Aluminium or Carbon ?

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Comments

  • Tyresome
    Tyresome Posts: 113
    SJH76 wrote:
    Tyresome wrote:
    SJH76 wrote:
    Webboo wrote:
    Tyresome wrote:
    shamrock134 wrote:
    The best aluminium bike money can buy... :lol:

    QG8x8tn.jpg

    That’s a decent bike. Comes with Ultegra 11 speed and Mavic Cosmic elite S wheels, and a decent Fizik Arione saddle for about a grand IIRC, so I’ve no idea why you’d laugh, unless you know little about bikes and kit of course.
    It does however come with a rear brake under the bottom bracket which everyone knows is the worst place you could put it.

    Apart from cleaning, there is little issue with the rear brake on the bottom bracket region. After all, you use your front brake mainly and the rear is mostly used to come to a complete stop not so much for slowing so it's not a performance issue.

    As for the main subject, 5 years ago I would say a good aluminium frame can be much better than a cheap carbon in most cases. But today it's not so true. You can get very very good carbon frames and setups for sub £1k. The CAAD always get a mention of a superb alu frame but it really is a company squeezing as much tech ability out of a material with not much further to go. Specializeds smart weld tech has probably done a lot to extend the life of aluminium as a viable top end material but it's days are still numbered. The other issue is that the lighter and more highly engineered they get the more delicate they get. Carbon can be very strong and very light but make aluminium lighter it's a compromise. You can't do much to change aluminiums strength to weight. Lighter will always be weaker. So a crash could be more likely terminal to an aluminium frame than carbon. Carbon repair is quite common. Once aluminium breaks it's scrap metal. Just remember that if you intend racing on one.
    Yes and no. If you have a lifetime warranty on an Aluminium frame, it can take the worry away if it breaks. The trickle down of CF tech and lay up technique is starting to mean a sub 1000 quid Carbon frame doesn’t instantly mean it’s total gash anymore.

    If you crash a bike - your warranty won't replace it. Your fault not theirs.
    If however it was to break, and there was no accident.....
  • imposter2.0
    imposter2.0 Posts: 12,028
    Love the way you avoid having to explain your bullshit...
  • Matthewfalle
    Matthewfalle Posts: 17,380
    Tyresome wrote:
    Matthewfalle wrote:
    Tyresome wrote:
    shamrock134 wrote:
    The best aluminium bike money can buy... :lol:

    QG8x8tn.jpg

    That’s a decent bike. Comes with Ultegra 11 speed and Mavic Cosmic elite S wheels, and a decent Fizik Arione saddle for about a grand IIRC, so I’ve no idea why you’d laugh, unless you know little about bikes and kit of course.

    it could come with Victoria Pendleton polishing the saddle and Sagan sprinting it for you but it doesn't matter.

    Get the piece of shyt off the Memorial.

    It looks like it’s behind the guard rail to me, so not ‘on’ the memorial.

    the piece of shyt shouldn't be anywhere near the Memorial, guard rail or not. End of.
    Postby team47b » Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:53 am

    De Sisti wrote:
    This is one of the silliest threads I've come across. :lol:

    Recognition at last Matthew, well done!, a justified honour :D
    smithy21 wrote:

    He's right you know.
  • Matthewfalle
    Matthewfalle Posts: 17,380
    Imposter wrote:
    Love the way you avoid having to explain your bullshit...

    yeah, because when the frame cracks it gets all covered in road scuffs as a side effect.

    he's such a dotard.
    Postby team47b » Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:53 am

    De Sisti wrote:
    This is one of the silliest threads I've come across. :lol:

    Recognition at last Matthew, well done!, a justified honour :D
    smithy21 wrote:

    He's right you know.
  • SJH76
    SJH76 Posts: 191
    Tyresome wrote:
    SJH76 wrote:
    Tyresome wrote:
    SJH76 wrote:
    Webboo wrote:
    Tyresome wrote:
    shamrock134 wrote:
    The best aluminium bike money can buy... :lol:

    QG8x8tn.jpg

    That’s a decent bike. Comes with Ultegra 11 speed and Mavic Cosmic elite S wheels, and a decent Fizik Arione saddle for about a grand IIRC, so I’ve no idea why you’d laugh, unless you know little about bikes and kit of course.
    It does however come with a rear brake under the bottom bracket which everyone knows is the worst place you could put it.

