Nailing your colours to the mast

Pross

People threw tacks on the road at the first Velothon, the organisation was a shambles that year which didn't help. They did listen and learn a bit the following year and made some route changes that anyone who knew the area could have advised in the first place. Since then I'm not aware of any issues, it is advertised well in advance and people are getting to understand what is involved. That said, people who compare these things to urban closures such as the London Marathon or say 'it's only one day' etc. are missing the point. There are sections of the Velothon route where you would have to park your car several miles away if you were planning to go out on the day, that first year there were several wedding parties that had booked a year or two in advance only to find they couldn't access their venue, my wife manages supported living schemes within the road closure area and they have to put their staff on double shifts as they can't change over (last year they were given passes that were supposed to allow them to gain access but on the day the marshals knew nothing about it) so whilst it's not a major inconvenience for the majority without very good organisation they certainly cause problems. If it was for a charity or a not-for-profit organisation people would be more sympathetic but as far as I'm aware, in the case of Velthon, they are a money making business.

ugo.santalucia

Gethinceri wrote:

I've never experienced any of those things on a sportive.

The best/worst village experience was undoubtedly Eroica Britannia 2016 in Bakewell... we walked in ankle deep mud for hours... Boardman turned up and said two sentences... other than that, great big queues for everything... I queued an hour just to register and access the mud field...

Although as queues go, it wasn't the worst... Dragon Ride 2008... I think I queued nearly two hours to get going... to the point that it was getting late and I decided to do the medio course instead of the gran course, so I could get home in time for bed.

de_sisti

To the OP; If there is planned disruption why don't you inform the police? Secondly, if the
organisersreceived feedback from riders who, eg. stayed in the area for the weekend,
spending money in shops, b and bs, etc; I'm sure the monetary effect could be shown to
the local residents, who'd see that the whole event would have generated £££s for the local area.

awavey

Peat wrote:

awavey wrote:

that sounds more like the ToB with rolling road blocks, when TdF came through Yorkshire, the road was closed from 10ish at least I think,the riders didnt come through till mid afternoon 2-3pm,and I dont think the road reopened till 4pm. and it will be the same for the world championships, and last more than a day.

Those events have a bit of cache and could be argued to bring something to the community. A world class race passing through your town can boost tourism blah blah.

I fail to see how a thousands of nodders trickling through for 7hrs are going to benefit the local economy. The participants are unlikely to be stopping given there are food/water stops laid on elsewhere. I don't see it being anything other than a nuisance to locals.
.

but food stops arent always well placed or well stocked, I did one earlier in the year where the 1st stop was at 20miles,the next at 60m but we were only doing 75miles, so most of us stopped off at the 50mile point in a small village/town that had a few coffee shops, and then last year I did one 1st stop and it wasnt that Id set off late or anything, but theyd completely miscalculated rider numbers and had nothing left, not even any water to fill up with, so it was like at that stage quick find the nearest shop to stock up. and if you dont live in the area then you are going to have stayed at a hotel or b&b locally, maybe gone for a quick recce of the route the day before, stopped to eat in local pubs/restaurants etc.

these events do generate measurable local economic benefits both short term and long term as people are willing to return to places that are openly welcoming them

ben@31

Slowbike wrote:

There was a letter published in West Sussex today paper suggesting that Chichester residents wouldn't be able to attend Church in Lavant due to the road closure - ok, assume they can't walk (there is a footpath) or ride their bikes (there's a cycle path that goes underneath the route) then the next option would be to cross the route by car - but without knowing the official crossing points you can't even start to consider if it's an option.

I would love to know the percentage of Chichester residents who actually attend Church?

A nice, uncomplicated ride - often on roads that you wouldn't ride, even as a group ride.
ie Etap Loch Ness - comes down the north side of the Loch - it's a dangerous road, I believe there is a cycle track - but anyway, not a road I'd like to ride down - closed (for the morning)... the route round the south of the Loch is lanes and perfectly ok to cycle - but being closed you don't need to worry about oncoming traffic, so you can open the taps a little more.

@slowbike... From my own experience of closed road events (the Etap Loch Ness, was one) the start time was ridiculously ridiculously early on a Sunday. So I can't imagine there was much disruption. Usually the only people who were about at that time was the runners or cyclists.
I agree with you, I wouldnt cycle down the A82 if it was open to traffic !

peat

A royal flush on the bicycle-bingo card:


This doesn't reflect everyone in that group, but they are in there.

mellex

I rode Velo Birmingham last year and really enjoyed the event. Lots of small teething problems but on the whole, I'd say it was a success.

Regardless of my experience or opinion, there is no Velo Birmingham this year so I decided to give Velo South a blast. Never ridden Ride London so I was quite looking forward to the experience. As I read this thread, I'm slowly beginning to picture scenes from Mad Max.

As for the insightful Rod Northway (above), I absolutely love people like him. I'd ride at 10 MPH for the whole course if I thought it'd make him explode in sheer Road Tax Rage.

ugo.santalucia

Rod is a bit of a moron, obviously and should know better about how road maintenance is funded... however...

I used to live in Surrey and I once drove to Leith hill and Ranmore, can't remember why, probably went for a walk with the wife. What I recall clearly was that every B road and lane was clogged with cyclists and the bottleneck effect was quite frustrating. I can kind of understand folks who have to deal with that every single weekend of the year. Obviously the solution is neither to ban cycling nor to ban driving... there might not be a solution, but it is indeed quite frustrating to plodder along at 10 mph, mainly because cars are not designed to go at that speed. It's not a case of being in a hurry, it is simply difficult to drive...

