More trouble for Team SKY.

Matthewfalle

RichN95 wrote:

Matthewfalle wrote:

As an aside, didn't sky have a no needles policy?

No

Most of the 'whiter than white' claims made on Sky's behalf were never said by them.

Their Zero Tolerance Policy was just nothing more than a recruitment policy.

Right. My new recruitment policy.

Come and work for me and I promise you won't get shot at or blown up or shouted at or have to polish your shoes.

(This may be untrue as it's just a recruitment policy by the way).

RichN95.

Matthewfalle wrote:

Right. My new recruitment policy.

Come and work for me and I promise you won't get shot at or blown up or shouted at or have to polish your shoes.

(This may be untrue as it's just a recruitment policy by the way).

Why don't you just grow up. No-one is impressed by you.

CuthbertC

RichN95 wrote:

CuthbertC wrote:

Brailsford was asked about it:

The Committee asked David Brailsford whether Bradley Wiggins had used corticosteroids like triamcinolone, out of competition and therefore without the need for a TUE. He replied, “Not to my knowledge”, but also stated that he “would not ask the medical department” about this, as “That was up to them.

Could you point out the bit where he's asked about other riders?

Yes, Wiggins wasn't using it OOC but other riders were, even though they were training together. Makes sense.

Instead of shifting the goalposts every time you are shown to be ignorant, please read the report first.

Matthewfalle

Weren't needles also banned by the UCI in 2012? Or was this another recruitment policy?

Matthewfalle

RichN95 wrote:

Matthewfalle wrote:

Right. My new recruitment policy.

Come and work for me and I promise you won't get shot at or blown up or shouted at or have to polish your shoes.

(This may be untrue as it's just a recruitment policy by the way).

Why don't you just grow up. No-one is impressed by you.

Sorry - I don't understand your comment.

Sky's recruitment policy is as watertight as mine. At least I won't tell fibs about needles, so I'm one up there I suppose.

iainf72

Matthewfalle wrote:

If you got a bollocking due to some bloke's wife then I am impressed - big phat no needles hat.

I love your cherry picking. You have no interest in the truth.

I also managed to annoy Lance in 2008, using my real name when ProCycling asked him a question in an interview. He's still blocking me on twitter for it. That's probably the more exciting one though.

RichN95.

CuthbertC wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

CuthbertC wrote:

Brailsford was asked about it:

The Committee asked David Brailsford whether Bradley Wiggins had used corticosteroids like triamcinolone, out of competition and therefore without the need for a TUE. He replied, “Not to my knowledge”, but also stated that he “would not ask the medical department” about this, as “That was up to them.

Could you point out the bit where he's asked about other riders?

Yes, Wiggins wasn't using it OOC but other riders were, even though they were training together. Makes sense.

Instead of shifting the goalposts every time you are shown to be ignorant, please read the report first.

I'm not shifting goalposts. My point has remained the same. The report should not make an allegation without a publicly released source and Sky given right to reply. Neither thing has happened.

You put something up as evidence that they had been asked about other riders which did not mention other riders.

Vino'sGhost

RichN95 wrote:

CuthbertC wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

CuthbertC wrote:

Brailsford was asked about it:

The Committee asked David Brailsford whether Bradley Wiggins had used corticosteroids like triamcinolone, out of competition and therefore without the need for a TUE. He replied, “Not to my knowledge”, but also stated that he “would not ask the medical department” about this, as “That was up to them.

Could you point out the bit where he's asked about other riders?

Yes, Wiggins wasn't using it OOC but other riders were, even though they were training together. Makes sense.

Instead of shifting the goalposts every time you are shown to be ignorant, please read the report first.

I'm not shifting goalposts. My point has remained the same. The report should not make an allegation without a publicly released source and Sky given right to reply. Neither thing has happened.

You put something up as evidence that they had been asked about other riders which did not mention other riders.

But Sky hav every chance to respond. Infact if you look at the BBC you can see Wiggins replying. He says hes never doped. So thats that then. Its all clear.

Unless he's a sporting fraud of course........

CuthbertC

RichN95 wrote:

CuthbertC wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

CuthbertC wrote:

Brailsford was asked about it:

The Committee asked David Brailsford whether Bradley Wiggins had used corticosteroids like triamcinolone, out of competition and therefore without the need for a TUE. He replied, “Not to my knowledge”, but also stated that he “would not ask the medical department” about this, as “That was up to them.

Could you point out the bit where he's asked about other riders?

Yes, Wiggins wasn't using it OOC but other riders were, even though they were training together. Makes sense.

Instead of shifting the goalposts every time you are shown to be ignorant, please read the report first.

I'm not shifting goalposts. My point has remained the same. The report should not make an allegation without a publicly released source and Sky given right to reply. Neither thing has happened.

