First road bike - advice neded
Comments
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My point here is if the op goes out and buys the alu framed bike of their choice then the probability is that the will be perfectly happy with it. I don't think it's particularly helpful to tell them to spend more money on a fancy frame material bike for no good reason.0
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My point is that we are all entitled to opinions. You are certain that your post-purchase rationalization is correct because of whatever confirmation biases you found on the internet that back-up your opinion. Therefore you see my opinion as 'wrong'.Bungle73 wrote:My point here is if the op goes out and buys the alu framed bike of their choice then the probability is that the will be perfectly happy with it. I don't think it's particularly helpful to tell them to spend more money on a fancy frame material bike for no good reason.
There's no need to go in with daggers drawn and leap to the defence of your purchase and go quoting other people or trying to teach people something that have vastly more experience than you, simply offer the OP your experience and your version of the 'facts'. They can then make their own opinion about who's right or wrong. Or they can simply drill down to the 'agreed' facts ie where we all agree:
-Make sure the OP gets at least a Sora or Taigra groupset.
-Make sure the OP gets tire clearance for at least 28mm tires and be careful with tire pressures.
-Think about maybe getting a CX bike.
-Think about getting a carbon fibre seat post.
In my experience if you get an aluminium frame bike as a first bike you'll probably regret it long term other than the low cost and easy availability. Road aluminium bikes are great for crit racing on race tracks and smooth urban areas. In fact an alu bike wouldn't be too bad for some local city rides where I live, but in the UK....just no. The reason is the moment you get another bike CF probably, you won't want to ride it much and it will sit gathering dust or be sold at a loss. The rougher your local roads the less you'll want to ride it, and British roads are rough. They're surfaced dressed for a long cheap maintenance schedule, and if done well a car driver might not notice much with their four soft tyres. It's just that even well dressed roads, and many are are horrible on an alu alloy bicycle, and downright dangerous if the roads have been dressed poorly or in a poor state of repair. However a steel frame bike is a bike you can fall in love with and ride for years, and just use for so many other things from cycle touring, commuting or even CX. It will simply handle the rough roads much better. Simply a much better investment long term.0 -
ZMC888 wrote:Frank Wilson wrote:Think some people are maybe over thinking this bike riding game.
1. Buy a bike
2. Ride it
3. Buy a better bike if required
4. Ride better bike
5. Don't become a "cake stop" / "internet expert"
6. Don't sit on the same table at the cake stop as an "expert"
7. Ride solo then you don't have to listen to b-llshit from cycling "experts"
8. Clothes are clothes.
Don't get hung up, just enjoy the ride.
There's nothing wrong with giving an opinion to someone asking for it especially if you have direct experience about the subject. Others can give their own opinions and if they differ, that's fine, and address those to the OP.
Problems arise when other 'experts' see alternative opinions as a personal attack or 'wrong' as it contravenes their choice supportive bias https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Choice-supportive_bias. Then cherry-picked internet facts are used as ammunition in a pathetic flame attack.
I haven't used any "cherry picked internet facts", I wrote the eight lines above all by myself.0 -
ZMC888 wrote:
My point is that we are all entitled to opinions. You are certain that your post-purchase rationalization is correct because of whatever confirmation biases you found on the internet that back-up your opinion. Therefore you see my opinion as 'wrong'.Bungle73 wrote:My point here is if the op goes out and buys the alu framed bike of their choice then the probability is that the will be perfectly happy with it. I don't think it's particularly helpful to tell them to spend more money on a fancy frame material bike for no good reason.
There's no need to go in with daggers drawn and leap to the defence of your purchase and go quoting other people or trying to teach people something that have vastly more experience than you, simply offer the OP your experience and your version of the 'facts'. They can then make their own opinion about who's right or wrong. Or they can simply drill down to the 'agreed' facts ie where we all agree:
-Make sure the OP gets at least a Sora or Taigra groupset.
-Make sure the OP gets tire clearance for at least 28mm tires and be careful with tire pressures.
-Think about maybe getting a CX bike.
-Think about getting a carbon fibre seat post.
In my experience if you get an aluminium frame bike as a first bike you'll probably regret it long term other than the low cost and easy availability. Road aluminium bikes are great for crit racing on race tracks and smooth urban areas. In fact an alu bike wouldn't be too bad for some local city rides where I live, but in the UK....just no. The reason is the moment you get another bike CF probably, you won't want to ride it much and it will sit gathering dust or be sold at a loss. The rougher your local roads the less you'll want to ride it, and British roads are rough. They're surfaced dressed for a long cheap maintenance schedule, and if done well a car driver might not notice much with their four soft tyres. It's just that even well dressed roads, and many are are horrible on an alu alloy bicycle, and downright dangerous if the roads have been dressed poorly or in a poor state of repair. However a steel frame bike is a bike you can fall in love with and ride for years, and just use for so many other things from cycle touring, commuting or even CX. It will simply handle the rough roads much better. Simply a much better investment long term.
