Multi purpose bike for short commutes\towing child to school and weekend family rides

daniel_b

Afternoon all,

looking for some opinions on if the bike I am after is out there, or if i have it already.........

At present, and for the next few years, we have a Followmetandem attachment:


On my gf's reasonably ropey 2005 Specialized Hardrock Rim (Not very well) braked front suspension mountain bike.
It's a little small for me, if we are being honest, and does feel a tad twitchy with the current 14" wheeled Isla bike hooked up on the back.
At christmas, I think we will have to be going for a 20" Frog\Islabike or similar, so not sure if that will mean it is more or less twitchy, but anyway, not massively happy with it perse.
It's running original fattish mtb tyres, but I do have some smooth 26" tyres I can put on, but it's only a mile or so to school, and the same to work, so no big deal.

The new route will begin in September, as she will be 4 years old, and although I will make it through this year, I am thinking ahead to next year, when in May I can take up an option on the cycle to work scheme (An actual post where someone using it might even be cycling to work on the bike in question!) to pick up something more suitable.
I'm in theory limited to Halfords, but I know I can use them at Tredz, which widens my options to some actually decent bikes.

I'll be looking to use it for school drop offs, and pick ups, and as I'll also on occasion be heading into work, the provision for full guards, and a rack for panniers would be helpful as well.
Additionally, as it will have the followmetandem thing attached, we will want to use it at weekend, to go for longer rides (I expect up to 35 miles eventually), so I can tow the littleun either when she is tired, or when the roads might be more denagerous, and then let her off the leash when she wants to stretch her legs - I would imagine with a 20" wheeled bike next spring, that in the summer will be when we really start to use it for longer rides.
In that respect, I reckon something like 28mm ish tyres (Probably durano plus) would fit the bill nicely.
Just pondering as to whether 35 miles on a flat bar bike will be ok, or a pain.

What I have not yet figured out, is whether I want to go drops or flat bars.
My head says flat bars, as to a degree I feel in traffic, you have more control, and generally the bars are wider and less twitchy then a drop bar bike - mine are all 40cm.
Not saying drop bars on a bike make it twitchy, just saying I think with a followmetandem on the back it will be - well at least it already is on the MTB, so assuming, perhaps incorrectly, that this would be magnified on a drop bar bike.
I would also want hydraulic brakes, and with the current cost of bikes, that then leans even more heavily towards flat bar bikes, as Hyd drop bar bikes for sub 1K are rare.
Never ridden hub gears, so not sure if that is something I should consider?
Low maintenance but heavier?

Anyone have opinions on a model of bike I could be thinking of come next spring, and or on the drops\flat option?

fat daddy

I find flat bars far more stable than drops when towing the forever moving kiddie ! .. and of course the advantage of hydro brakes that are way cheaper and have better feel than the drop bar variants.

BUT ..... and I only realised this the other day

After about an hour of riding when towing on a flat bar bike I get numb/pins and needles in my hands .... but only if I am towing, when I ride on my own this never happens ? ....... I can only assume I spend a lot more time gripping the bars hard when towing OR have a different riding position

daniel_b

fat daddy wrote:

I find flat bars far more stable than drops when towing the forever moving kiddie ! .. and of course the advantage of hydro brakes that are way cheaper and have better feel than the drop bar variants.

BUT ..... and I only realised this the other day

After about an hour of riding when towing on a flat bar bike I get numb/pins and needles in my hands .... but only if I am towing, when I ride on my own this never happens ? ....... I can only assume I spend a lot more time gripping the bars hard when towing OR have a different riding position

Thanks FD - I just now, before seeing your reply, editited my reply to ask whether riding 35 miles on flats would be troublesome.
Interesting point you make - what type of tow bike do you use - flat bar non suspension hybrid?

I imagine you are right, in that you are making tiny corrections subconciously to keep you both upright!

Another option has just occurred to me - flat bar bike, but replace with butterfly bars :!:
Never used them, but they seem to give additional reach options.


