Armed Forces Veterans

BelgianBeerGeek

Govt plans here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-42336381

Has HMG nothing better to do than this?

rolf_f

BelgianBeerGeek wrote:

Govt plans here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-42336381

Has HMG nothing better to do than this?

Got to do something to generate some positive headlines in the Daily Mail.

fenix

FFS and could be implemented in the early 20's....

I don't hold out much hope of a successful Brexit if its going to take 5 years to implement a 'v'.

mr_goo

I'm all for veterans having an acknowledgement of their service to the country. But surely a better way to do this is to support those that are suffering from mental health issues and/or find themselves homeless. This to me would be far better than a 'V' on a drivers license.

fenix

Blue Passports and V's on driving licences - oh Government you really are spoiling us !

veronese68

Have to agree with all of the comments above.
To answer Goo's point by doing this the government can look like they are doing something but actually doing incredibly little. The relevant bit is this:

The card would give holders easier access to specialist services and to offers, including retail discounts.

Any specialist services from the NHS they wouldn't need this on their driving licence, but it means the government can pretend they are doing something and puts pressure on retailers to offer discounts to ex-service personnel.

trivial_poursuivant

How about you just pay us properly? Most units are at 33% manning and retention and recruitment is well below required numbers. Giving us more work for less pay and then expecting us to gap fill others who go on strike when it’s a cause of action we are barred from copying. Stupid crap like this shows the level of contempt the govt has for the armed forces. V is more like a f*ck you hand sign than it means veteran

ryan_w-2

If it gets me anything for free, I’m all for this!

BelgianBeerGeek

I want to know how they are going to administer this. Would you really give these benefits (whatever they may be) to anyone who has ever served in HM Forces? What about the guys who drop out of training after a week? Or those who get kicked out for criminal offences or fail drugs tests?

pblakeney

BelgianBeerGeek wrote:

I want to know how they are going to administer this. Would you really give these benefits (whatever they may be) to anyone who has ever served in HM Forces? What about the guys who drop out of training after a week? Or those who get kicked out for criminal offences or fail drugs tests?

Should be quite simple. British Cycling seem to manage it for very little input.
Five years service with an honourable discharge sufficient?

trivial_poursuivant

BelgianBeerGeek wrote:

I want to know how they are going to administer this. Would you really give these benefits (whatever they may be) to anyone who has ever served in HM Forces? What about the guys who drop out of training after a week? Or those who get kicked out for criminal offences or fail drugs tests?

Not exactly sure how the DVLA are going to know a persons service history. I don't like the idea of that being shared with another agency. As you mention, anyone being in the military for 5 minutes still has a service number regardless of how far into training they got.

Ben6899

So perhaps a points system?

fenix

They've probably got a few generals itching for money off at Waitrose.

ryan_w-2

I’d like to think there would be a sensible cut-off point for this.

Say 6 years served onwards.

As stated, some cnut that pulled the pin halfway through trade training shouldn’t receive the perks.

webboo

To be referrred to NHS veterans mental health services you have to have served for a minimum of one day.

cougie

I'd not get over excited about this. It's probably going to be the same kind of discount scheme that any big company has. A bit of discount at the shops. It's not going to change lives and their implementation date is absolutely ridiculous.

Meanwhile they'll dismantle the NHS a lot quicker than it takes them to set up a half arsed discount scheme.

rick_chasey

They could just give better financial & other support to vets who actually need it, rather than having to rely on charity half the time.

That would be welcomed by pretty much everyone.

BelgianBeerGeek

cougie wrote:

I'd not get over excited about this. It's probably going to be the same kind of discount scheme that any big company has. A bit of discount at the shops. It's not going to change lives and their implementation date is absolutely ridiculous.

Meanwhile they'll dismantle the NHS a lot quicker than it takes them to set up a half arsed discount scheme.

There already are discount schemes for lots of stuff for the forces. And most I know aren't backwards about asking - after all, shy kiddies get no sweeties.
What the does the Govt think it has to gain from interfering in these schemes? Unless, as stated already, it's a deflection ploy to prevent vets getting better treatment.

tangled_metal

Pointless and offensive too.

