Bike Fit

Alex99

JoeNobody wrote:

Imposter wrote:

You can post-rationalise it however you like, but the net result is the same. Anyway, let's not get involved in semantics.

You didn't ask how much the fit cost, you asked how much he paid to have someone move his saddle and change his stem. That's not post-rationalisation, it's stating the facts.

I presume that it's not normal for those offering a fitting service to itemize the bill in such a way. e.g.

1) determining where to move the saddle to
2) determining which stem length
3) raise saddle and swap stem

We may never have an answer to the question unless we get the fitter to comment on his cost structure.

This is of course an irrelevant diversion.

I wonder if Imposter ever pays for a service that a person could undertake, but chooses not to?

imposter2.0

Alex99 wrote:

I presume that it's not normal for those offering a fitting service to itemize the bill in such a way. e.g.

1) determining where to move the saddle to
2) determining which stem length
3) raise saddle and swap stem

On the contrary. I would have thought getting a set of measurements/specs to take home would be an intrinsic part of the fitting fee.

Alex99 wrote:

I wonder if Imposter ever pays for a service that a person could undertake, but chooses not to?

Slightly tortured logic in that sentence, but I've never had a bike fit, if that's what you mean.

spam02

I was always told to make small changes when adjusting things like saddle height, stem/bars height etc. No more than 10mm increments at a time and allow the body to get used to the change for a week or two before making the next change, in order to avoid injury.
It's quite possibly old-school B.S but it kind of makes sense. A 35mm increase in saddle height in one go seems quite extreme.

Alex99

Imposter wrote:

Alex99 wrote:

I presume that it's not normal for those offering a fitting service to itemize the bill in such a way. e.g.

1) determining where to move the saddle to
2) determining which stem length
3) raise saddle and swap stem

On the contrary. I would have thought getting a set of measurements/specs to take home would be an intrinsic part of the fitting fee.

Alex99 wrote:

I wonder if Imposter ever pays for a service that a person could undertake, but chooses not to?

Slightly tortured logic in that sentence, but I've never had a bike fit, if that's what you mean.

Wasn't thinking of a bike fit exactly. Perhaps some other task which you could undertake yourself, but choose to pay someone to do it. e.g. servicing your car.

dstev55

I can see that Imposter is one of these characters that nobody listens to in real life so tries to make up for it on Internet forums.

How about you just say "I'm happy you feel great on the bike though it's not something I'd pay for myself" instead of trying all of these smart arse comments.

Or better still, just don't post at all.

barongreenback

I'm perfectly happy to say I spent £150 on a bike fit. Saddle set back, height and stem length changed, cleats adjusted and advice on frame geometry to help shop for a new bike. I'm more comfortable and I've not had a spot of knee or back pain since. Would have taken me ages to do the guesswork and get it right.

shaun668

SPaM02 wrote:

I was always told to make small changes when adjusting things like saddle height, stem/bars height etc. No more than 10mm increments at a time and allow the body to get used to the change for a week or two before making the next change, in order to avoid injury.
It's quite possibly old-school B.S but it kind of makes sense. A 35mm increase in saddle height in one go seems quite extreme.

When I had it done and the fitter said the saddle had been raised by 35mm I thought that was a lot, it has made a real difference no knee pain.

I set the bike up myself last year and copied the dimensions from my other bike to this one, I could never get it right I was always changing things until I got the best fit I could and put up with the aches and pains hence the reason for the fit to get it right £140.00 well spent.

fat daddy

I'd like someone to set my cleats up ... its not that I am unhappy with them, but I put them on my shoes years ago, pretty much set them slap bang in the middle and never touched them since.

should I be riding more towards my toes, more towards my heel, left/right do I need to point my foot in our out more ..... I dunno

imposter2.0

fat daddy wrote:

I'd like someone to set my cleats up ... its not that I am unhappy with them, but I put them on my shoes years ago, pretty much set them slap bang in the middle and never touched them since.

should I be riding more towards my toes, more towards my heel, left/right do I need to point my foot in our out more ..... I dunno

Only you can answer that really. Generally speaking, the pedal axle should bisect the ball of the foot - and that therefore determines your cleat position as a starting point. Then move slightly forward or rear of that line depending on personal preference. Heels in or out mostly depends on how your feet hang naturally and how much lateral rotation your knees can/cannot cope with. Again, down to you.

imposter2.0

dstev55 wrote:

Or better still, just don't post at all.

Maybe listen to your own advice a bit there, mate. Ironic that your only post on this thread is an ad hominem.

dstev55

Imposter wrote:

dstev55 wrote:

Or better still, just don't post at all.

Maybe listen to your own advice a bit there, mate. Ironic that your only post on this thread is an ad hominem.

Maybe that's because I was reading this thread with interest and every other post seems to be a negative one from you containing what you obviously think are clever remarks.

How about you turn a leaf in your obviously very boring life and try and have a positive outlook on things? You never know you may actually feel better...

And please don't refer to me as "mate". I generally try and disassociate myself from people like you in my life.

vrsmatt

I hope imposter has never been to a restaurant and paid £25 or so for someone to heat up a few pounds worth of ingredients for him.....

imposter2.0

dstev55 wrote:

Maybe that's because I was reading this thread with interest and every other post seems to be a negative one from you containing what you obviously think are clever remarks.