I could potentially set them up so the angle means that the further forward grips are closer to the ground, and more aero, to make a faux 'road bike in the drops' more aero position.

fat daddy

I normally swap towing duties between a Boardman team hybid and if I am planning a bit more off road stuff I'll haul her along on the 1997 Klien MTB

but I have also experimented with a full suss MTB and a CAAD10

daniel_b

Ok, so after having a good look at 'hybrids' it would seem that most of them are not 'sporty' perse, but these two caught my eye.

http://www.halfords.com/cycling/bikes/hybrid-bikes/boardman-hybrid-bike-pro


http://www.halfords.com/cycling/bikes/hybrid-bikes/boardman-hybrid-team-bike


Any comments on them?

Assuming you can fit mudguards and a rack, but can't quite tell.

The carbon fork appeals a lot, and I reckon the £700 one seems to be the better value out of the two, unless SRAM Rival is leagues ahead?

What about versus these two:

https://www.tredz.co.uk/.Cannondale-Quick-1-Disc-2017-Hybrid-Sports-Bike_96399.htm


https://www.tredz.co.uk/.Cannondale-Bad-Boy-3-2017-Hybrid-Sports-Bike_96359.htm


Appreciate the badboy is not as fast, but I've always hankered after one, and I love the oddity of the single legged fork.

Also, the size guides are likely to be useless for me, as I have a short torso\long leg setup, but in the world of roadbikes I have sussed out what works for me, which is generally a 545 theoretical top tube, with a 20mm set back seatpost, and a 90mm stem.
Anyone know how I can extrapolate that length of top tube across to a hybrid?

I'm assuming add something like 50-60mm onto that top tube length?

And if I do go for a butterfly bar (Flats end up being level with the headset) I would need to go for something like a 600-635 Top tube? I could perhaps even go with some TT bars clipped on :twisted:

Nellyspania

I've been using a Carrera Subway for this sort of thing for a few years.
Cheap as chips, tough as horse meat and surprisingly good off road too.

fat daddy

I have mudguards and a rack fitted to the team hybrid.

Mind you ... I have also ripped the 2x10 out and converted it to 1x10 .... if I was going to do it again, in hindsight I would have bought the Pro !

UndercoverElephant

I recommended a Whyte Cambridge to a guy at work recently, they are pretty nice. You know, for a hybrid, obviously.

https://www.whyte.bike/cambridge

N0bodyOfTheGoat

A few options to dimiss.;)

Build yourself a bike using http://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/ZX302FULLM ... ngs-bundle ?

https://www.evanscycles.com/pinnacle-ar ... e-EV275629 ?

http://www.halfords.com/cycling/bikes/h ... ybrid-bike ?

http://www.halfords.com/cycling/bikes/m ... o-fat-bike ?

luv2ride

NitrousOxide wrote:

A few options to dimiss.;)

Build yourself a bike using http://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/ZX302FULLM ... ngs-bundle ?

https://www.evanscycles.com/pinnacle-ar ... e-EV275629 ?

http://www.halfords.com/cycling/bikes/h ... ybrid-bike ?

http://www.halfords.com/cycling/bikes/m ... o-fat-bike ?

I'd go for the Pinnacle. I was actually going to recommend the single speed, but having rear gears is probably more useable I'm probably going to convert mine to 1 x 11 (have acquired all the bits) when I can be bothered. It's fast enough to be very enjoyable and having room for 45mm tubeless tyres mean bridleways and towpaths are a hoot....love mine. The bars are much wider than my normal road bars, with a very generous flare. Might be a good alternative to flat bars?

daniel_b

Thanks FD, hadn't noticed the pro was a single front chaingring versus the double of tuther one :oops:

Although it is pretty hilly around here, so depending on the cassette ratios, the double likely makes more sense, especially whilst towing 8kg of bike, plus X kg of offspring uphill!

@UE - The Whyte looks very nice, and I pretty much only hear good things about them, but sadly not available from Tredz :-(

Thanks for those links NO, but alas the same goes for the Pinnacle - Evans only, and I only have the option of 'Halfords cycle to work' vouchers - Tredz take them I think as they are now owned by them.

