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Starting again

ExCyclistExCyclist Posts: 336
edited August 2017 in Training, fitness and health
Ok I'm overhauling my riding. By this I mean I haven't seen any major improvements or weight loss in ages now - partly to do with working long hours and then doing the family thing and then cycling falls by way side....yadda yadda.......

So I'm looking for advice and help. Basically going to look to go back to shorter, punchy, fasted rides twice per week for the weight loss thing whilst monitoring properly what I eat and drink (goodbye ale - it's been fun), and do a few longer rides when time permits.

Along with this I have access to the GCN classes for the bikes at the gym - intersperse theses on poor weather days?

Like I say - help/advice welcome. Thanks.

Posts

  • zefszefs Posts: 484
    This training plan might be helpful: http://road.cc/content/feature/217209-six-weeks-fitness
  • sloppyschleckondssloppyschleckonds Posts: 8,019
    ExCyclist wrote:
    fasted rides twice per week for the weight loss thing

    I wouldn't do this
    I'm sorry you don't believe in miracles
  • ExCyclistExCyclist Posts: 336
    SloppySchleckonds wrote:
    ExCyclist wrote:
    fasted rides twice per week for the weight loss thing

    I wouldn't do this

    Come on fella - you've been on this board years so you can't say that and not give an explanation :D
  • wongataawongataa Posts: 1,001
    Weight loss is always best achieved by modifying what you eat & drink. It is very hard to burn enough energy during exercise to get that calorie deficit required for weight loss. Exercise can help a bit for weigh loss but it is primarily about getting/keeping fit.

    To lose weight you have to consume less calories.
  • ExCyclistExCyclist Posts: 336
    wongataa wrote:
    To lose weight you have to consume less calories.

    Of which I will be doing. TBH my diet ain't too bad for someone that works odd shift patterns of days and nights. It's the booze side I need to cut out. Ok maybe I also need to cut out the biscuits :D
  • ExCyclistExCyclist Posts: 336
    zefs wrote:
    This training plan might be helpful: http://road.cc/content/feature/217209-six-weeks-fitness

    Looks a good plan however the shifts I work then family life make it almost impossible to follow a structured training plan like that.
  • kajjalkajjal Posts: 3,380
    If you can aim for three rides a week of about an hour that would work well. The change in diet will be the biggest factor in losing weight initially but the exercise helps. You need to properly fuel your body to ride well and get the most out of it so try not to go out when hungry if you can.

    Just go out and enjoy it and try to make sure you are on the bike regularly. If you are prepared to go out in light rain / showers there are few days a year even in the UK you cannot get out on the bike. Only freezing temperatures or high winds stop me as it becomes dangerous then.

    Good Luck :)
  • marykamaryka Posts: 748
    If shift work makes it hard to get out regularly, try Zwift indoors on the turbo. There are so many people on it, so many group rides, around the world, so no matter the hour you can probably find people to ride with. I have been pleasantly surprised at how good Zwift is compared to "normal" turbo training, the mental distraction of other people and the course itself means a decent hour's workout flies by. Worth a go.
    http://www.twitter.com/smaryka
  • poynedexterpoynedexter Posts: 283
    ExCyclist wrote:
    Ok I'm overhauling my riding. By this I mean I haven't seen any major improvements or weight loss in ages now - partly to do with working long hours and then doing the family thing and then cycling falls by way side....yadda yadda.......

    So I'm looking for advice and help. Basically going to look to go back to shorter, punchy, fasted rides twice per week for the weight loss thing whilst monitoring properly what I eat and drink (goodbye ale - it's been fun), and do a few longer rides when time permits.

    Along with this I have access to the GCN classes for the bikes at the gym - intersperse theses on poor weather days?

    Like I say - help/advice welcome. Thanks.

    what exactly do you need advice on?
  • neebneeb Posts: 4,467
    wongataa wrote:
    Weight loss is always best achieved by modifying what you eat & drink. It is very hard to burn enough energy during exercise to get that calorie deficit required for weight loss. Exercise can help a bit for weigh loss but it is primarily about getting/keeping fit.

