Froome Vuelta salbutamol problem
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People think it's an acronym, apparently.Mad_Malx wrote:Why is SKY written in capital letters?0 -
more from Walsh here https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/righ ... 73bd8eede80
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Vino'sGhost wrote:more from Walsh here https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/righ ... 73bd8eede8
:roll:
Everyone else is fine but team sky are wrong. How predictable of Mr Walsh."Unfortunately these days a lot of people don’t understand the real quality of a bike" Ernesto Colnago0 -
Bit of a sweeping generalization. You see plenty of Sky jerseys in France and the comments in L'équipe are pretty balanced in defense and dislike. Much like here to be honest.ademort wrote:OK, so it,s obvious that the French hate SKY and Froome. But what,s new, we knew that already.Similarly when Zinedine Zidane headbutted Marco Matterazi in the 2006 world cup final he waited to be shown a Red card by the referee instead of just walking off the pitch when we all knew what was coming.0 -
gsk82 wrote:Vino'sGhost wrote:more from Walsh here https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/righ ... 73bd8eede8
:roll:
Everyone else is fine but team sky are wrong. How predictable of Mr Walsh.
Froome riding the Giro with this hanging over his head would be bad for cycling. OK was it Rich made the point blame the authorities for this delay and there's something in that but if Sky are playing a delaying tactic it may be technically within the rules but they can't be surprised if fans and riders exercise their right to criticise his presence.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
DeVlaeminck wrote:gsk82 wrote:Vino'sGhost wrote:more from Walsh here https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/righ ... 73bd8eede8
:roll:
Everyone else is fine but team sky are wrong. How predictable of Mr Walsh.
Froome riding the Giro with this hanging over his head........ .
.....Against ,Nibali or Aru :shock:
Italians getting more vocal. Which is at odds in terms of recent history0 -
SpecialGuestStar wrote:DeVlaeminck wrote:gsk82 wrote:Vino'sGhost wrote:more from Walsh here https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/righ ... 73bd8eede8
:roll:
Everyone else is fine but team sky are wrong. How predictable of Mr Walsh.
Froome riding the Giro with this hanging over his head........ .
.....Against ,Nibali or Aru :shock:
Italians getting more vocal. Which is at odds in terms of recent history
The Giro tweeted out "Happy Birthday Pirata" a few days ago.0 -
Surely this is still at an investigation stage where evidence is invited from Froome. Then the case is either dropped or referred to a full hearing which would entail a provisional suspension. If they can't get to that stage in the eight months (only a month less than Ulissi's actual ban) they've had until the Giro then it will be someone has really messed up somewhere. If Froome is delaying just say - 'sorry, we gave you plenty of opportunity'DeVlaeminck wrote:gsk82 wrote:Vino'sGhost wrote:more from Walsh here https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/righ ... 73bd8eede8
:roll:
Everyone else is fine but team sky are wrong. How predictable of Mr Walsh.
Froome riding the Giro with this hanging over his head would be bad for cycling. OK was it Rich made the point blame the authorities for this delay and there's something in that but if Sky are playing a delaying tactic it may be technically within the rules but they can't be surprised if fans and riders exercise their right to criticise his presence.
It seems to me that UCI members calling for Sky to suspend him are trying to take the pressure off themselves.Twitter: @RichN950 -
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RichN95 wrote:
Surely this is still at an investigation stage where evidence is invited from Froome. Then the case is either dropped or referred to a full hearing which would entail a provisional suspension. If they can't get to that stage in the eight months (only a month less than Ulissi's actual ban) they've had until the Giro then it will be someone has really messed up somewhere. If Froome is delaying just say - 'sorry, we gave you plenty of opportunity'DeVlaeminck wrote:gsk82 wrote:Vino'sGhost wrote:more from Walsh here https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/righ ... 73bd8eede8
:roll:
Everyone else is fine but team sky are wrong. How predictable of Mr Walsh.
Froome riding the Giro with this hanging over his head would be bad for cycling. OK was it Rich made the point blame the authorities for this delay and there's something in that but if Sky are playing a delaying tactic it may be technically within the rules but they can't be surprised if fans and riders exercise their right to criticise his presence.
It seems to me that UCI members calling for Sky to suspend him are trying to take the pressure off themselves.
It makes you wonder why they haven't just suspended him - are the rules sufficiently tight that they are able to if Froome says he needs more time? Are they afraid that Froome may use lack of opportunity to present his case as some kind of defence.
