The Beatles

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  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 62,033
    joe2008 wrote:
    Stiff Little Fingers split in 1982.

    Jake, later reformed the band, and he was the only original member in the re-formed group.

    However, original bassist Ali Mcmordie has now been back playing for them for a few years. Of course Bruce Foxton, from the Jam, played bass for many years for SLF.

    There is another band called XSLF who consist of original SLF guitarist Henry Cluney and SLF drummer Jim Riley.

    I first saw SLF in 1979 on a school trip! Those were the days.
    Thanks Joe - saved me doing the research on Google.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • joe2008
    joe2008 Posts: 1,531
    SLF were a really great live band, I have seen them many times over the years.

    However, the last time I saw them there were supported by The Ruts DC who were absolutely incredible. I think they played a better set than SLF.

    I remember hearing the intro to Alternative Ulster in '79 on a borrowed 45, it blew my 14 year old mind, and my life was never the same again. :D
  • tangled_metal
    tangled_metal Posts: 4,021
    So which band from that era is your favourite. Clash or SLF?
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 27,659
    Tangled Metal wrote:
    You can kind of still get the experience. Well, a sort of experience. There must be loads of recordings of live gigs around. I remember a bootleg tape seller dealing tapes out of my old university student union. I've got a recording of a 1977 Hammersmith palais gig iirc of the clash somewhere on tape. No cassette player working though. :(

    From what I remember it was a bit ropey sound recording but good enough to hear the spirit of the gig.

    If I have that someone else will and there'll be a vid online somewhere.

    Was too young when punk came around but I reckon if it had come around in my uni years I'd be in the thick of it. I've been to some indie/punk/rock nights in my uni days and the pit (indie days called the mosh pit I believe) was fun to be in the thick of. Aaah the good old days!
    No video that I have ever seen comes remotely close to being there live, or fulfill the memories. IMO.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • joe2008
    joe2008 Posts: 1,531
    Tangled Metal wrote:
    So which band from that era is your favourite. Clash or SLF?

    At the time SLF.

    But looking back The Clash were the only band that mattered. :wink:
  • tangled_metal
    tangled_metal Posts: 4,021
    The tape I had was recorded in the thick of it. Close your eyes and a bit of imagination you could imagine it.

    Obviously not as good as being there I only reckon a best alternative if you can no longer listen to them live, especially since it seems a lot of the greats are now dead. Might take a good live recording like the one I had. It had the music, the sound of the crowd there (must be in the thick of it) and the banter from the band.

    Of course live is best though sadly no longer possible with some bands.
  • DeVlaeminck
    DeVlaeminck Posts: 9,112
    joe2008 wrote:
    [


    Stiff Little Fingers split in 1982.

    Jake, later reformed the band, and he was the only original member in the re-formed group.

    However, original bassist Ali Mcmordie has now been back playing for them for a few years. Of course Bruce Foxton, from the Jam, played bass for many years for SLF.

    There is another band called XSLF who consist of original SLF guitarist Henry Cluney and SLF drummer Jim Riley.

    I first saw SLF in 1979 on a school trip! Those were the days.

    I'm pretty certain that when they reformed in the late 80s they were the original line up. The splits have come subsequently.
    [Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]
  • Stevo_666
    Stevo_666 Posts: 62,033
    Tangled Metal wrote:
    So which band from that era is your favourite. Clash or SLF?
    For me, The Clash edges it. Just in terms what I reach for on the car stereo more often. Can't say which one was best live as I can't compare, sadly.
    "I spent most of my money on birds, booze and fast cars: the rest of it I just squandered." [George Best]
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 28,315
    Tangled Metal wrote:
    Have you ever heard a song you really liked then learnt it was a cover then learnt the "original" was actually just a cover. But with each discovery of an earlier version you actually liked it more?

    Paul Young and the common people song was such a song for me (was jarvis cocker's song a version too?)

    Pulp covered the William Shatner original.
  • joe2008
    joe2008 Posts: 1,531
    DeVlaeminck wrote:
    joe2008 wrote:
    [


    Stiff Little Fingers split in 1982.

    Jake, later reformed the band, and he was the only original member in the re-formed group.

    However, original bassist Ali Mcmordie has now been back playing for them for a few years. Of course Bruce Foxton, from the Jam, played bass for many years for SLF.

    There is another band called XSLF who consist of original SLF guitarist Henry Cluney and SLF drummer Jim Riley.

    I first saw SLF in 1979 on a school trip! Those were the days.

    I'm pretty certain that when they reformed in the late 80s they were the original line up. The splits have come subsequently.

    Yep, you're absolutely right. Jake, Ali, Henry and Dolphin Taylor reformed later in the '80's, Ali was replaced by Bruce because he couldn't commit to tour, and Henry was asked to leave in 1993. Leaving just Jake as an original member, until much later when Ali returned to replace Bruce.

    Sorry was in a hurry earlier.
  • laurentian
    laurentian Posts: 2,597
    Tangled Metal wrote:
    So which band from that era is your favourite. Clash or SLF?