That Voodoo PHATbike looks like hard work!

andyh01

I'm in a similar position but my commute to work after dropping off the kids mile up the rd (eldest on own bike, youngest in bike trailer) is 5 miles. I currently use and will again look to replace with a drop bar. Once the youngest currently 3 is a bit older I'll reconnect the tailgator that clamps to seatpost and lifts the kids bike front wheel, opposed to connecting to the rear axle. Also looking for hydro disc and wide tyres gravel/adventure geometry lowest by/chainring

N0bodyOfTheGoat

At a glance, the Boardman Pro is ~1Kg lighter than the Team at ~9Kg, but two possible negatives are...
It's 1x11 (might be more challenging when climbing hill when tagalong attached)
Sram vs Shimano drivetrain (check replacement component prices, replacement cassette for CX Team is ~£80 versus ~£30 for 105)

fat daddy

NitrousOxide wrote:

It's 1x11 (might be more challenging when climbing hill when tagalong attached)

It works the other way .. but only just

the teams smallest gear is 34:32 so 1.06 ratio ... the Pro is 44:42 so 1.05 ratio ........ that equates to the Pro being easier to climb by a massive 0.1mph at 90rpm

the cassette cost though is a consideration

daniel_b

NitrousOxide wrote:

At a glance, the Boardman Pro is ~1Kg lighter than the Team at ~9Kg, but two possible negatives are...
It's 1x11 (might be more challenging when climbing hill when tagalong attached)
Sram vs Shimano drivetrain (check replacement component prices, replacement cassette for CX Team is ~£80 versus ~£30 for 105)

Ah good spot, hadn't spied the Specification tab!

1kg I can cope with, as I need to put a KG worth of guards and rack on I expect anyway.

I think around here, I am going to need the option of a wider range of gears, all be it not for the actual school run, but I would end up hating it, if it's gearing dictated where we could ride at the weekends.

Hadn't considered the cost of spares overly, but I dare say you are correct, a WIDE ratio SRAM cassette is currently more of a niche market, and therefore no variety of options, so a bit of a captive market - sure that will change in time though.

Plenty of food for thought.

Having said all that, the Pro has a nicer colour scheme :oops:

Re top tube lengths, anyone with drop bar bikes, who knows what those Top tube lengths, know what they went for in hybrid land?
As I said, my roadbike wants to be 545mm ideally, and looking at the Boardmans they come in at:
S - 565
M - 590
L - 615

daniel_b

Been mulling this some more - the Pro team has also come down to £800 at the mo, tempting, but will probably hold out until next year and cycletowork.

Question for you - my aversion to towing a child with drop bars 'may' be down to the width of the bars, reckon I could get around that, or mitigate it with some 46cm bars?
I usually ride 40's you see - or would that be weird and not really a solution?
Doesn't solve the issue of getting hydro brakes for under a grand though on a drop bar bike :?

And also, if I do end up going for a hybrid, could someone give me some input\experience on top tube length versus that for their roadbike?

I'm 5ft 10, but with a 34" inseam.

My roadbikes tend to be 54's, with a 545 top tube, and a 90mm stem.

So if I were to go for the Boardman, I think I would either need the Medium or the Large.
Gut says medium, but the fact the seattube is only 49cm concerns me a bit, as it may well end up that the seatpost is not long enough, and could mean a fairly big drop from saddle to bars - perhaps not that big a deal in itself.
In that instance, if I am too cramped, and or the drop is large, I can buy a longer stem, and or flip it.

Opinions welcome please!

Height (Inch)........Height (cm)........Size\Seat tube......Top Tube
5' 1" - 5' 6"...........155 - 168...........45cm.................565mm
5' 5" - 6'..............165 - 183...........49cm.................595mm
5' 10" - 6' 5"..........178 - 196...........54cm.................615mm

N0bodyOfTheGoat

My 18" Wazoo is 595mmtop tube and 457mm seat tube, I'm 5'10" with ~32.5" cycling inseam. Sadly the geometry specs don't list stack or reach.

