts of things at play, such as...
Your "form" was negative before the ride, so your legs weren't that fresh
Wind direction and speed relative to your route
Attacking any notable climbs too hard
Going above your LTHR too often
etc.

Hello everyone. Thanks a bunch for your replies.

Some have commented about me going out too fast. The first bit to about 38-40 miles i felt good. The roads were flat and smooth so when i was pedalling at 19,20mph i felt like i wasnt putting in that much effort. I wasn’t pedalling absolutely hard and i found it relatively easy. It wasnt terribly windy either, it wasnt making me put in any more effort in pedalling.

When i got to 40 miles the route faced home and i did have a headwind. I did look at the weather forecast the night before and it did say it would have been 13mph. So thats what i was facing on the way home. Coupled that with lack of energy i slowed down loads. But i’ve Done headwinds in the past and never felt like this. Legs were just feeling very heavy that the only think i could do was put it in an easier gear.

I tried for a cadence of 70rpm for the whole ride. That’s usually the cadence where i am comfortable. But maybe i need to look at a higher cadence? I Did read that everyone is different to when it comes to cadence and i naturally feel better at said cadence.

To answer the questions above from nitrous. I was feeling a bit apprehensive before going out on a 100km ride because the last time i did it the same thing happened on this ride. But once i got going, sun was shining, i felt absolutely fine. Got loads of gold PR’s in the first half of my ride. Any inclines, (not hills), i did try to maintain the speed i was doing on the flat to get past the incline and then recover by freewheeling down or not pedalling as hard. Once recovered i resumed the pedalling effort i had put in prior to the incline.

As mentioned, i tried to stay on top of my nutrition eating every hourly. But do you know that feeling when your in the gym and you’re doing weights and towards the end of the workout you feel that your nervous system is the one stopping you from lifting the weights rather than it being the muscle...it felt like that on the way home. Hope you know what i mean.

Hope the extra info helps. I’ll put a link to my strava ride below so you guys can have a look and tell me what you think.

https://www.strava.com/activities/2284341212

sloppyschleckonds

Sounds like you just found the limit to your endurance, at the 45 mile mark you could have just coasted home for 5 miles but did an extra 15 mile loop.

Just keep at it, sometimes do the first hour easy then smash the next 2.

Of course longer Z2 endurance rides will develop your cardio

mrfpb

Try to maintain effort rather than speed on the inclines, you'll go slightly slower but you'll avoid going "into the red" which is the state that drains your energy and makes it hard to recover. Also spin the pedals a bit on the downhills- it helps circulation, which helps your legs to recover from the uphill effort.

meursault

Your first 40 miles FELT good.

This is perceived effort. You are probably going too far into the red to maintain that pace for a 100k.

If you have a heart rate monitor, you want to be in zone 2 for endurance. At the start of the ride it's going to FEEL way too easy. But that's what pacing is all about.

funkydisciple

meursault wrote:

Your first 40 miles FELT good.

This is perceived effort. You are probably going too far into the red to maintain that pace for a 100k.

If you have a heart rate monitor, you want to be in zone 2 for endurance. At the start of the ride it's going to FEEL way too easy. But that's what pacing is all about.

Ahh, thanks for that dude. Maybe i just need to be more disciplined and stick to about 16mph. I do have a hr monitor so i;’ll look up what z2 is meant to be and see about staying in that zone. Thanks man.

funkydisciple

Hey guys, just to get an idea as I’ll be doing it in a few days....if i stick to zone 2 for the first half of my ride and then put in a bit more effort for the last half of the ride...is that how its done to make sure I dont hit a wall and suffer like the last time i did it? Obv keeping on top of nutrition and taking in water during the ride.

cycleclinic

Ride more and you learn how to ride further. There is no way round this. We have all had to go through it.

You may also be going off to fast. Yesterday I did that and after 85 miles I slowed down I have learnt mostly. How to avoid the wall but sometimes I still get it wrong. We all do don't worry.

GrannygearGaz

A fine example of the mind f#$k that is endurance sport!

It's all about perception, 200w with fresh legs for the first xxkm feels like nothing but over time it takes it's toll and after x hours 200w feels unsustainable!

Speed is not the best way to judge it and perceived effort is flawed over long rides as above. HR is good but ideally monitoring power gives you the best data for pacing.

Speed is just so variable given geography, road surface, wind speed, wind direction etc


I put in the x's as everyone's numbers will vary!

Darius_Jedburgh

I can't help thinking that OP believes that everything will be sorted with the right app on his iPhone.
Such programmes by their very nature can only be an approximation at best.
I also suspect the 100k distance is related to Strava Gran Fondo targets.
Learn how to pace yourself over 40 miles. Then 50 miles. Then step up to 62.25. As you become comfortable at each distance you can up the effort, and speed if that's all that concerns you.
No programme can replicate your body, the weather or the ride conditions so cannot be accurate.