Daggers drawn? Now you're just being silly. You also being silly by trying to suggest that the only reason that I'm defending alu frames is because I own one.
The other point you seem to be missing is that one alu frame is not the same as any another alu frame, so unless you have personally ridden every kind of frame on the market I'm sure how your opinion on this is any better than mine? I'd rather go with the opinion of people who really do have the credentials to make authoritative statements on this, the likes of Sheldon Brown. Do you even know who he was?
And now you're trying to make out that alu frames are "dangerous"........... :roll:0 -
You've clearly never ridden a carbon fibre frame bike, a titanium frame bike or a steel frame bike. You have next to no experience of bikes, roads, places or frame materials.Bungle73 wrote:ZMC888 wrote:
My point is that we are all entitled to opinions. You are certain that your post-purchase rationalization is correct because of whatever confirmation biases you found on the internet that back-up your opinion. Therefore you see my opinion as 'wrong'.Bungle73 wrote:My point here is if the op goes out and buys the alu framed bike of their choice then the probability is that the will be perfectly happy with it. I don't think it's particularly helpful to tell them to spend more money on a fancy frame material bike for no good reason.
There's no need to go in with daggers drawn and leap to the defence of your purchase and go quoting other people or trying to teach people something that have vastly more experience than you, simply offer the OP your experience and your version of the 'facts'. They can then make their own opinion about who's right or wrong. Or they can simply drill down to the 'agreed' facts ie where we all agree:
-Make sure the OP gets at least a Sora or Taigra groupset.
-Make sure the OP gets tire clearance for at least 28mm tires and be careful with tire pressures.
-Think about maybe getting a CX bike.
-Think about getting a carbon fibre seat post.
In my experience if you get an aluminium frame bike as a first bike you'll probably regret it long term other than the low cost and easy availability. Road aluminium bikes are great for crit racing on race tracks and smooth urban areas. In fact an alu bike wouldn't be too bad for some local city rides where I live, but in the UK....just no. The reason is the moment you get another bike CF probably, you won't want to ride it much and it will sit gathering dust or be sold at a loss. The rougher your local roads the less you'll want to ride it, and British roads are rough. They're surfaced dressed for a long cheap maintenance schedule, and if done well a car driver might not notice much with their four soft tyres. It's just that even well dressed roads, and many are are horrible on an alu alloy bicycle, and downright dangerous if the roads have been dressed poorly or in a poor state of repair. However a steel frame bike is a bike you can fall in love with and ride for years, and just use for so many other things from cycle touring, commuting or even CX. It will simply handle the rough roads much better. Simply a much better investment long term.
Daggers drawn? Now you're just being silly. You also being silly by trying to suggest that the only reason that I'm defending alu frames is because I own one.
The other point you seem to be missing is that one alu frame is not the same as any another alu frame, so unless you have personally ridden every kind of frame on the market I'm sure how your opinion on this is any better than mine? I'd rather go with the opinion of people who really do have the credentials to make authoritative statements on this, the likes of Sheldon Brown. Do you even know who he was?
And now you're trying to make out that alu frames are "dangerous"........... :roll:
Basically you're a completely arrogant absolute total noob with a very mediocre aluminium alloy bike, which is extremely similar to a bike I own in the UK. You desperately want it to be good so badly that you're willing to attack other people. The hard truth it isn't that good. Sorry. Try to hide behind any internet search you like, but nothing replaces years of first hand experience.0 -
I have an Alu trek domane, its comfortable, versatile, takes wide tyres and disc brakes. Used in bad weather, commuting and when the good bike is in the shop. In my opinion not a harsh ride but road buzz is definitely noticeable.
I also have a new carbon Domane, yep its excellent, little road buzz, very comfortable. But a lot more expensive than the alu bike.
Older alu frames were harsh. I used to race on an old CAAD 8, 23c tyres, alu bars, alu seat post etc, as much as i loved that bike it was very harsh on rough roads. Id feel pretty beat up after a training ride.
Not sure if improvements to frame design have helped or whether it's just wider tyres, but there's a huge difference between my CAAD than my alu trek.0 -
I used to ride Orbea Avant H30 with Alu frame 105 gears and a carbon sitpost. . Now i own the Bianchi Infinito CV. On my 1st ride on the Bianchi on a ride of 120km i had 27 personal records, even if that the geometry is different. There is no contest between alu and carbon. They are out there some great alu frames like Cannondale CAAD 12, but there is a good reason why carbon bikes are so much more expensive than the alu.
For a starter is not bad, but if you get deep in to the sport CF is one way for me.