Initially, I found the front end on the Wazoo a bit low in Feb 2016, more so on rides over 30mins where my weak lower back started to moan a little. I solved it for a while by fitting my 100mm 35 degree (?) On One stem, raising the flat bars ~5cm. But later in summer 2016, I fitted On One Knuckleball bars (with 25mm rise?) and a 35mm On One Corto stem and its been fine since... But I must stress my back has been a lot better this last ~12 months, plus I've lost ~16Kg to now be ~74Kg and my fitness has gone through the roof (probably the best it's been in over twenty years).
IIRC, my default 400mm seatpost is ~720mm from BB to saddle top, so ~223mm (if saddle is ~40mm deep) post is showing.

I think you could do either medium or large in a flat bar Boardman, I'd be inclined to say large unless you have a negative ape index.

Thinking outside the box, as I often do, how about some super wide gravel drop bars to swap out with default bars on a drop bar option such as http://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/HBNIRM3/ni ... -handlebar ?

UndercoverElephant

Curve-ball. I think Genesis bikes are available from Tredz...

http://www.genesisbikes.co.uk/bikes/adv ... d/vagabond

The Vagabond monster-cross. Got to be more fun than a hybrid, has the flared bars and slack angles for stability.

daniel_b

Afternoon all,

been perusing again, so I am more in the know of what to be looking at next year. Boardman is still almost certainly a favourite, but as I know I can also shop at Tredz, have been perusing their offerings, and some of these might even be reduced come next year.

Any opinions, and or observations on these badgers?

https://www.tredz.co.uk/.Marin-Fairfax-SC-4-Belt-2018-Hybrid-Sports-Bike_109974.htm
https://www.tredz.co.uk/.Kona-Dew-Deluxe-2018-Hybrid-Classic-Bike_111482.htm
https://www.tredz.co.uk/.Merida-Speeder-400-2018-Hybrid-Sports-Bike_110606.htm

These two are my faves, in reverse order though:
https://www.tredz.co.uk/.Kona-Dr-Dew-2018-Hybrid-Classic-Bike_111484.htm


https://www.tredz.co.uk/.Marin-Nicasio-RC-2018-Hybrid-Sports-Bike_109998.htm


Admittedly, I can see some downsides with both the immediate favourites.

They have 650c wheels - one is 8 speed hub, and one is 11 spd rear derailleur.
I could retro fit 700c wheels one would assume, may even have some I could use, but then left with a set of 650 whels that are almost certainly impossible to shift, or would it be an option if I sold them as brand new, took them off the bike immediately, and then stuck some 700c wheels on there, probably with Vittoria Voyager brown sidewall tyres on there.
How much of a pain would it be running 650b wheels - I'd need specific inner tubes only for this bike, and imagine tyre options are extremely limited?
Not sure if the hib gearing will cause any issues with affixing a followmetandem, but will have to find out.

I've always loved Marin bikes, and it's steel, and it looks bloody lovely imho.
Oh and they both have mudguards, which I will need fo sure - and will also need to fit a rack.

Not sure if they are too far out there really, and appreciate neither (But the Merida does I guess) fulfills the role of a fastish hybrid you could fit tri bars too - although Tri Bars on that Marin would be bl00dy funny non?

On the Genesis front - the Vagabond is notrh of 1K sadly, and also has mechanical discs.
I've only just got rid of them on the Kona Minute, and that has now made it the bike it was always meant to be - all for the princely sum of £40 too.
Was slightly taken by this one, but surprisingly also has mechanical discs:
https://www.tredz.co.uk/.Genesis-Brixton-2018-Hybrid-Sports-Bike_113905.htm

N0bodyOfTheGoat

Is the Cube Hyde Race any use, as an Alfine 29er?
https://www.tredz.co.uk/.Cube-Hyde-Race ... 113019.htm

daniel_b

NitrousOxide wrote:

Is the Cube Hyde Race any use, as an Alfine 29er?
https://www.tredz.co.uk/.Cube-Hyde-Race ... 113019.htm

Ummm, possibly Nitrous Oxide - do like the look of that, although struggling to find the Green that it claims it has on it - perhaps it is VERY dark. EDIT: Can now make out some green cabling, and stickers on the wheels.....
Super cool looking machine though.