How about you turn a leaf in your obviously very boring life and try and have a positive outlook on things? You never know you may actually feel better...

And please don't refer to me as "mate". I generally try and disassociate myself from people like you in my life.

There you go again, mate. Complaining about someone making clever remarks, while making 'clever' remarks yourself.

imposter2.0

VRSMatt wrote:

I hope imposter has never been to a restaurant and paid £25 or so for someone to heat up a few pounds worth of ingredients for him.....

You think getting a bike fit is like going to a restaurant? You clearly are a new breed of cyclist...

vrsmatt

Imposter wrote:

VRSMatt wrote:

I hope imposter has never been to a restaurant and paid £25 or so for someone to heat up a few pounds worth of ingredients for him.....

You think getting a bike fit is like going to a restaurant? You clearly are a new breed of cyclist...

I'd rather be my breed than an in-breed thanks

imposter2.0

VRSMatt wrote:

Imposter wrote:

VRSMatt wrote:

I hope imposter has never been to a restaurant and paid £25 or so for someone to heat up a few pounds worth of ingredients for him.....

You think getting a bike fit is like going to a restaurant? You clearly are a new breed of cyclist...

I'd rather be my breed than an in-breed thanks

Wahey - another ad hominem. When you've got no valid argument, just resort to insults..

vrsmatt

Imposter wrote:

VRSMatt wrote:

Imposter wrote:

VRSMatt wrote:

I hope imposter has never been to a restaurant and paid £25 or so for someone to heat up a few pounds worth of ingredients for him.....

You think getting a bike fit is like going to a restaurant? You clearly are a new breed of cyclist...

I'd rather be my breed than an in-breed thanks

Wahey - another ad hominem. When you've got no valid argument, just resort to insults..

I suggest you go back and read your own posts,more subtle but still insults, along with trolling.

If you think a bike fit is paying someone to put your saddle up then you're as retarded as the drivel you post

imposter2.0

VRSMatt wrote:

I suggest you go back and read your own posts,more subtle but still insults, along with trolling.

If you think a bike fit is paying someone to put your saddle up then you're as retarded as the drivel you post

I might take the pi55 a bit on threads like this, but I haven't had to resort to insults yet, mate. You, on the other hand, have knocked out crackers like 'in-breed' and 'retard' in your last two replies. I wonder which one of us is short of repertoire here?

You're getting cross on the internet because someone isn't buying into the whole 'bike fit' concept. Come on...

vrsmatt

Imposter wrote:

VRSMatt wrote:

I suggest you go back and read your own posts,more subtle but still insults, along with trolling.

If you think a bike fit is paying someone to put your saddle up then you're as retarded as the drivel you post

I might take the pi55 a bit on threads like this, but I haven't had to resort to insults yet, mate. You, on the other hand, have knocked out crackers like 'in-breed' and 'retard' in your last two replies. I wonder which one of us is short of repertoire here?

You're getting cross on the internet because someone isn't buying into the whole 'bike fit' concept. Come on...

I'm not remotely cross, I wouldn't raise my pulse over your opinion on bike fit, let alone take the internet seriously. I've been around long enough to see your style of poster on forums many times and will continue to repond accordingly.

Cheers mate

imposter2.0

VRSMatt wrote:

I wouldn't raise my pulse over your opinion on bike fit, let alone take the internet seriously.

dstev55

Imposter wrote:

dstev55 wrote:

Maybe that's because I was reading this thread with interest and every other post seems to be a negative one from you containing what you obviously think are clever remarks.

How about you turn a leaf in your obviously very boring life and try and have a positive outlook on things? You never know you may actually feel better...

And please don't refer to me as "mate". I generally try and disassociate myself from people like you in my life.

There you go again, mate. Complaining about someone making clever remarks, while making 'clever' remarks yourself.

There is nothing particularly clever about me voicing my opinion.

I promised myself I won't to get in to these types of negative debates however at the same time I find it difficult to ignore your type of behaviour.

My advice (not that it will make a blind bit of differance) - sit back, put your neutral head on and re-read this thread from the beginning as though you had never seen it before. Maybe, just maybe, you will see the error of your ways.

Don't bother replying to this post as it is obvious that you're a lost cause in terms of being a rational human being and I won't be posting on this thread again as I have much more positive aspects of my life to be getting on with.

imposter2.0

dstev55 wrote:

My advice (not that it will make a blind bit of differance) - sit back, put your neutral head on and re-read this thread from the beginning as though you had never seen it before. Maybe, just maybe, you will see the error of your ways.

So we had 'strawman' and 'ad hominem' already - now we can add 'arrogant' and 'patronising' to your list. Once again mate, maybe take a bit of your own advice.

joenobody

Imposter wrote:

fat daddy wrote:

I'd like someone to set my cleats up ... its not that I am unhappy with them, but I put them on my shoes years ago, pretty much set them slap bang in the middle and never touched them since.

should I be riding more towards my toes, more towards my heel, left/right do I need to point my foot in our out more ..... I dunno

Only you can answer that really.