Keep in mind that from carbon to carbon can be a huge deference.0 -
You're quite right, alu isn't just alu and carbon isn't just carbon. It certainly depends who makes it.YiannisM wrote:I used to ride Orbea Avant H30 with Alu frame 105 gears and a carbon sitpost. . Now i own the Bianchi Infinito CV. On my 1st ride on the Bianchi on a ride of 120km i had 27 personal records, even if that the geometry is different. There is no contest between alu and carbon. They are out there some great alu frames like Cannondale CAAD 12, but there is a good reason why carbon bikes are so much more expensive than the alu.
For a starter is not bad, but if you get deep in to the sport CF is one way for me.
Keep in mind that from carbon to carbon can be a huge deference.
If you live in an area with smooth roads a Specialized Allez or a Trek Emonda ALR could be a great option if on a budget. However in my view if you upgrade from alu to carbon in an area with rough roads riding the alu bike simply won't be an inviting prospect and will become redundant or need to be sold. Having steel or titanium framed bikes instead would complement the ownership of a carbon frame bike.0 -
ZMC888 wrote:
You've clearly never ridden a carbon fibre frame bike, a titanium frame bike or a steel frame bike. You have next to no experience of bikes, roads, places or frame materials.Bungle73 wrote:ZMC888 wrote:
My point is that we are all entitled to opinions. You are certain that your post-purchase rationalization is correct because of whatever confirmation biases you found on the internet that back-up your opinion. Therefore you see my opinion as 'wrong'.Bungle73 wrote:My point here is if the op goes out and buys the alu framed bike of their choice then the probability is that the will be perfectly happy with it. I don't think it's particularly helpful to tell them to spend more money on a fancy frame material bike for no good reason.
There's no need to go in with daggers drawn and leap to the defence of your purchase and go quoting other people or trying to teach people something that have vastly more experience than you, simply offer the OP your experience and your version of the 'facts'. They can then make their own opinion about who's right or wrong. Or they can simply drill down to the 'agreed' facts ie where we all agree:
-Make sure the OP gets at least a Sora or Taigra groupset.
-Make sure the OP gets tire clearance for at least 28mm tires and be careful with tire pressures.
-Think about maybe getting a CX bike.
-Think about getting a carbon fibre seat post.
In my experience if you get an aluminium frame bike as a first bike you'll probably regret it long term other than the low cost and easy availability. Road aluminium bikes are great for crit racing on race tracks and smooth urban areas. In fact an alu bike wouldn't be too bad for some local city rides where I live, but in the UK....just no. The reason is the moment you get another bike CF probably, you won't want to ride it much and it will sit gathering dust or be sold at a loss. The rougher your local roads the less you'll want to ride it, and British roads are rough. They're surfaced dressed for a long cheap maintenance schedule, and if done well a car driver might not notice much with their four soft tyres. It's just that even well dressed roads, and many are are horrible on an alu alloy bicycle, and downright dangerous if the roads have been dressed poorly or in a poor state of repair. However a steel frame bike is a bike you can fall in love with and ride for years, and just use for so many other things from cycle touring, commuting or even CX. It will simply handle the rough roads much better. Simply a much better investment long term.
Daggers drawn? Now you're just being silly. You also being silly by trying to suggest that the only reason that I'm defending alu frames is because I own one.
The other point you seem to be missing is that one alu frame is not the same as any another alu frame, so unless you have personally ridden every kind of frame on the market I'm sure how your opinion on this is any better than mine? I'd rather go with the opinion of people who really do have the credentials to make authoritative statements on this, the likes of Sheldon Brown. Do you even know who he was?
And now you're trying to make out that alu frames are "dangerous"........... :roll:
Basically you're a completely arrogant absolute total noob with a very mediocre aluminium alloy bike, which is extremely similar to a bike I own in the UK. You desperately want it to be good so badly that you're willing to attack other people. The hard truth it isn't that good. Sorry. Try to hide behind any internet search you like, but nothing replaces years of first hand experience.
Did it take you "years of experience" to become a total knob? Because that is what you are. The person being arrogant here is YOU. It is also YOU who is launching unwarranted, and unprovoked, attacks on people...on me.
You have naff all idea of what I have experience of. And you obviously have naff all idea of exactly who Sheldon Brown was and his credentials, otherwise you wouldn't be coming out with such asnine statements.
And now you've decided to launch another childish attack on the bike I own, which is yet another thing that you know sod all about.
You seem to think that because you owned a couple of different bikes that mikes you the world's best expert on bike frame materials. It doesn't make you anything of the sort.