You put something up as evidence that they had been asked about other riders which did not mention other riders.

Brailsford would also have lied about other riders:

Asked by The Cycling Podcast if Team Sky had used cortisone to prepare riders for races, Brailsford said: 'No, absolutely not, because if it was being used for that purpose and that purpose alone then for me that would be over the line.'

iainf72

This is good. I remember exchanging messages with Lionel around this time

https://www.lionelbirnie.com/blog/2018/ ... j8z6c1z7kl

[There's mention of who I got told off over too in there]

RichN95.

CuthbertC wrote:

Brailsford would also have lied about other riders:

Asked by The Cycling Podcast if Team Sky had used cortisone to prepare riders for races, Brailsford said: 'No, absolutely not, because if it was being used for that purpose and that purpose alone then for me that would be over the line.'

So the Committee had no obligation to ask Sky because there was a risk they might get an answer they didn't like. Righty-ho.

tailwindhome

CuthbertC

RichN95 wrote:

CuthbertC wrote:

Brailsford would also have lied about other riders:

Asked by The Cycling Podcast if Team Sky had used cortisone to prepare riders for races, Brailsford said: 'No, absolutely not, because if it was being used for that purpose and that purpose alone then for me that would be over the line.'

So the Committee had no obligation to ask Sky because there was a risk they might get an answer they didn't like. Righty-ho.

I didn't say they had no obligation. In reality, his answer would have been the same, so getting hung up on other riders is beside the point.

It is also possible that the source made the allegation after Brailsford was questioned.

kleinstroker

TailWindHome wrote:

The unnamed source?

antsmithmk

Debeli wrote:

Salsiccia1 wrote:

It looks like they gamed the system, and it's not a good look. But if anybody is equating Wiggins with 'proper' cheats like Riis, Pantani (who I note is still deified by many cycling fans), Armstrong et al then they need to have a word with themselves.

I quite understand this post. I am a fan of cycling and in my youth I greatly admired Pantani. I still do. Likewise Indurain, Evans, Ekimov, Contador and many other dopers.
I have long admired Wiggins, mostly for his track successes. I admit I never thought he would win a GT. But I am delighted that he did.
Nonetheless, I believe that many have long thought that Sky (and indeed British Cycling) have been sailing very close to the wind for quite a while. It is the juxtaposition of high-horse moralising and what appears to be a deeply cynical attitude to integrity and ethics that jars slightly with me.
I remain very keen on cycling and will doubtless follow it for years to come. It is not football... One does not have a "team". There are riders one likes more than others and teams one wishes well. And stages one enjoys following whoever wins.
But I do see Sky and Froome and Wiggins as tarnished now and I do still admire Pantani and I do not feel the need to have a word with myself. Others may disagree.

Cadel Evans doped? I missed that one.

Pross

Matthewfalle wrote:

Weren't needles also banned by the UCI in 2012? Or was this another recruitment policy?

Can you point to the part of that regulation that has been broken by Wiggins please?

To make it easier here is the link and the 'no needles' policy is regulation 13.3.052

http://www.uci.ch/mm/Document/News/Rulesandregulation/16/26/69/13-SEC-20150101-E_English.pdf

blazing_saddles

Pross wrote:

Matthewfalle wrote:

Weren't needles also banned by the UCI in 2012? Or was this another recruitment policy?

Can you point to the part of that regulation that has been broken by Wiggins please?

To make it easier here is the link and the 'no needles' policy is regulation 13.3.052

http://www.uci.ch/mm/Document/News/Rulesandregulation/16/26/69/13-SEC-20150101-E_English.pdf

Another former Team Sky member has confirmed to Cyclingnews that riders used intravenous recovery products at other races during the spring of 2011.

The so-called 'recup' programme was also due to be made available to riders during the Giro d'Italia. However, the plan was not activated because the UCI fast-tracked a no-needle policy, introduced on May 4, just before the start of Giro d'Italia.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/for ... rey-areas/

Pross

Blazing Saddles wrote:

Pross wrote:

Matthewfalle wrote:

Weren't needles also banned by the UCI in 2012? Or was this another recruitment policy?

Can you point to the part of that regulation that has been broken by Wiggins please?

To make it easier here is the link and the 'no needles' policy is regulation 13.3.052

http://www.uci.ch/mm/Document/News/Rulesandregulation/16/26/69/13-SEC-20150101-E_English.pdf

Another former Team Sky member has confirmed to Cyclingnews that riders used intravenous recovery products at other races during the spring of 2011.

