Chapeau aux Francais

mr_goo

Although many on here will denounce the riots in France against tax hikes on fuel. They have at least achieved their goal as Macron does a U-turn. Chapeau!
Just can't see us passive Brits doing the same. We'd sooner take it up the Arsenal and just moan about it.

capt_slog

Mr Goo wrote:

Although many on here will denounce the riots in France against tax hikes on fuel. They have at least achieved their goal as Macron does a U-turn. Chapeau!
Just can't see us passive Brits doing the same. We'd sooner take it up the Arsenal and just moan about it.

Oh come on!

We do a very mean petition.

Matthewfalle

Capt Slog wrote:

Mr Goo wrote:

Although many on here will denounce the riots in France against tax hikes on fuel. They have at least achieved their goal as Macron does a U-turn. Chapeau!
Just can't see us passive Brits doing the same. We'd sooner take it up the Arsenal and just moan about it.

Oh come on!

We do a very mean petition.

darn good at referendum votes as well.

fenix

Very keen on a Protest March too ?

But rioting ? It's been a good few decades since we did that.

slowmart

The French state capitulates.Again.

Nothing new now please move along

crispybug2

When my kids were at school in France, Presidant Sarkosy tried to introduce mandatory school uniforms in all state schools.

My kids, along with most of the rest of French schoolchildren went on strike over this, Sarkosy backed down and from an early age the kids learnt a valuable lesson that has been repeated here

kingstongraham

We had fuel protests in 2000 that led to government policy changing - to stop tax going up because fuel was going over 80p a litre.

Stevo_666

Mr Goo wrote:

Although many on here will denounce the riots in France against tax hikes on fuel. They have at least achieved their goal as Macron does a U-turn. Chapeau!
Just can't see us passive Brits doing the same. We'd sooner take it up the Arsenal and just moan about it.

I'm not opposed to protests against higher taxes, but while we riot less than the French, we do tend to plan around increased taxes better

mr_goo

KingstonGraham wrote:

We had fuel protests in 2000 that led to government policy changing - to stop tax going up because fuel was going over 80p a litre.

I remember that. Quite amusing to see my local village Q8 fuel station rationing petrol.
As someone has stated it's all petitions now. Harks back to medieval times of petitioning the king or local lord of manor.

pblakeney

Mr Goo wrote:

KingstonGraham wrote:

We had fuel protests in 2000 that led to government policy changing - to stop tax going up because fuel was going over 80p a litre.

I remember that. Quite amusing to see my local village Q8 fuel station rationing petrol.
As someone has stated it's all petitions now. Harks back to medieval times of petitioning the king or local lord of manor.

And as effective.

orraloon

KingstonGraham wrote:

We had fuel protests in 2000 that led to government policy changing - to stop tax going up because fuel was going over 80p a litre.

Bzzt. Wasn't that about tanker drivers threatening strike action for more money rather than a proletarian rising against taxes?

briantrumpet

Mr Goo wrote:

Although many on here will denounce the riots in France against tax hikes on fuel. They have at least achieved their goal as Macron does a U-turn. Chapeau!
Just can't see us passive Brits doing the same. We'd sooner take it up the Arsenal and just moan about it.

Macron might have felt brave after seeing out the SNCF strike - unfortunately for the rail unions, Macron had a large part of the population backing him on that one. This time, unfortunately for Macron, more people are car drivers than train drivers, and however much people say they care about the environment, their wish not to be taxed more for driving outweighed the environmental considerations.

briantrumpet

A depressing read https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... -far-right

There have always been revolutionaries ready to jump on the back of justified protest, but, given populists' apparent re-emergence, and the strategy of Putin as evidenced by the US situation (stoking factionalism & the fracturing of society into tribes), it didn't take a giant leap of imagination to see the gilets jaunes being exploited for nefarious ends.

BelgianBeerGeek

Was over in France a couple of weeks ago. I knew it was law to carry a gilet jaune but the number of motorists sticking them in the windscreen was huge. I thought it was the French cops having a crackdown, and got mine out too. Read about it on the way home :roll: . I love the solidarity of the French, though.

tangled_metal

The French pm only announced a 6 month freeze on introducing it. Time for all but the hardcore anarchists, activists and @rsholes just out to cause trouble to go home thinking job done.