You're obviously an "everyone else is wrong (no matter who they are) and I'm always right" type of person. I don't know why I bothered wasting my time with you. I should have guessed that from the the utterly asinine and ridiculous "advice" you were giving out that started all this. Don't reply to me again.0 -
Replying to no one in particular - In the old days alu frames did give a harsh ride (which is where this comes from), but frame design has moved on a lot since then, which is the point I was trying to get across to our friend here. Also, what has to be considered is that you will get a lot more for your money choosing an alu frame over a similarly priced carbon frame.0
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Bungle, I don't know what you wrote. As you are on my ignore list. I tire of people like you. Experience can only be gained in time, no amount of wishing, imagination, googling or put downs ever really wins in the end.
I hope you get out and ride, the sooner the better clearly. It's been a shit argument and totally pointless. Just learn to adapt to life, and that people will have differing opinions that won't always agree with you at all times. For example my best mate likes Iron Maiden but I hate them, and my Brother in Law loves Spurs yet I fucking detest football. Roll with the punches bro.
I'd pull you out of a ditch and call the ambulance, or even buy you a coffee in the morning or a beer in the evening. Rubber side down, and stay safe.
Best regards ZMC0 -
For less than £500 the OP will not get a decent carbon bike. Alu will be fine.
Whilst my preference is for steel, I have also happily ridden a 14y/o alu bike for years with 20c tyres at max pressure on the UK country roads doing 100 miles and not come back battered and bruised.
Whatever you get you will get used to it, and whatever you get there is always something better.
You have to start somewhere, and also draw the line somewhere.
Id get something you like the look of and if you want to upgrade further down the line, sell the first bike or relegate to winter/turbo duties.0 -
What a horrible thread.ZMC888 wrote:You've clearly never ridden a carbon fibre frame bike, a titanium frame bike or a steel frame bike. You have next to no experience of bikes, roads, places or frame materials.
Basically you're a completely arrogant absolute total noob with a very mediocre aluminium alloy bike, which is extremely similar to a bike I own in the UK. You desperately want it to be good so badly that you're willing to attack other people. The hard truth it isn't that good. Sorry. Try to hide behind any internet search you like, but nothing replaces years of first hand experience.
I don't really care who started it but stop being so childish. It's embarrassing for everyone who has to read it.
Having ridden and owned alu, carbon, steel, disc or non-disc bikes in various countries I would say buy the bike that fits best within your price range. There is literally no point in suggesting he buys a bike for double his budget if he can't afford it.
Great advice on getting a steel equilibrium as a first bike then getting a 'summer' bike in the long run though, I did the same and love it. Not hugely useful if he can't afford it though
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Alu material is fine don't listen to the bad advice about it.0
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How tall are you?
https://www.merlincycles.com/eddy-merck ... 01787.html
Says for "ladies" but who cares?
55cm top tube.
Would fit me.
Really tempted to buy it myself :roll: I alreadly have a "lady" mtb bike.
Alot nicer/higher spec bike that any of the others.0 -
Sorry Dad.HaydenM wrote:I don't really care who started it but stop being so childish. It's embarrassing for everyone who has to read it.
HaydenM wrote:Great advice on getting a steel equilibrium as a first bike then getting a 'summer' bike in the long run though, I did the same and love it. Not hugely useful if he can't afford it though
It's just like telling someone to spend extra to buy a rear wheel drive car instead of FWD or buy a multiple cylinder engine motorcycle instead of a single. You know they're more rewarding and a bit more fun, but convincing someone on a limited budget they'd get so much more out of it if they spent extra and saved up longer is a tough ask, but worth a mention.0 -
ZMC888 wrote:
Sorry Dad.HaydenM wrote:I don't really care who started it but stop being so childish. It's embarrassing for everyone who has to read it.
Don't make me come back there!ZMC888 wrote:HaydenM wrote:Great advice on getting a steel equilibrium as a first bike then getting a 'summer' bike in the long run though, I did the same and love it. Not hugely useful if he can't afford it though
It's just like telling someone to spend extra to buy a rear wheel drive car instead of FWD or buy a multiple cylinder engine motorcycle instead of a single. You know they're more rewarding and a bit more fun, but convincing someone on a limited budget they'd get so much more out of it if they spent extra and saved up longer is a tough ask, but worth a mention.
Can't disagree with that0 -
Adding my two-penny's worth:
I also recently got into cycling over the Summer and bought myself my first road bike in May. I went for a Giant Defy 1 - aluminium frame, carbon fork and 75% Shimano 105 groupset (everything but the brakes). It's an excellent first bike IMO and set me back £530 as it was last years model.
I didn't want to spend upwards of £1k on a carbon bike as I wasn't sure cycling was going to be for me. Now though, I've done over 1000km on it and i'm in the market for a full carbon bike for next summer - I'll probably go for either a Canyon Endurace or a Pinarello Gan K disc. The Defy will be relegated to the turbo trainer and/or a winter bike.
Everyone needs to start somewhere.0