Sorry for being dim, does the 29er reference simply equate to 700c tubes and tyres, and mean all of the usual stuff I know and love would be compatible.

Bit taken aback by the 11.9kg listed weight, but then suspect the Kona and Marin are even more :?

N0bodyOfTheGoat

Daniel B wrote:

NitrousOxide wrote:

Is the Cube Hyde Race any use, as an Alfine 29er?
https://www.tredz.co.uk/.Cube-Hyde-Race ... 113019.htm

Ummm, possibly Nitrous Oxide - do like the look of that, although struggling to find the Green that it claims it has on it - perhaps it is VERY dark. EDIT: Can now make out some green cabling, and stickers on the wheels.....
Super cool looking machine though.

Sorry for being dim, does the 29er reference simply equate to 700c tubes and tyres, and mean all of the usual stuff I know and love would be compatible.

Bit taken aback by the 11.9kg listed weight, but then suspect the Kona and Marin are even more :?

Yep, 29er and 700c are basically interchangeable.

~2Kg heavier than the blue Boardman hybrid, suspect a lot of that will be the Alfine setup.

It might also be a Gates belt drive.

To change rear tube or tyre, undo axle nuts, slide axle towards BB and then unhook chain/belt.

daniel_b

Cheers NO.

Surprisingly, the 1K Boardman is only 9kg, quite the lightweight - the allegedly fast looking Merida I posted above, is 10.2kg - looks can be deceiving I guess!

Didn't realise belt drive and hub gears could add so much weight :-(

Maybe that Kona makes the most sense, although it is still 650B wheels........
But then that would be an easier swap out to 700c wheels, not having a hub gear.......

Just worked out that 650b is effectivevly 27.5" - not much choice out there for tyres either, so IF I went that route would have to change the wheels I reckon - doesn's seem to make a lot of sense, especially as the Kona is already 1K.

Looking like back to the Boardman.

slowbike

yikes - they look hideous!

Little SB is "only" 15kg - and I take him around on the Specialized Tricross with drop bars on a seat - I'll carry on with this setup next year when I can start riding him to pre-school (he's 2 1/2) - it's only 2 miles and up a cycle path - I can then carry on to work - a few more miles up the road.
If I was going to get a new (replacement) bike to do this now then I'd definitely go for the hydro disk brakes - just because they are soooo much better than my (crap) rim brakes.
I know the drops are twitchy - but for me at least - it's a short time he's on the back compared to the ride to/from work - where I've tried flat bars and just no ... I don't see that being any different on a tag-along or followme tandem (which I love the look of).
I can put him on my 29er (with hydro disks) ...

my only other comment is mudguard length - the pictures above look like they have pretty useless rear mudguards - they need to be much longer to stop the crap kicking up into the face of the person behind ...

daniel_b

Slowbike wrote:

yikes - they look hideous!

Little SB is "only" 15kg - and I take him around on the Specialized Tricross with drop bars on a seat - I'll carry on with this setup next year when I can start riding him to pre-school (he's 2 1/2) - it's only 2 miles and up a cycle path - I can then carry on to work - a few more miles up the road.
If I was going to get a new (replacement) bike to do this now then I'd definitely go for the hydro disk brakes - just because they are soooo much better than my (crap) rim brakes.
I know the drops are twitchy - but for me at least - it's a short time he's on the back compared to the ride to/from work - where I've tried flat bars and just no ... I don't see that being any different on a tag-along or followme tandem (which I love the look of).
I can put him on my 29er (with hydro disks) ...

my only other comment is mudguard length - the pictures above look like they have pretty useless rear mudguards - they need to be much longer to stop the crap kicking up into the face of the person behind ...

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder

But I appreciate they are likely marmite bikes.

I don't have a long commute, so technically don't have a need for a 'fast' bike perse, but that aspect could be useful at weekends if we are to undertake longer rides next year and beyond - do like the old school-ish look of those two bikes though, just appeals for whatever reason, but the 27.5" wheel size does not!
Suspect if the prices were reversed, and the Hub gear Marin was 1K, and the Kona was £800, that would have left capacity for replacement 700c wheels, but this way around seems to make little sense.