    To lose weight you have to consume less calories.
    This seems to be accepted wisdom these days amongst nutritionists - I heard a doctor on Radio 4 a few months ago say something similar, i.e. that exercise doesn't really burn enough calories to make much of a difference compared with diet modifications. However, I think this advice must be aimed at really sedentary people for whom exercise is a brisk walk to the shops or a gentle aerobics class.. If I go for a fast 40 mile ride I'll burn well over 1500 kCal (I have a power meter so the only uncertainty in conversion of joules => calories is metabolic efficiency and although you can't know that exactly it's unlikely to vary by more than 10%). That's about 75% of a normalish daily recommended calorie intake, so if I'm doing that 4 times a week I can't see how it can't have a significant impact on body weight, and indeed to the extent my weight varies it pretty much corresponds with how much riding I'm doing. The problem these days is that most people don't know what proper exercise means.. :wink: :twisted:
  • stevie63stevie63 Posts: 481
    neeb wrote:
    wongataa wrote:
    Weight loss is always best achieved by modifying what you eat & drink. It is very hard to burn enough energy during exercise to get that calorie deficit required for weight loss. Exercise can help a bit for weigh loss but it is primarily about getting/keeping fit.

    To lose weight you have to consume less calories.
    This seems to be accepted wisdom these days amongst nutritionists - I heard a doctor on Radio 4 a few months ago say something similar, i.e. that exercise doesn't really burn enough calories to make much of a difference compared with diet modifications. However, I think this advice must be aimed at really sedentary people for whom exercise is a brisk walk to the shops or a gentle aerobics class.. If I go for a fast 40 mile ride I'll burn well over 1500 kCal (I have a power meter so the only uncertainty in conversion of joules => calories is metabolic efficiency and although you can't know that exactly it's unlikely to vary by more than 10%). That's about 75% of a normalish daily recommended calorie intake, so if I'm doing that 4 times a week I can't see how it can't have a significant impact on body weight, and indeed to the extent my weight varies it pretty much corresponds with how much riding I'm doing. The problem these days is that most people don't know what proper exercise means.. :wink: :twisted:
    I think the other problem that most have is that they would view a 40 mile ride as a reason to refuel which then isn't going to lead to weight loss. However both you and me realise that a 40 mile ride can be done with just a water bottle. However the web will have some believe that they need a Carb drink and a couple of energy gels per hour to do this.
  • poynedexterpoynedexter Posts: 283
    also, people do tend to underestimate how many calories they consume. if you accept the published numbers for calories and food, even a typical slice of toast with butter and jam ( made and weighed by me), has 270 cals or 330 if having peanut butter instead of jam. i'll typically eat 4 of these. my portion size of porridge made with semi skimmed milk and added fruit is touching on 600 cals (150 grams of oats!).

    i've dabbled with low carb eating etc but i'm finding that being mindful of calories, is the best way for me to control my weight in the medium to long term.
  • ExCyclistExCyclist Posts: 336
    stevie63 wrote:
    neeb wrote:
    wongataa wrote:
    Weight loss is always best achieved by modifying what you eat & drink. It is very hard to burn enough energy during exercise to get that calorie deficit required for weight loss. Exercise can help a bit for weigh loss but it is primarily about getting/keeping fit.