It's difficult to know what the delay is and subsequently where the blame for it lies. As you say if it gets to the Giro someone has messed up but if SKY wanted to expedite this best guess is they could have done or at least explained why it is taking so long.[Castle Donington Ladies FC - going up in '22]0 -
DeVlaeminck wrote:RichN95 wrote:
Surely this is still at an investigation stage where evidence is invited from Froome. Then the case is either dropped or referred to a full hearing which would entail a provisional suspension. If they can't get to that stage in the eight months (only a month less than Ulissi's actual ban) they've had until the Giro then it will be someone has really messed up somewhere. If Froome is delaying just say - 'sorry, we gave you plenty of opportunity'DeVlaeminck wrote:gsk82 wrote:Vino'sGhost wrote:more from Walsh here https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/righ ... 73bd8eede8
:roll:
Everyone else is fine but team sky are wrong. How predictable of Mr Walsh.
Froome riding the Giro with this hanging over his head would be bad for cycling. OK was it Rich made the point blame the authorities for this delay and there's something in that but if Sky are playing a delaying tactic it may be technically within the rules but they can't be surprised if fans and riders exercise their right to criticise his presence.
It seems to me that UCI members calling for Sky to suspend him are trying to take the pressure off themselves.
It makes you wonder why they haven't just suspended him - are the rules sufficiently tight that they are able to if Froome says he needs more time? Are they afraid that Froome may use lack of opportunity to present his case as some kind of defence.
It's difficult to know what the delay is and subsequently where the blame for it lies. As you say if it gets to the Giro someone has messed up but if SKY wanted to expedite this best guess is they could have done or at least explained why it is taking so long.
Does anyone EXACTLY what the rules are for this ? You cant suspend someone if they are not guilty, but he has failed an A and B sample.0 -
sherer wrote:
Does anyone EXACTLY what the rules are for this ? You cant suspend someone if they are not guilty, but he has failed an A and B sample.
Don't the rules prescribe the intake limits - which they measure for by excreted levels in the urine. But those levels are arguably not representative of the intake - which will be froome's/sky's defence ie - no more than the allowed limit was taken, but the sample was reading high because XYZ ...
two failings here really ...
1) The method of testing isn't fool-proof
2) The time it takes to raise the charge and receive responses is too long
The obvious third failing is that all this is supposed to be done behind closed doors until such time as an outcome is reached. Now, froome/sky have gone from a "no evidence of doping but he probably is" to a "look, he's doping" in the eyes of many. Frustration is that for those of us with an open mind (I don't particularly warm to froome's public persona) - it's just a distraction from what should be going on.0 -
All I know is that if something is taking too long WADA can step in and refer the whole thing to CAS.sherer wrote:
Does anyone EXACTLY what the rules are for this ? You cant suspend someone if they are not guilty, but he has failed an A and B sample.
I think it's likely that CAFD and Froome's people have drawn up a schedule for dealing with this. This is like an iceberg, most of what's happening is hidden from view.Twitter: @RichN950 -
RichN95 wrote:
All I know is that if something is taking too long WADA can step in and refer the whole thing to CAS.sherer wrote:
Does anyone EXACTLY what the rules are for this ? You cant suspend someone if they are not guilty, but he has failed an A and B sample.
I think it's likely that CAFD and Froome's people have drawn up a schedule for dealing with this. This is like an iceberg, most of what's happening is hidden from view.
Interesting suggestion on the cycling podcast that his hard training in South Africa that is being loaded onto Strava matches quite nicely with volume he was doing in the Vuelta. About 3,000 km and 40,000 m of climbing over three weeks. This may be part of the investigation.0 -
KingstonGraham wrote:RichN95 wrote:
All I know is that if something is taking too long WADA can step in and refer the whole thing to CAS.sherer wrote:
Does anyone EXACTLY what the rules are for this ? You cant suspend someone if they are not guilty, but he has failed an A and B sample.
I think it's likely that CAFD and Froome's people have drawn up a schedule for dealing with this. This is like an iceberg, most of what's happening is hidden from view.
Interesting suggestion on the cycling podcast that his hard training in South Africa that is being loaded onto Strava matches quite nicely with volume he was doing in the Vuelta. About 3,000 km and 40,000 m of climbing over three weeks. This may be part of the investigation.
I suggested that somewhere a couple of weeks ago. It's my theory and I want my citation."Unfortunately these days a lot of people don’t understand the real quality of a bike" Ernesto Colnago0 -
gsk82 wrote:KingstonGraham wrote:RichN95 wrote:
All I know is that if something is taking too long WADA can step in and refer the whole thing to CAS.sherer wrote:
Does anyone EXACTLY what the rules are for this ? You cant suspend someone if they are not guilty, but he has failed an A and B sample.
I think it's likely that CAFD and Froome's people have drawn up a schedule for dealing with this. This is like an iceberg, most of what's happening is hidden from view.
Interesting suggestion on the cycling podcast that his hard training in South Africa that is being loaded onto Strava matches quite nicely with volume he was doing in the Vuelta. About 3,000 km and 40,000 m of climbing over three weeks. This may be part of the investigation.