Hydro discs rock, as I say, the £40 cost of fitting them to the Minute, was easily worth twice that, it's transformed the ride - along with the Vittoria Voyager tyres - £13 bargains from PX - and with reflective sidewalls and in a fetching brown colour

slowbike

Daniel B wrote:

Slowbike wrote:

yikes - they look hideous!

Beauty is in the eye of the beerholder

Daniel B wrote:

Hydro discs rock, as I say, the £40 cost of fitting them to the Minute, was easily worth twice that, it's transformed the ride - along with the Vittoria Voyager tyres - £13 bargains from PX - and with reflective sidewalls and in a fetching brown colour

you were doing so well with the Hydros .... until you mention Brown ... !!

I keep thinking perhaps I could change my tricross fork and fit a hydro disk brake - don't need it on the rear - it would be nice to be matching, but there's no mount point for it and it's probably not worth the expense.

daniel_b

lol, I really like the brown tyres on that style of utility bike - don't get me wrong, I love modern, and fast bikes, but I also think a nicely equipped retro, or town style bike has it's own unique charm, that I realise only some people will see!

Does sounds like changing your rear brake would be a nice to have rather than a requirement - I wanted complete hydros on the Kona, as it's for carrying the littleun, so wanted belt and braces - got lucky with the cable length, as it's a long wheelbase, and had read reviews that said standard cables were not long enough to make the journey, but this has room to spare.

At the moment, I think I am set on a Boardman hybrid pro for the full 1K, and I have a set of PDW guards, or fender as they like to call them, sat in the garage I could fit to it - pretty sure my Synapse Adventure bike with factory guards actually used PDW guards - profile appears identical.
I can then mess about with the stem lenth if need be, and either stick butterfly bars, or bar ends on for more hand positions, and even look at the TT bar setup should it take my fancy.

Anyone know when Boardman\Halfords change their ranges?
http://www.halfords.com/cycling/bikes/hybrid-bikes/boardman-hybrid-bike-pro-45-49-54cm-frames
That's the likely candidate, just wondering if it will still exit and or be in stock come May\June.

N0bodyOfTheGoat

No idea on the Pro, but the blue Hybrid Team was new this summer.

daniel_b

NitrousOxide wrote:

No idea on the Pro, but the blue Hybrid Team was new this summer.

Ta - have contacted their online chat peeps, who will speak to the Boardman peeps tomorrow, and get back to me.

I like this grey one with the green bits you see:

And then I can get some green pinstripe to go on the dark grey PDW guards
Saddle looks horrible, but I have ones I can use.

slowbike

like the boardman .... even with flat bars ... just make sure they put the forks on the right way round

daniel_b

Slowbike wrote:

like the boardman .... even with flat bars ... just make sure they put the forks on the right way round

I had that from Evans one - post alleged PDI............
WTF more like.

Slightly regrettably, the Boardman just seems to make too many positive arguments as to why it makes it the right, and most bike for the money, it's very difficult to see past it, despite my liking of something retro - although I could always get one the following year!

Incidentally, I did consider the CX version, but they seem to rock a fairly long headtube combined with a comparitively short (Compared to my CR1) headtube, so would likely be a BAD combination for me with a short torso and long legs\5ft 10.
My ideal in the road bike world is a 545 top tube (Usually on a 54cm frame) with a 90 or 100mm stem.

The CX in 50 has a 540 top tube, so probably about right, but that's some serious drop from saddle to bars, even if I flipped them, and this is meant to be something to tow the small one around on.
The 53 looks a bit better - but even on that the TT is 555 - 10mm longer than the ideal - so I am hoping the hybrid will work better with my dimensions, assuming a medium 49cm frame, with the effective TT of 590 - counteracted by the fact there are no hoods pushing me further forwards.
Alternatively the Small 45cm frame might work I guess - as it's more of an upright bike perse, this might cancel it out to some degree, and make it a bit more racey?
TT on it is 565