    Apart from cleaning, there is little issue with the rear brake on the bottom bracket region. After all, you use your front brake mainly and the rear is mostly used to come to a complete stop not so much for slowing so it's not a performance issue.

    As for the main subject, 5 years ago I would say a good aluminium frame can be much better than a cheap carbon in most cases. But today it's not so true. You can get very very good carbon frames and setups for sub £1k. The CAAD always get a mention of a superb alu frame but it really is a company squeezing as much tech ability out of a material with not much further to go. Specializeds smart weld tech has probably done a lot to extend the life of aluminium as a viable top end material but it's days are still numbered. The other issue is that the lighter and more highly engineered they get the more delicate they get. Carbon can be very strong and very light but make aluminium lighter it's a compromise. You can't do much to change aluminiums strength to weight. Lighter will always be weaker. So a crash could be more likely terminal to an aluminium frame than carbon. Carbon repair is quite common. Once aluminium breaks it's scrap metal. Just remember that if you intend racing on one.
    Yes and no. If you have a lifetime warranty on an Aluminium frame, it can take the worry away if it breaks. The trickle down of CF tech and lay up technique is starting to mean a sub 1000 quid Carbon frame doesn’t instantly mean it’s total gash anymore.

    If you crash a bike - your warranty won't replace it. Your fault not theirs.
    If however it was to break, and there was no accident.....

    You get a warranty on carbon frames too so I fail to see the fact an aluminium frame one has one as a bonus.
  • Matthewfalle
    Matthewfalle Posts: 17,380
    SJH76 wrote:
    Tyresome wrote:
    SJH76 wrote:
    Tyresome wrote:
    SJH76 wrote:
    Webboo wrote:
    Tyresome wrote:
    shamrock134 wrote:
    The best aluminium bike money can buy... :lol:

    QG8x8tn.jpg

    That’s a decent bike. Comes with Ultegra 11 speed and Mavic Cosmic elite S wheels, and a decent Fizik Arione saddle for about a grand IIRC, so I’ve no idea why you’d laugh, unless you know little about bikes and kit of course.
    It does however come with a rear brake under the bottom bracket which everyone knows is the worst place you could put it.

    Apart from cleaning, there is little issue with the rear brake on the bottom bracket region. After all, you use your front brake mainly and the rear is mostly used to come to a complete stop not so much for slowing so it's not a performance issue.

    As for the main subject, 5 years ago I would say a good aluminium frame can be much better than a cheap carbon in most cases. But today it's not so true. You can get very very good carbon frames and setups for sub £1k. The CAAD always get a mention of a superb alu frame but it really is a company squeezing as much tech ability out of a material with not much further to go. Specializeds smart weld tech has probably done a lot to extend the life of aluminium as a viable top end material but it's days are still numbered. The other issue is that the lighter and more highly engineered they get the more delicate they get. Carbon can be very strong and very light but make aluminium lighter it's a compromise. You can't do much to change aluminiums strength to weight. Lighter will always be weaker. So a crash could be more likely terminal to an aluminium frame than carbon. Carbon repair is quite common. Once aluminium breaks it's scrap metal. Just remember that if you intend racing on one.
    Yes and no. If you have a lifetime warranty on an Aluminium frame, it can take the worry away if it breaks. The trickle down of CF tech and lay up technique is starting to mean a sub 1000 quid Carbon frame doesn’t instantly mean it’s total gash anymore.

    If you crash a bike - your warranty won't replace it. Your fault not theirs.
    If however it was to break, and there was no accident.....

    You get a warranty on carbon frames too so I fail to see the fact an aluminium frame one has one as a bonus.

    don't worry dude - we all fail to see any use in anything nick has ever posted. ever.
    Postby team47b » Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:53 am

    De Sisti wrote:
    This is one of the silliest threads I've come across. :lol:

    Recognition at last Matthew, well done!, a justified honour :D
    smithy21 wrote:

    He's right you know.
  • pippi_langsamer-2
    pippi_langsamer-2 Posts: 1,470
    It's a valid point in the whole "carbon vs alloy", debate that (regardless of fault), carbon is now (usually), easy to fix- aluminium is not...
  • pinno
    pinno Posts: 52,556
    @Rokt:

    What do you want to do on your bike?
    If you want to race, you may want something very responsive, light and punchy i;e the CAAD12.
    If you want to do long sportives or endurance, you might want something a little more forgiving and comfortable i'e the Super six.