The UK fuel protests were about fuel prices not about drivers' pay. Basically tax on diesel was starting to put some haulage companies out of business. Look at how many foreign truck number plates now. Part of that was about the UK fuel tax escalator I understand from the companies I used to deal with.

The UK fuel protests included tanker drivers, truck drivers, farmers, delivery companies, private or business drivers. Basically a wide range of businesses and individuals who felt strongly enough to protest. IIRC there were actually two sets of protests with a gap in time between them.

They were ultimately at least partly successful considering the fuel tax escalator was stopped about then. Of course easy to forget the brits are capable of successful protests too. It's not like we have many right? Anyone know how many anti fracking protests running. Or vegan protests outside meat or farm establishments? Or any number of small scale local protests going on up and down the country that really only get local or small level of press attention?

Stevo_666

Not good news for Macron, although this issue appears to be the tip of the iceberg in France.
https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/dec/04/emmanuel-macron-crisis-france-europe-far-right

slowmart

Stevo referencing and linking articles from the Guardian....

rick_chasey

General rule is if it’s a “comment is free” column it’s about as well researched as a Brexiteer economic paper.

rjsterry

Rick Chasey wrote:

General rule is if it’s a “comment is free” column it’s about as well researched as a Brexiteer economic paper.

TBF, it's pretty clear that CiF is effectively an open mic/Speakers Corner column.

kingstongraham

orraloon wrote:

KingstonGraham wrote:

We had fuel protests in 2000 that led to government policy changing - to stop tax going up because fuel was going over 80p a litre.

Bzzt. Wasn't that about tanker drivers threatening strike action for more money rather than a proletarian rising against taxes?

Was tanker drivers "blockading" refineries to protest against the horrors of the fuel price escalator. Had about 80% popular support to start with, until people couldn't get fuel.

I remember the fuel companies not trying too hard to get past the "blockades".

orraloon

Tanker drivers working on behalf of others? Jings, that must have been a one and only. Weren't the 70s fuel shortages and queues at the pumps all about driver strikes for cash?

Stevo_666

Slowmart wrote:

Stevo referencing and linking articles from the Guardian....

Well, you can guess the reaction if I linked to Telegraph articles...and linking to DM or Express articles is for entertainment purposes only

kingstongraham

orraloon wrote:

Tanker drivers working on behalf of others? Jings, that must have been a one and only.

Never said that - they suffered from the escalator, obviously. I can't imagine how bad it must have been to have to pay over 80p a litre.

pblakeney

Probably in a similar vein to how I was going to give up my car if it got to £2/gallon.

robert88

In case of a no deal Brexit I am going to change my high-viz to orange so's not to engage the attention of the emergency forces.

rick_chasey

So a fairly big suspicion Russians have helped move the movement on from a fringe thing.

rjsterry

Rick Chasey wrote:

So a fairly big suspicion Russians have helped move the movement on from a fringe thing.

If they haven't, their superior officer is probably asking why not.

rick_chasey

Ja sure - I think they are fairly heavily involved.

FocusZing

Mr Goo wrote:

Although many on here will denounce the riots in France against tax hikes on fuel. They have at least achieved their goal as Macron does a U-turn. Chapeau!
Just can't see us passive Brits doing the same. We'd sooner take it up the Arsenal and just moan about it.

It kicked off when the poll tax was tried by the Thatch.

FishFish

orraloon wrote:

Tanker drivers working on behalf of others? Jings, that must have been a one and only. Weren't the 70s fuel shortages and queues at the pumps all about driver strikes for cash?

No. That was because of a price hike by the oil producing countries. Benefited the west through the 'recycling of the petrodollar' phenomenon.

robert88

FocusZing wrote:

Mr Goo wrote:

Although many on here will denounce the riots in France against tax hikes on fuel. They have at least achieved their goal as Macron does a U-turn. Chapeau!
Just can't see us passive Brits doing the same. We'd sooner take it up the Arsenal and just moan about it.

It kicked off when the poll tax was tried by the Thatch.

In fact the poll tax riots were a kind of last gasp rather than the start of anything. Throughout the Thatcher years a considerable amount of effort had gone into making popular protests difficult, including the selling of council houses, suppression of union power and encouragement of personal indebtedness. In addition the violent confrontation between police and miners in the mid eighties made it clear that the state, if determined enough, would win. The protest against the poll tax worked because it was a manifestly unfair tax and opposition to it had huge national support (far greater than for Brexit!). Electoral suicide.