The so-called 'recup' programme was also due to be made available to riders during the Giro d'Italia. However, the plan was not activated because the UCI fast-tracked a no-needle policy, introduced on May 4, just before the start of Giro d'Italia.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/for ... rey-areas/

Interesting article, in particular that a doctor who is apparently opposed to unethical use of medicines in sport suggests that Froome should have a TUE for triamcinolone rather than relying on high doses of salbutamol. Particularly pertinent when the CMS report is suggesting medical opinion is that triamcinolone shouldn't be used as a standard treatment for asthma.

larkim

Love the anonymous source being used as a "porn" in the whole setup ;-)

Matthewfalle

Sally and weight loss following triamy drama.....

Coincidence?

https://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/health ... -aasf.html

https://www.roidsseek.com/weight-loss-3 ... -4515.html

RichN95.

Blazing Saddles wrote:

Pross wrote:

Matthewfalle wrote:

Weren't needles also banned by the UCI in 2012? Or was this another recruitment policy?

Can you point to the part of that regulation that has been broken by Wiggins please?

To make it easier here is the link and the 'no needles' policy is regulation 13.3.052

http://www.uci.ch/mm/Document/News/Rulesandregulation/16/26/69/13-SEC-20150101-E_English.pdf

Another former Team Sky member has confirmed to Cyclingnews that riders used intravenous recovery products at other races during the spring of 2011.

The so-called 'recup' programme was also due to be made available to riders during the Giro d'Italia. However, the plan was not activated because the UCI fast-tracked a no-needle policy, introduced on May 4, just before the start of Giro d'Italia.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/features/for ... rey-areas/

This all gets to the crux of it. People portray Sky as though their approach to healthcare was 'have a cup of tea and two aspirin and see if you feel better'. It never was - certainly not past 2010. They have always been open that they'll use the best healthcare available.

But in the absence of genuine doping scandals, healthcare has become a 'grey area'. Riders who have trained for months towards a goal can't treat a problem if it arises. And riding on with a treated illness is a health risk in a sport were even a Giro winner can get killed training.

The sport needs to grow up.

awavey

Matthewfalle wrote:

Sally and weight loss following triamy drama.....

Coincidence?

https://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/health ... -aasf.html

https://www.roidsseek.com/weight-loss-3 ... -4515.html

coincidence? thats jo-incidence with a c...it is not a weight loss drug by any stretch of the imagination I can assure you of that

RichN95.

It's good to see the likes of Floyd Landis and Tiernan-Locke being wheeled out to give their opinions. I applaud this committment to balance. Watching the Oscars last night I was very disappointed that they didn't get the view on the #MeToo movement from Roman Polanski and Kevin Spacey.

Vino'sGhost

RichN95 wrote:

It's good to see the likes of Floyd Landis and Tiernan-Locke being wheeled out to give their opinions. I applaud this committment to balance. Watching the Oscars last night I was very disappointed that they didn't get the view on the #MeToo movement from Roman Polanski and Kevin Spacey.

LOLOL that would make watching the oscars worthwhile

durhamwasp

All very sad stuff, and even sadder is the realisation that if Sky and Wiggo are pushing the rules to the absolute limit, then so to will the other teams and major contenders.

kleinstroker

It amazes me that the likes of Rasmussen and Landis are chiming in now with Sky are doping etc, yet none of them realise that their favourite PED's work in the exact opposite way to Triamcinolone which is a catabolic steroid, meaning it strips muscle mass not adds it, so the supposed performance enhancing part of this scandal is being overlooked.
How on earth they reconcile the two is just ignoring the facts, but it sounds good so the papers and media can latch onto it

twotoebenny

durhamwasp wrote:

All very sad stuff, and even sadder is the realisation that if Sky and Wiggo are pushing the rules to the absolute limit, then so to will the other teams and major contenders.

I don't understand why people find this sad or even surprising. Imo even the cleanest of clean athletes in all sports will be pushing boundaries to be that little bit better (within the rules).

RichN95.

durhamwasp wrote:

All very sad stuff, and even sadder is the realisation that if Sky and Wiggo are pushing the rules to the absolute limit, then so to will the other teams and major contenders.

So what if they are. If they're within the rules then what's the problem? This is just a contest according to an arbritary set of rules. You can't just make up your own rules and complain people don't follow them.

tailwindhome

RichN95 wrote:

It's good to see the likes of Floyd Landis and Tiernan-Locke being wheeled out to give their opinions. I applaud this committment to balance. Watching the Oscars last night I was very disappointed that they didn't get the view on the #MeToo movement from Roman Polanski and Kevin Spacey.

You may want to have another run at that.
Doesn't really work does it?

Richmond Racer 2

TailWindHome wrote:

RichN95 wrote:

It's good to see the likes of Floyd Landis and Tiernan-Locke being wheeled out to give their opinions. I applaud this committment to balance. Watching the Oscars last night I was very disappointed that they didn't get the view on the #MeToo movement from Roman Polanski and Kevin Spacey.

You may want to have another run at that.
Doesn't really work does it?

Umm