    My own experience of Alu is that they can be stiff and responsive but a bit harsh. Alu does get more brittle over time and therefore stiffer where you really don't want any stiffer.
    Both frames have great reviews and both are not the sort of over compact geometry that has become the norm - which can be too rigid if not put together in the right way.
    Personally, I would go for the Carbon super six but both will be dictated by the wheels. Mavic Aksium and upwards through equipe, elite, (Ksyrium's) are notoriously stiff and harsh if you are in the sub 75kg range.
    A different set of hoops will give both those bikes a completely different feel.

    What you will get with both options is a great frame (the CAAD12 was listed as one of the top frames by BR last year I think and everyone waxes lyrical about both in terms of VFM) is the opportunity to upgrade and really enhance their inherent strengths.
    seanoconn - gruagach craic!
  • rokt
    rokt Posts: 493
    @Pinno,

    Thanks for your input, it’s appreciated after the post has gone slightly of course !

    I live on the edge of the Pennines and thus have to climb when ever I go out. I’m looking for an all round light weight bike that can climb on rides in the region of 80 miles. I certainly won’t be racing, I’m too old for all that now.

    I love the CAAD 12 and the purple is stunning but I agree, the ride is a little harsh. I don’t want to spend over £3k and then have to start looking at changing wheels.

    I’m hopefully going to test ride the exact SuperSix I’m interested in next week and if I get a decent wheel upgrade, that will be the better option.
  • pinno
    pinno Posts: 52,556
    Rokt wrote:
    I love the CAAD 12 and the purple is stunning but I agree, the ride is a little harsh. I don’t want to spend over £3k and then have to start looking at changing wheels.

    That harsh ride maybe accentuated by the Aksium wheels.
    Just take it into consideration. I take it that you are light?
    seanoconn - gruagach craic!
  • rokt
    rokt Posts: 493
    The CAAD 12 has Cannodale’s HallowGram Carbon wheels.

    I’m starting to think that aluminium has a harsher ride, as you
    say because of my weight, 64 kg.
  • letap73
    letap73 Posts: 1,608
    If your size is a 54 - you can't really go wrong with this:
    https://www.hargreaves-cycles.co.uk/m39 ... HEELS-2018
  • pinno
    pinno Posts: 52,556
    letap73 wrote:
    If your size is a 54 - you can't really go wrong with this:
    https://www.hargreaves-cycles.co.uk/m39 ... HEELS-2018

    Nice but above the budget I would suggest? Worth forking out the extra though.
    seanoconn - gruagach craic!
  • letap73
    letap73 Posts: 1,608
    Pinno wrote:
    letap73 wrote:
    If your size is a 54 - you can't really go wrong with this:
    https://www.hargreaves-cycles.co.uk/m39 ... HEELS-2018

    Nice but above the budget I would suggest? Worth forking out the extra though.

    The CAAD 12 Dura ace - albeit 2019 edition is £500 more - unless OP is getting a discount

    Although this is a bargain:
    https://www.hargreaves-cycles.co.uk/m39 ... tegra-2019
  • Matthewfalle
    Matthewfalle Posts: 17,380
    letap73 wrote:
    Pinno wrote:
    letap73 wrote:
    If your size is a 54 - you can't really go wrong with this:
    https://www.hargreaves-cycles.co.uk/m39 ... HEELS-2018

    Nice but above the budget I would suggest? Worth forking out the extra though.

    The CAAD 12 Dura ace - albeit 2019 edition is £500 more - unless OP is getting a discount

    Although this is a bargain:
    https://www.hargreaves-cycles.co.uk/m39 ... tegra-2019


    now that is cool.
    Postby team47b » Sun Jun 28, 2015 11:53 am

    De Sisti wrote:
    This is one of the silliest threads I've come across. :lol:

    Recognition at last Matthew, well done!, a justified honour :D
    smithy21 wrote:

    He's right you know.
  • pippi_langsamer-2
    pippi_langsamer-2 Posts: 1,470
    If I was a 54 and in the market, I'd be all over this

    https://www.lfgss.com/conversations/330 ... nt14614056
  • pinno
    pinno Posts: 52,556
    Pippi Langsamer wrote:
    If I was a 54 and in the market, I'd be all over this

    https://www.lfgss.com/conversations/330 ... nt14614056

    ...and lavishly adorn it with a Sora* groupset :D
    *Expertly sourced second hand from fleabay.
    seanoconn - gruagach craic!

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