Not true - a good fitting rig will be able to tell you if your cleats are in the right place and allowing you to deliver force centrally on the pedals. Mine feel ok, but the Shimano rig I was tested on indicated that I'm driving through the outer edge of the pedals, so there's some adjustment to be done there.

joenobody

Imposter wrote:

JoeNobody wrote:

Imposter wrote:

You can post-rationalise it however you like, but the net result is the same. Anyway, let's not get involved in semantics.

You didn't ask how much the fit cost, you asked how much he paid to have someone move his saddle and change his stem. That's not post-rationalisation, it's stating the facts.

No, I implied you were post-rationalising, not me. You're doing it again.

I wasn't suggesting you were. I don't see how my saying "you said this, and you didn't say that", whatever this and that are, is anything other than stating facts.

imposter2.0

JoeNobody wrote:

Imposter wrote:

fat daddy wrote:

I'd like someone to set my cleats up ... its not that I am unhappy with them, but I put them on my shoes years ago, pretty much set them slap bang in the middle and never touched them since.

should I be riding more towards my toes, more towards my heel, left/right do I need to point my foot in our out more ..... I dunno

Only you can answer that really.

Not true - a good fitting rig will be able to tell you if your cleats are in the right place and allowing you to deliver force centrally on the pedals. Mine feel ok, but the Shimano rig I was tested on indicated that I'm driving through the outer edge of the pedals, so there's some adjustment to be done there.

Quite possibly, but who is to say that your 'shimano rig' is telling you the correct information and that a Bioracer rig, or Retul, Smartfit, etc, etc wouldn't tell you something completely different? All of these fit systems are based on differing metrics and protocols.

Also not convinced that applying force 'centrally' on the pedal is critical, as long as the force is applied on the pedal, I wouldn't think it matters too much. Unless it was giving you some kind of physiological problem, in which case, fair enough. Doesn't mean it would be the same for everyone though.

joenobody

Imposter wrote:

Quite possibly, but who is to say that your 'shimano rig' is telling you the correct information and that a Bioracer rig, or Retul, Smartfit, etc, etc wouldn't tell you something completely different? All of these fit systems are based on differing metrics and protocols.

I agree with that, but still, it does mean that "only you can answer that" is wrong, even if the fitting systems provide different feedback.

Also not convinced that applying force 'centrally' on the pedal is critical, as long as the force is applied on the pedal, I wouldn't think it matters too much. Unless it was giving you some kind of physiological problem, in which case, fair enough. Doesn't mean it would be the same for everyone though.

Hard to say as I could only see the difference on the rig, however it did appear to show a higher power output when the force was applied more centrally. I would expect it has something to do with the efficient transfer of power, but being neither a physicist, nor a mechanical engineer (or any other profession that would know for sure), I don't if that's a fair expectation.

Ben6899

Imposter wrote:

fat daddy wrote:

I'd like someone to set my cleats up ... its not that I am unhappy with them, but I put them on my shoes years ago, pretty much set them slap bang in the middle and never touched them since.

should I be riding more towards my toes, more towards my heel, left/right do I need to point my foot in our out more ..... I dunno

Only you can answer that really. Generally speaking, the pedal axle should bisect the ball of the foot - and that therefore determines your cleat position as a starting point. Then move slightly forward or rear of that line depending on personal preference. Heels in or out mostly depends on how your feet hang naturally and how much lateral rotation your knees can/cannot cope with. Again, down to you.

Sit on the kitchen worktop with your legs swinging. Pay attention to your feet and the angle they're creating. Your cleat position should allow them to sit at that angle when pedaling. Give or take a few degrees, depending on - as Impostor says - your knees and the amount of float in the cleat/pedal system.

socrates

Surely a proper bike fit would mean more than stem and seat height. I am thinking crank length and cleat positions. I would also be sceptical that the rider would find such a difference on the first ride. It would take a few weeks of riding for ones body to adjust to the new position and would feel more than a little strange on an initial ride.

joey54321

I went to a bike fitter who had all the gizmos, Saddle pressure mapping and Retul dots. I told him a previous fitter had put me in a position with the saddle quite high and far forward and it really didn't work for me.

So what does this fitter do? Blindly follow the numbers until I have a higher seat that is further forward than the previous fitter. He completely disregarded what I said and I ended up poorer and with, in my opinion, a very bad fit (which I tried to get used to, but in the end made my riding so miserable I reverted back to my 'old' position. I'd rather have a 'poor' fit that I use than an amazing fit and give up cycling).


Edit: Just seeing the other post about cleats, he's response when I said I wanted to replace my worn ones with new ones but wanted to do it with/before the fitting was to ensure they were in the correct place:
- look at old cleats
- "Yeah, they're in the right place, just replace them"

fat daddy

Ben6899 wrote:

Sit on the kitchen worktop with your legs swinging. Pay attention to your feet and the angle they're creating. Your cleat position should allow them to sit at that angle when pedaling. Give or take a few degrees, depending on - as Impostor says - your knees and the amount of float in the cleat/pedal system.

thanks for the advice, I'll give that a go