There might be a case for clubs promoting "smaller groups" rides, as the problem is proportional to the size of the group involved... 2-3 cyclists are genrally not a problem, 20-30 in a bunch are a problem.
Even there, the Kingston Wheelers have 600 members, so clearly not possible to have 30-40 rides with < 10 riders

I tend to ride on my own all the time which causes no grief for either side of the argument

slowbike

De Sisti wrote:

To the OP; If there is planned disruption why don't you inform the police? Secondly, if the
organisersreceived feedback from riders who, eg. stayed in the area for the weekend,
spending money in shops, b and bs, etc; I'm sure the monetary effect could be shown to
the local residents, who'd see that the whole event would have generated £££s for the local area.

Because they're probably just threats and they won't actually do anything.

slowbike

ugo.santalucia wrote:

Rod is a bit of a moron, obviously and should know better about how road maintenance is funded... however...

I used to live in Surrey and I once drove to Leith hill and Ranmore, can't remember why, probably went for a walk with the wife. What I recall clearly was that every B road and lane was clogged with cyclists and the bottleneck effect was quite frustrating. I can kind of understand folks who have to deal with that every single weekend of the year. Obviously the solution is neither to ban cycling nor to ban driving... there might not be a solution, but it is indeed quite frustrating to plodder along at 10 mph, mainly because cars are not designed to go at that speed. It's not a case of being in a hurry, it is simply difficult to drive...

There might be a case for clubs promoting "smaller groups" rides, as the problem is proportional to the size of the group involved... 2-3 cyclists are genrally not a problem, 20-30 in a bunch are a problem.
Even there, the Kingston Wheelers have 600 members, so clearly not possible to have 30-40 rides with < 10 riders

I tend to ride on my own all the time which causes no grief for either side of the argument

There's an easy solution ...

stop building so many houses in the surrounding areas ... make the population less dense (not as in IQ - although that would help) and there would be less people using the roads full stop.

shirley_basso

Issue with the above Mr SB is the volume of traffic would increase as public transport infrastructure wouldn't be up to dealing with everyone so spread out.

Would need to consider where all that traffic would go and where may increase density, and thus congestion.

peat

ugo.santalucia wrote:

I tend to ride on my own all the time which causes no grief for either side of the argument

Not strictly true. If you are riding alone and there is a continual flow of oncoming traffic, cars behind will not be able to pass. Now, of course, as a cyclist and driver that falls under 'tough sh1t' to me. But that will burst the blood vessels of others.

step83

When I did ToC a few years back the road blocks were semi rolling you had to pass a certain point before X time blah blah blah, seemed to work. Plus we had a warning that emergency vehicle can and will use the route.
On the whole though the residents all seemed rather happy cheering tables out in the garden to watch pubs full of drunks cheering as you whizz by.

Id say I've had more agro on open road events because you end up with a load of riders strung out along a road making it hard to pass so you end up with shouty angry drivers.

peat

ugo.santalucia wrote:

There might be a case for clubs promoting "smaller groups" rides, as the problem is proportional to the size of the group involved... 2-3 cyclists are genrally not a problem, 20-30 in a bunch are a problem.
Even there, the Kingston Wheelers have 600 members, so clearly not possible to have 30-40 rides with < 10 riders
t

My club has some rather informal rules on group splitting, but it invites scrutiny. If you split the ride at 15 riders, you could argue that 14 riders causes no less a problem. Then it get's complicated on the day. When you split a ride into 2 groups, there is always a perception of a 'slow' and a 'fast' group - thus 90% of the 30 or so riders that turn up try to roll off in Group 1 because "Hey! I'm fast!".

More often than not, the larger of the two groups will have to stop for a mechanical and group 2 rolls on by blowing kisses and taking all the seats at the cafe. Beautiful justice.

I don't know where i'am going with this in relation to the thread. Oh yes - group rides causing disruption. I don't think even the most ardent cycling supporter could argue that they don't.

And in the context of a mass-participation sportive, even an open-road event is bordering on the irresponsible. I don't think they do cycling a favour in terms of public opinion.

slowbike

Peat wrote:

I don't know where i'am going with this in relation to the thread. Oh yes - group rides causing disruption. I don't think even the most ardent cycling supporter could argue that they don't.

Group riding causes disruption
Single riding causes disruption
Driving a lorry causes disruption
Driving a tractor causes disruption
Driving a bus causes disruption

and I could go on ...

Any time anyone takes to the road there's a good chance they'll be inconveniencing someone else also wanting to use that road. Why is their use of the road any more important than the others?

N0bodyOfTheGoat

Lets use the money saved from Brexit to widen all the UK roads, to allow cars to overtake bikes safely without crossing the central painted line.

peat

Slowbike wrote:

Peat wrote:

- Any time anyone takes to the road there's a good chance they'll be inconveniencing someone else also wanting to use that road.

- Why is their use of the road any more important than the others?

- Quite.

- I don't think I said it did(?).

ugo.santalucia

Peat wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

I tend to ride on my own all the time which causes no grief for either side of the argument

Not strictly true. If you are riding alone and there is a continual flow of oncoming traffic, cars behind will not be able to pass. Now, of course, as a cyclist and driver that falls under 'tough sh1t' to me. But that will burst the blood vessels of others.

It seems to be a very rare occurrence... I very rarely get honked at and hardly ever experience any road rage when on my own... much more frequently if I join a small group in an Audax.

I tend to be collaborative if the lane is small, I generally wave the car behind when they can pass or I slow down if there is a widening... they generally appreciate and wave back in return or flash their indicators in acknowledgement...

It's all very civilised and I don't see why it shouldn't be... the problem arises when drivers have the perception that cyclists are aware of the traffic behind but don't give a toss about it, or worse take pleasure to cause disruption... and in some cases that might even be the case