And stop getting hung up on feeding yourself. You should be able to get round comfortably on one bar max, and one drink bottle. That's assuming you eat properly before and after a ride. Remember....all that food you are cramming down takes energy to digest; energy you could be using for your riding.

funkydisciple

Franco di Banco wrote:

I can't help thinking that OP believes that everything will be sorted with the right app on his iPhone.
Such programmes by their very nature can only be an approximation at best.
I also suspect the 100k distance is related to Strava Gran Fondo targets.
Learn how to pace yourself over 40 miles. Then 50 miles. Then step up to 62.25. As you become comfortable at each distance you can up the effort, and speed if that's all that concerns you.
No programme can replicate your body, the weather or the ride conditions so cannot be accurate.

And stop getting hung up on feeding yourself. You should be able to get round comfortably on one bar max, and one drink bottle. That's assuming you eat properly before and after a ride. Remember....all that food you are cramming down takes energy to digest; energy you could be using for your riding.

Hi Franco, Thank you for your reply, even though it’s useless apart from the pacing part, i’ll Take that on board. I’ve not said anything about apps that i hope with the right one it will help me do 100km without blowin up. But whatever. And why does it matter if the 100k distance is related to grand fondo targets? Your reply does baffle me.

Darius_Jedburgh

No worries. Your whole attitude baffles me!

def_defyr

thecycleclinic wrote:

Ride more and you learn how to ride further. There is no way round this. We have all had to go through it.

You may also be going off to fast. Yesterday I did that and after 85 miles I slowed down I have learnt mostly. How to avoid the wall but sometimes I still get it wrong. We all do don't worry.

It's funny. I bonked as hard as I ever have on Saturday after about 75 km -- think I didn't eat enough, but just as likely the hill at about km 50 that took me into the red zone was the culprit.

So, Sunday was 25 km of spinning around Longchamps to make myself feel better. Today I cranked off 120 km of rolling terrain between Paris and Rambouillet. Maybe it was the holiday spirit -- thousands of riders taking advantage of the day off -- but I felt really, really good until about 5 km from home, so I'd call that a successful ride and recovery from a training setback on Saturday. Thinking back, what I did better today was start slower, avoid the temptation to push it on the early hills, and have a larger breakfast (yogurt/banana), plus had some cookies in my nut/raisin bag...

BTW I ride by feel. No Strava, power meter, HRM etc. Done HRM in my MTB racing days in the late 90s, and you know what? It was too much bother. I'd rather just get into the zones by perceived effort.

meursault

Def Defyr wrote:

thecycleclinic wrote:

Ride more and you learn how to ride further. There is no way round this. We have all had to go through it.

You may also be going off to fast. Yesterday I did that and after 85 miles I slowed down I have learnt mostly. How to avoid the wall but sometimes I still get it wrong. We all do don't worry.

It's funny. I bonked as hard as I ever have on Saturday after about 75 km -- think I didn't eat enough, but just as likely the hill at about km 50 that took me into the red zone was the culprit.

So, Sunday was 25 km of spinning around Longchamps to make myself feel better. Today I cranked off 120 km of rolling terrain between Paris and Rambouillet. Maybe it was the holiday spirit -- thousands of riders taking advantage of the day off -- but I felt really, really good until about 5 km from home, so I'd call that a successful ride and recovery from a training setback on Saturday. Thinking back, what I did better today was start slower, avoid the temptation to push it on the early hills, and have a larger breakfast (yogurt/banana), plus had some cookies in my nut/raisin bag...

BTW I ride by feel. No Strava, power meter, HRM etc. Done HRM in my MTB racing days in the late 90s, and you know what? It was too much bother. I'd rather just get into the zones by perceived effort.

Perceived effort has it's place, especially for experienced riders. It's very difficult to tell how hard you are working without some kind of monitored measurement when inexperienced.

funkydisciple

Def Defyr wrote:

thecycleclinic wrote:

Ride more and you learn how to ride further. There is no way round this. We have all had to go through it.

You may also be going off to fast. Yesterday I did that and after 85 miles I slowed down I have learnt mostly. How to avoid the wall but sometimes I still get it wrong. We all do don't worry.

It's funny. I bonked as hard as I ever have on Saturday after about 75 km -- think I didn't eat enough, but just as likely the hill at about km 50 that took me into the red zone was the culprit.

So, Sunday was 25 km of spinning around Longchamps to make myself feel better. Today I cranked off 120 km of rolling terrain between Paris and Rambouillet. Maybe it was the holiday spirit -- thousands of riders taking advantage of the day off -- but I felt really, really good until about 5 km from home, so I'd call that a successful ride and recovery from a training setback on Saturday. Thinking back, what I did better today was start slower, avoid the temptation to push it on the early hills, and have a larger breakfast (yogurt/banana), plus had some cookies in my nut/raisin bag...

BTW I ride by feel. No Strava, power meter, HRM etc. Done HRM in my MTB racing days in the late 90s, and you know what? It was too much bother. I'd rather just get into the zones by perceived effort.

Dude, thank you very much for your reply. I’ve mapped out a ride in a couple days. Defo going to start slower and put in full effort when I’m about 5-10miles from home. Like I’ve said, I think that I’m doing well when I start off, thinking the effort I’m putting in doesn’t feel that hard and thought maybe it’s the nutrition and fitness side letting me down towards the end of the ride. So, yea, it’s because I’ve been setting off too fast.