OK, it's a while off being implemented. It doesn't affect access to mental health care because let's be honest here there isn't any worth seeking out, plus a V on your driving licence (assuming you have one) is hardly visible. Why should veterans get discounts that aren't available to others? Is it risk related reason? Fine then put a F on firemen and women's licence and a P on police. What about ambulance service? Frontline A&E staff? What risk level gets discount?

Seriously, why? Which brainiac had this idea?

Properly funded veterans hospitals around the country. Properly funded support organization around the country. Forget this supporting charities rubbish, just support veterans directly in a way that would make a difference to the figures you hear of increased alcohol and drug problems among veterans or the increased numbers of homeless veterans, family abuse, PTSD, family breakups, etc, etc, etc. Support the families too of serving and further service personnel too.

Money my friend. Anything worth doing right costs and supporting armed service personnel through the whole recruitment, service and post service is worth doing right IMHO.

But I don't actually agree with retail discounts. That has nothing to do with your military service.

webboo

In April this year NHS England launched a new veterans mental health service. It was called the Transition, Intervention and Liaison Veterans mental health service. It replaced a service that had been funded on a year by year as a pilot service.
The new service was supposed to be all singing and dancing.
However it has half the budget of the pilot service.

mamba80

Tangled Metal wrote:

Pointless and offensive too.

OK, it's a while off being implemented. It doesn't affect access to mental health care because let's be honest here there isn't any worth seeking out, plus a V on your driving licence (assuming you have one) is hardly visible. Why should veterans get discounts that aren't available to others? Is it risk related reason? Fine then put a F on firemen and women's licence and a P on police. What about ambulance service? Frontline A&E staff? What risk level gets discount?

Seriously, why? Which brainiac had this idea?

Properly funded veterans hospitals around the country. Properly funded support organization around the country. Forget this supporting charities rubbish, just support veterans directly in a way that would make a difference to the figures you hear of increased alcohol and drug problems among veterans or the increased numbers of homeless veterans, family abuse, PTSD, family breakups, etc, etc, etc. Support the families too of serving and further service personnel too.

Money my friend. Anything worth doing right costs and supporting armed service personnel through the whole recruitment, service and post service is worth doing right IMHO.

But I don't actually agree with retail discounts. That has nothing to do with your military service.

Agree, there is the veteran who has done 3 tours of NI & survived Sir Galahad and there is the guy who was based in Germany and Cyprus for 5 years.

All Governments need to stop relying on the british legion and live up to its obligations and start looking after people it has sent into war.

robert88

Is it a good idea for ex-servicemen to be so easily identified? e.g. when travelling in certain countries or whatever. Some people don't like the armed forces.

rick_chasey

Robert88 wrote:

Is it a good idea for ex-servicemen to be so easily identified? e.g. when travelling in certain countries or whatever. Some people don't like the armed forces.

it's not a tatoo.

mamba80

Robert88 wrote:

Is it a good idea for ex-servicemen to be so easily identified? e.g. when travelling in certain countries or whatever. Some people don't like the armed forces.

if you r in those sort of countries, you either carry a different passport or are working in "security"

Lagrange

I was in the army for 8 years and enjoyed it and left it. I'm doing well and don't give a toss for my past or any contrived benefit that I don't really want or need.

bianchimoon

Nurses, firemen, police? The thought of being singled out for special treatment because of the job you do is ridiculous. For the government to do this and for the occupations mentioned to agree to this is demeaning. Pay, train and treat people properly in the first instance. It reminds me of giving children a star sticker in primary school, or an idea the trump administration would come up with.

tangled_metal

That's why I find it offensive.

Why armed forces and not other services? Why one job over another. Why identification to access services you should have easy access to anyway? Why identification anyway?

Any person who gives a lot to their job, is that worth benefits or does it have to be certain jobs only? Is the nurse, vet, cleaner, banker, charity worker, volunteer, etc worth less? Why? How is worth calculated? Is army pay not remuneration for their job that they're needing retail discount in service or after service?

For me this stupid idea leaves me with questions. How is worth calculated? Is pay not enough for the job? It seems the government values armed forces but not enough to help past service men and women in need. Politically it pays Tories to place high value on the serving members of armed forces and the veterans on the surface but not enough to provide the money to provide support services to veterans.

trivial_poursuivant

Tangled Metal wrote:

That's why I find it offensive.