I suggested that somewhere a couple of weeks ago. It's my theory and I want my citation.
I suggested dodgy kidney function 0 -
gsk82 wrote:KingstonGraham wrote:RichN95 wrote:
All I know is that if something is taking too long WADA can step in and refer the whole thing to CAS.sherer wrote:
Does anyone EXACTLY what the rules are for this ? You cant suspend someone if they are not guilty, but he has failed an A and B sample.
I think it's likely that CAFD and Froome's people have drawn up a schedule for dealing with this. This is like an iceberg, most of what's happening is hidden from view.
Interesting suggestion on the cycling podcast that his hard training in South Africa that is being loaded onto Strava matches quite nicely with volume he was doing in the Vuelta. About 3,000 km and 40,000 m of climbing over three weeks. This may be part of the investigation.
I suggested that somewhere a couple of weeks ago. It's my theory and I want my citation.
Unless you are listener Arthur Cook, you haven't got it. Sorry.0 -
Yeah. Big deal made out of the training miles in SA.
Can't imagine a serious favourite for the Giro doing less than that in January....“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
Considering your moniker it's rather ironic you are taking all the wind out of our sails there, Tailwind!
PTP Champion 2019, 2022 & 20230 -
Is it just me, or are the "SKY need to be more transparent" people staying remarkably quiet on the abject failure of the UCI to manage expectations by producing a transparent timeline for this case? Surely they've given SKY some deadlines? A large part of the current issue is the "cloud hanging over the Giro" theme.Warning No formatter is installed for the format0
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It's just a clusterf*ck. As per usual in cycling.PTP Champion 2019, 2022 & 20230
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Is it just plain unusual that Froome is posting stuff on Strava in the first place?
The whole thing is a great example of why transparency is not a good idea - transparency just breeds more theories from amateur sleuths and generates an environment such that when the final outcome is determined / known there result will not be accepted as valid by people who's pet theories have not been fully countered (most likely because those theories hold no water in the first place). MRM had the right description.2015 Canyon Nerve AL 6.0 (son #1's)
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2018 Voodoo Maji (wife's)0 -
There was just a phone in on Radio 5 about asthma and a lot of people were emphasising the necessary use of a 'spacer' so that the full proper dose is administered. I wonder if this has been considered with regard to WADA's calculation and whether Froome used one (it's not really suitable for use while riding, but after a race fine.
This is what it looks like
Twitter: @RichN950 -
Many years ago a mate if mine was working on using these for inhalation of a rapid onset Viagra-like molecule. Even then it was "is that a spacer in your pocket, or are you just pleased to see me?"0
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RichN95 wrote:There was just a phone in on Radio 5 about asthma and a lot of people were emphasising the necessary use of a 'spacer' so that the full proper dose is administered. I wonder if this has been considered with regard to WADA's calculation and whether Froome used one (it's not really suitable for use while riding, but after a race fine.
Kind of what I was thinking here http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtop ... p=20275957
If you can only take a certain number of puffs then make them count!My bikes
MTB - 1997 Kona Kula
Hybrid - Kona Dew Deluxe
Road - 2011 Ribble Gran Fondo, Omega Matrix Ultegra0 -
"Did I fire six puffs or only five?" Well to tell you the truth in all this excitement I kinda lost track myself. But being this is a ventolin inhalor, the most powerful performance enhancer in the world and would blow your career, you've gotta ask yourself one question: "Do I feel lucky?" Well, do ya, Chris?"“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0
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RichN95 wrote:There was just a phone in on Radio 5 about asthma and a lot of people were emphasising the necessary use of a 'spacer' so that the full proper dose is administered. I wonder if this has been considered with regard to WADA's calculation and whether Froome used one (it's not really suitable for use while riding, but after a race fine.
This is what it looks like
Not sure why this is relevant.
The 'allowance' is for a measured input in micrograms not in puffs.“New York has the haircuts, London has the trousers, but Belfast has the reason!0 -
TailWindHome wrote:RichN95 wrote:There was just a phone in on Radio 5 about asthma and a lot of people were emphasising the necessary use of a 'spacer' so that the full proper dose is administered. I wonder if this has been considered with regard to WADA's calculation and whether Froome used one (it's not really suitable for use while riding, but after a race fine.
This is what it looks like
Not sure why this is relevant.
The 'allowance' is for a measured input in micrograms not in puffs.
Why it's relevant is that if you puff the allowed amount - but don't inhale it all, then you're going to measure less - whereas if you do inhale it all and it enters your system - it's going to measure more....
Of course, the irrelevance is that CF probably didn't use one - and it doesn't sound like that's part of his defense.0