    To lose weight you have to consume less calories.
    This seems to be accepted wisdom these days amongst nutritionists - I heard a doctor on Radio 4 a few months ago say something similar, i.e. that exercise doesn't really burn enough calories to make much of a difference compared with diet modifications. However, I think this advice must be aimed at really sedentary people for whom exercise is a brisk walk to the shops or a gentle aerobics class.. If I go for a fast 40 mile ride I'll burn well over 1500 kCal (I have a power meter so the only uncertainty in conversion of joules => calories is metabolic efficiency and although you can't know that exactly it's unlikely to vary by more than 10%). That's about 75% of a normalish daily recommended calorie intake, so if I'm doing that 4 times a week I can't see how it can't have a significant impact on body weight, and indeed to the extent my weight varies it pretty much corresponds with how much riding I'm doing. The problem these days is that most people don't know what proper exercise means.. :wink: :twisted:
    I think the other problem that most have is that they would view a 40 mile ride as a reason to refuel which then isn't going to lead to weight loss. However both you and me realise that a 40 mile ride can be done with just a water bottle. However the web will have some believe that they need a Carb drink and a couple of energy gels per hour to do this.

    Trust me - I do. But I know where you're coming from.

    As for riding 40 miles - yeah that's not a problem for me at all and the people I do it with enjoy a cafe stop on the way (don't we all?). I do tend to have a light snack at the cafe with a coffee but I've seen people wolf away full english or a stack of pancakes, etc. Not for me that. Give me a cuppa and a bit cake to work off on way home. Not now though. As for energy gels - no thanks and I take two bottles with me - one of water and the other a energy drink just in case.
  • kevin_stephenskevin_stephens Posts: 184
    In my experience your plan of short intense rides is a good one. I can't lose weight by dieting alone but come the spring a couple of intense evening rides a week and the weight falls of, this is particularly useful if you are time limited.
    It's not just about comparing calories saved by dieting vs exercising. The key is INTENSE. The 2 hours should be at full pelt, at a rate you would find hard to hold a conversation, whether this is 20 miles or 40 miles is less relevant, the fitter you get the more calories you will burn. For me this is approx 500 calories per hour; 6 hours = 1 lb fat according to experts (I think it may be more). Use a Garmin or similar to track your heart rate calories burnt and speed etc. Goals in avg speed or time on hills (free Strava) are addictive; finding how much effort it takes to burn off a Mars bar is really good for diet discipline. The main point is the fitter you get the more calories you can burn per hour, the when you get to do longer rides they are much more effective as well as more fun. Racing Weight by Matt Fitzgerald is a useful read. Good luck and enjoy!
    I want to climb hills so badly;
    and I climb hills so badly
  • poynedexterpoynedexter Posts: 283
    1 lb of fat represents 3600kcal of energy. but using up 3600kcals of energy on the bike doesn't mean that it will come from your fat store. blood, muscle, liver glycogen are all used as is fat, in different rates depending on your make up, fitness and diet. weight is also not to be confused with fat mass. weight is made up of lots of things, including fat. hard intervals or racing can use up lots of stored glycogen and thus water, which can show on the scales as weight loss. its never simple,
  • neebneeb Posts: 4,467
    poynedexter wrote:
    1 lb of fat represents 3600kcal of energy. but using up 3600kcals of energy on the bike doesn't mean that it will come from your fat store. blood, muscle, liver glycogen are all used as is fat, in different rates depending on your make up, fitness and diet. weight is also not to be confused with fat mass. weight is made up of lots of things, including fat. hard intervals or racing can use up lots of stored glycogen and thus water, which can show on the scales as weight loss. its never simple,
    True, but if you are burning lots of calories regularly (more than you are replacing by eating extra) you will tend to lose fat (if you have fat). If you burn primarily glycogen during intense exercise your body will metabolise fat for energy later on and/or any carbs you eat will be used to replace the glycogen instead of being stored as fat. Basically, if you are regularly expending more energy than you are consuming you will tend to use up fat stores - that's what they are for.
  • kingrollokingrollo Posts: 3,197
    I nearly always ride fasted on shorter rides (under 2 hours) - I take a banana and hard boiled eggs on longer rides - it seems to work ok for me.
    In fact if anything I feel better with no breakfast - that if I down a bowl of cereal. Like a lot of things with cycling/diet its what works for you.
    I like the 5-2 diet.
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