    The Clash easily for me. Much as I loved wrecking village halls "dancing" to Stiff Little Fingers, the Clash were a more cultured and cerebral band. Never saw them but saw Joe Strummer perform solo and, beleive it or not, with The Ramones.

    Fave SLF track is probably "Just Because" which (I think) Jake Burns co-wrote with Jerry Dammers . . .

    Bad news on Pete Shelley. Buzzcocks were one of those brilliant punk bands that made brilliant 3 minute pop songs in a similar way to X Ray Spex . . . sadly, we also lost Polly Styrene a few years ago . . . that was a band I would love to have seen.
    Wilier Izoard XP
  • joe2008
    joe2008 Posts: 1,531
    laurentian wrote:
    Tangled Metal wrote:
    So which band from that era is your favourite. Clash or SLF?

    The Clash easily for me. Much as I loved wrecking village halls "dancing" to Stiff Little Fingers, the Clash were a more cultured and cerebral band. Never saw them but saw Joe Strummer perform solo and, beleive it or not, with The Ramones.

    Fave SLF track is probably "Just Because" which (I think) Jake Burns co-wrote with Jerry Dammers . . .

    Bad news on Pete Shelley. Buzzcocks were one of those brilliant punk bands that made brilliant 3 minute pop songs in a similar way to X Ray Spex . . . sadly, we also lost Polly Styrene a few years ago . . . that was a band I would love to have seen.

    For the record :wink: "Just Because" is actually called "It Dosen't Make it Alright".

    It was a straight cover of the Specials song, written by Jerry Dammers and Dave Goldberg; Jake Burns had no involvement in it's writing.
  • laurentian
    laurentian Posts: 2,597
    joe2008 wrote:
    laurentian wrote:
    Tangled Metal wrote:
    So which band from that era is your favourite. Clash or SLF?

    The Clash easily for me. Much as I loved wrecking village halls "dancing" to Stiff Little Fingers, the Clash were a more cultured and cerebral band. Never saw them but saw Joe Strummer perform solo and, beleive it or not, with The Ramones.

    Fave SLF track is probably "Just Because" which (I think) Jake Burns co-wrote with Jerry Dammers . . .

    Bad news on Pete Shelley. Buzzcocks were one of those brilliant punk bands that made brilliant 3 minute pop songs in a similar way to X Ray Spex . . . sadly, we also lost Polly Styrene a few years ago . . . that was a band I would love to have seen.

    For the record :wink: "Just Because" is actually called "It Dosen't Make it Alright".

    It was a straight cover of the Specials song, written by Jerry Dammers and Dave Goldberg; Jake Burns had no involvement in it's writing.

    Cheers! . . . of course it's "Doesn't Make it Alright" . . . mistakenly thought JB co-wrote. From memory, the SLF version was out at the same time as The Specials one(?)
    Wilier Izoard XP
  • joe2008
    joe2008 Posts: 1,531
    Almost. The Specials released it in '79, it was on the side two :D of Nobody's Heroes which was released in March 1980.

    Great song! I prefer the SLF version, I also prefer SLF's Jonny Was to Marley's.
  • laurentian
    laurentian Posts: 2,597
    joe2008 wrote:
    Almost. The Specials released it in '79, it was on the side two :D of Nobody's Heroes which was released in March 1980.

    Great song! I prefer the SLF version, I also prefer SLF's Jonny Was to Marley's.

    All of which prompted me to google songs that SLF have covered:

    Doesn't Make It Alright (The Specials)
    Johnny Was (Bob Marley & The Wailers)
    Staring at the Rude Boys (The Ruts)
    (What's So Funny 'bout) Peace, Love and Understanding (Brinsley Schwarz)
    I Fought the Law (The Crickets)
    The Boys Are Back in Town (Thin Lizzy)
    2-4-6-8 Motorway (Tom Robinson Band)
    School's Out (Alice Cooper)

    There's some there I haven't heard . . .
    Wilier Izoard XP
  • joe2008
    joe2008 Posts: 1,531
    laurentian wrote:
    joe2008 wrote:
    Almost. The Specials released it in '79, it was on the side two :D of Nobody's Heroes which was released in March 1980.

    Great song! I prefer the SLF version, I also prefer SLF's Jonny Was to Marley's.

    All of which prompted me to google songs that SLF have covered:

    Doesn't Make It Alright (The Specials)
    Johnny Was (Bob Marley & The Wailers)
    Staring at the Rude Boys (The Ruts)
    (What's So Funny 'bout) Peace, Love and Understanding (Brinsley Schwarz)
    I Fought the Law (The Crickets)
    The Boys Are Back in Town (Thin Lizzy)
    2-4-6-8 Motorway (Tom Robinson Band)
    School's Out (Alice Cooper)

    There's some there I haven't heard . . .

    They played 'The Boys are Back in Town' when I saw them at Brixton Academy in the '80's - brilliant.

    Well known SLF covers off of the top of my head:

    Mr Fire Coal Man - Lloyd McDonald released by The Wailing Souls
    Love of the Common People - Paul Young
    Running Bear - Johnny Preston
    White Christmas - Bing Crosby
  • laurentian
    laurentian Posts: 2,597
    Blimey! I've had the opportunity to see them many times over the past 30 odd years but never actually been - all my mates have and I know they're still at it so must make the effort next time.