Why armed forces and not other services? Why one job over another. Why identification to access services you should have easy access to anyway? Why identification anyway?

Any person who gives a lot to their job, is that worth benefits or does it have to be certain jobs only? Is the nurse, vet, cleaner, banker, charity worker, volunteer, etc worth less? Why? How is worth calculated? Is army pay not remuneration for their job that they're needing retail discount in service or after service?

For me this stupid idea leaves me with questions. How is worth calculated? Is pay not enough for the job? It seems the government values armed forces but not enough to help past service men and women in need. Politically it pays Tories to place high value on the serving members of armed forces and the veterans on the surface but not enough to provide the money to provide support services to veterans.

I’ve served 19 years so far. I don’t want anything like this. What I want if to be paid fairly for the job we are asked to do. We are seriously undermanned, under equipped and moral is seriously low. There are troops deployed at the moment who are the last to receive the op tour bonus. Next rotation of personnel out on Op Toral will not get a bonus. Where is the incentive to do the job any more? F*ck poxy benefits on a drivers license. What about pay, pensions, kit? All our budget gets swallowed up to fund crap projects . Never mind the money spent on aircraft carriers. The amount wasted on projects delivered too late or not up to standard would make your jaw hit the floor if you knew the costs. Money that could have been better spent on people.

bianchimoon

Tangled Metal wrote:

That's why I find it offensive.

Why armed forces and not other services? Why one job over another. Why identification to access services you should have easy access to anyway? Why identification anyway?

Any person who gives a lot to their job, is that worth benefits or does it have to be certain jobs only? Is the nurse, vet, cleaner, banker, charity worker, volunteer, etc worth less? Why? How is worth calculated? Is army pay not remuneration for their job that they're needing retail discount in service or after service?

For me this stupid idea leaves me with questions. How is worth calculated? Is pay not enough for the job? It seems the government values armed forces but not enough to help past service men and women in need. Politically it pays Tories to place high value on the serving members of armed forces and the veterans on the surface but not enough to provide the money to provide support services to veterans.

You’re right, your phrase “needing retail discount” sums it up... charity, embarrassing

bianchimoon

Trivial poursuivant wrote:

Tangled Metal wrote:

That's why I find it offensive.

Why armed forces and not other services? Why one job over another. Why identification to access services you should have easy access to anyway? Why identification anyway?

Any person who gives a lot to their job, is that worth benefits or does it have to be certain jobs only? Is the nurse, vet, cleaner, banker, charity worker, volunteer, etc worth less? Why? How is worth calculated? Is army pay not remuneration for their job that they're needing retail discount in service or after service?

For me this stupid idea leaves me with questions. How is worth calculated? Is pay not enough for the job? It seems the government values armed forces but not enough to help past service men and women in need. Politically it pays Tories to place high value on the serving members of armed forces and the veterans on the surface but not enough to provide the money to provide support services to veterans.

I’ve served 19 years so far. I don’t want anything like this. What I want if to be paid fairly for the job we are asked to do. We are seriously undermanned, under equipped and moral is seriously low. There are troops deployed at the moment who are the last to receive the op tour bonus. Next rotation of personnel out on Op Toral will not get a bonus. Where is the incentive to do the job any more? F*ck poxy benefits on a drivers license. What about pay, pensions, kit? All our budget gets swallowed up to fund crap projects . Never mind the money spent on aircraft carriers. The amount wasted on projects delivered too late or not up to standard would make your jaw hit the floor if you knew the costs. Money that could have been better spent on people.

Again agree 100%, plus, how many senior officers would accept a V on there documents, they wouldn’t! Crumbs thrown to the foot soldiers!

rick_chasey

I tend go agree, but then armed forces people can be ordered to do some pretty horrendous stuff, and they put a lot on the line as part of their job.


I for one am chuffing glad we don’t have conscription in the U.K. because it’s my actual nightmare.

Just cos I don’t like all that army sh!t doesn’t mean the society ought not look after those who did suffer as a result.

Now, my big boss is ex army and he’s fine by all accounts and coins it, so I doubt he needs much assistance but a kid from my class with one arm left and no legs probably does, and he lives off charity.

That’s the issue. The legless guy needs some serious support, and not just token “support” once in November.