    (Whilst on the subject of cover version geekery, Paul Young was about the tenth or twelfth person to cover Love of the Common People :wink: - another great song but not by him!)

    Dragging this kind of back on topic, I'd rather listen to SLF than The Beatles
    Wilier Izoard XP
  • tangled_metal
    tangled_metal Posts: 4,021
    SLF released common people the year before Paul Young BTW.

    The four preps did it first in 66 I believe early in the year and it was covered by waylon jennings. In fact 41st release was SLF, 42nd was Paul Young. Others before them include Leonard Nimoy and John Denver.

    I think that's funny. A good song that most people into music in the 80s probably think it's a Paul Young song covered by SLF. Others "more in the know" probably "know" SLF did it first and Paul Young heard it then released it after speaking with someone linked with SLF. The truth is they both covered it after probably hearing someone else's version. In fact I bet they heard a cover but even the original.

    I bet there's a lot of famous covers like this with the originals going back decades after most people think it was first released.
  • DeVlaeminck
    DeVlaeminck Posts: 9,112
    Nicky Thomas had a top 10 with it in the UK so I reckon most people in the 80s knew it was a cover especially as Paul Young had a few hits that were covers. The Eric Donaldson version is pretty well known by anyone with a passing interest in early reggae too.
    [Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]
  • DeVlaeminck
    DeVlaeminck Posts: 9,112
    Love this version https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kekR7mJjKqY
    [Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]
  • robert88
    robert88 Posts: 2,696
    The Beatles represent a vanished era. Things are different today.
  • joe2008
    joe2008 Posts: 1,531
    Robert88 wrote:
    The Beatles represent a vanished era. Things are different today.

    The Clash represent a vanished era. Things are different today. :(
  • mfin
    mfin Posts: 6,729
    You won't find many musicians and songwriters who don't rate a lot of the Beatles material as incredible, and so varied too.

    Both SLF and The Clash are really only loved through a bit of nostalgia by a generation that happens to still be around. Their profiles drop away as that generation disappears, because the quality of their music doesn't stand up on its own unless supported by the nostalgia of their ageing fans.

    The Beatles music stands up, that's why they are rated that highly, that's why they are still and always will be one of the biggest bands in history.

    Record sales mean nothing either though, even when talking about The Beatles. It is irrelevant because Boyzone have sold a lot of records too, but they won't be remembered as being any good.
  • FocusZing
    FocusZing Posts: 4,373
    Robert88 wrote:
    The Beatles represent a vanished era. Things are different today.

    Nah
  • FocusZing
    FocusZing Posts: 4,373
    Thats a load of sh1t, you will always get good groups, songs coming through who create and produce their own shnizzle.

    Simple Minds, Depeche Mode, Tears for Fears, produced great melody and lyrical songs.

    Anyway weren't the Stones, Beatles... strongly inspired by Motown?
  • robert88
    robert88 Posts: 2,696
    FocusZing wrote:
    ..
    Anyway weren't the Stones, Beatles... strongly inspired by Motown?

    More Buddy Holly in the case of the Beatles.

    Anyway, music is like religion especially as there is loadsa money in it.
    “If the doors of perception were cleansed, everything would appear to man as it is, infinite. For man has closed himself up, till he sees all things thro’ narrow chinks of his cavern.”
  • pblakeney
    pblakeney Posts: 27,659
    The Stones (who were my favourite) were derivative of American music and credited with bringing black music to the white mass audience.
    The Beatles may have started out derivative but were increasingly progressive.
    The above may be fact, or fiction, I may be serious, I may be jesting.
    I am not sure. You have no chance.
    Veronese68 wrote:
    PB is the most sensible person on here.
  • mfin
    mfin Posts: 6,729
    FocusZing wrote:
    Simple Minds, Depeche Mode, Tears for Fears, produced great melody and lyrical songs.

    Yes, but the only ones who didn't manage to do that out of those three are Simple Minds, Depeche Mode and Tears for Fears.
  • kingstongraham
    kingstongraham Posts: 28,315
    That new release of the White Album really is worth the time. The original demo of what became Jealous Guy in there as well.

    It's still a sprawling mess, but even one of the earlier takes of Ob-La-Di has a charm to it. More than the final version anyway.
  • mrfpb
    mrfpb Posts: 4,569
    PBlakeney wrote:
    The Stones (who were my favourite) were derivative of American music and credited with bringing black music to the white mass audience.
    The Beatles may have started out derivative but were increasingly progressive.
    Pretty much right. I think they both started out inspired by Buddy Holly amd Chuck Berry (the two great original songwriting performers of rock and roll) but the Beatles were onto stuff like Tomorrow Never Knows within three years of their debut.

    The Stones were pushed into songwriting by Andrew Loog Oldham because he saw The Beatles self penned songs as the future of pop. He sent Jagger and Richards into a room and told them not to come out until they'd written a song.

    Lennon and McCartney were just naturally gifted songwriters that brought their own songs to their first auditions.

    The Who were as progressive as the Beatles, but Pete Townsend probably went too far at times due to not having a partner to bounce ideas off.

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