Sunday "club run"

Frank the tank

What format does your club run take?

The club I belong to it all seems a little dis-jointed,however, today it seemed spot on for once. A ride at a reasonable pace with stiff bits to remind you why you have a cardio vascular system. A cafe stop for refreshments and banter, followed by the same again prior to the cafe.

This for me is the ideal formula for recruiting new members.

slowmart

That sounds about right.

The club I ride with follow a similar format with different groups for speed and miles with one now for snoozer and boozers on a Sunday afternoon for those that can't be arsed to get out of bed.

pblakeney

Sounds perfect!
My local club is not like that. I left.

ddraver

You ask an interesting question Frank

I am a "member" of a cafe run club which has grown from a small group of expats to a proper ride organised by the the shop. The trouble is that this ride - the wednesday night one in particular, but most of them really - turn into races and are led by people who (likely, given that I can keep up) are not actually good enough to go and race with one of the proper clubs in the area. The trouble is that the shop staff are young hipsters and arent able to keep control of the regulars who are the backbone of the club but who have no interest in running the ride as a club (except only for them).

2 weeks ago we had what should have been a nasty crash and the cafe boss has now laid down the law and 2 staff now sit on the front and ride at a smooth pace and then the boss and another staff member act as sweepers. (the staff are part time baristas and couriers so they are all sh1t hot riders). With the time change last week a load more people came out and then complained as the ride was too slow and they also struggled to ride in the group as they actually hadnt done it before (except at 100% when you don't need to control youre speed as you either hold on or not). Because it's a shop ride there isnt really anyone to teach the new people the skills of riding in a bunch.

Part of the problem is that many of the regulars who would have supported a less insane ride haev all got so p1ssed off and left. In many cases they have even sold theor road bikes and bought "gravel bikes" saying that they no longer "ride road" (whatever that means). It's a real shame. We'll see what happens over the summer...

slowbike

there will always be ebb and flow in club membership - it'll suit some people for a while, then they'll leave - others will join - change the format - then more will leave, others join etc etc ...

For some, a steady ride provides no purpose - no challenge, no incentive to ride - if all you wanted was a coffee and cake with your mates then you could do that without riding.
For others the fact that it's steady means they're not blowing out their arse the whole way round and actually get to enjoy the ride - if it wasn't organised then they probably wouldn't ride their bikes at all...

For those selling up and getting gravel bikes - fine - a bike is a bike - its all riding ...

Personally - whilst I quite like the discipline of a steady group ride, I do like the freedom of a more relaxed ride - however, sometimes they can be a bit too relaxed (in discipline) and that shows with an inability for the group to stick together.

fenix

What's the problem with having different groups ? My old club would have a racing boys club run that was harder and faster, then a steady club run and then a gentler beginner/oldies run.

It was well policed by the older guard - no stupid racing on the busy roads.

rick_chasey

Mine's standard club run pace, (enough to chat but enough to get knackered too), racing up the hills & waiting at the top.

Typically wait at the bottom of fast descents too to make sure people take them at their own speed.

A section of fast false flat downhill roundabouts is the playground for the bus stop sprint finish so we usually wait there for the others to get their breath back.

Then again there's usually a choice of 4-7 runs a week so people can pick & choose.

markhewitt1978

For many years our club just had one group, often only consisting of 5 or 6 people who went out and hammered in 80 miles at 17mph. Way too fast for me, and for many others.

Then someone started the 'steady ride' initiative where once a month would be a slower paced ride with a cafe stop and we'd get 20-30 people turning up - slower rides proving popular!

This year it's grown up a bit and the steady rides now have a full time captain so they take place each week as well as the faster 'full' club run.

Although it still proves a problem for me as I went out with the steady ride last week and it was too slow for me, my HR barely left Z1 most of the time. But the standard club run is still too quick. Oh well!

ddraver

There is another point about what the "steady"rides get called. Last summer the shop owner ran a series of Saturday rides called the "Slow Riders Cup". They were quite poorly attended, even by people who criticized the Wednesday night rides for being fast. I suspect a lot of that was because no one wanted to be thought of as "slow"

Arguably that's the Dutch "sport is War" attitude surfacing and they need to get a grip, but it happens

rick_chasey

Same happens in the wheelers.

The new scale they introduced is k1-k4. K1 is basically a chain gang afaik and k4 is the most "social".

In reality what happens is all the racers go on K2 rides and no one wants to do k4 rides so you end up with plenty of K3 and "K2.5" or even "K2.75".

markhewitt1978

ddraver wrote:

There is another point about what the "steady"rides get called. Last summer the shop owner ran a series of Saturday rides called the "Slow Riders Cup". They were quite poorly attended, even by people who criticized the Wednesday night rides for being fast. I suspect a lot of that was because no one wanted to be thought of as "slow"

I can well imagine! At first there was a lot of speculation as to what the 'slow' group would be called and I wasn't sure about the term Steady Ride at first, but fair enough over the year it's been going it's caught on as a sort of brand and Steady Rides and Steady Riders are now a well known thing. It's notable that it isn't just the club run B group, we all meet in the same place but the steady ride is an entirely different route.

What is does need - obviously! - is the people willing to put the time in, this year who are willing to post the routes and distances on the facebook group on Fridays so people can plan their weekends accordingly.

Garry H

My club has a fast and a slower one. The slower one is more popular

ddraver

Is it genuinely slow though? If you see what I mean...

Or is it actually a Fast and stupid fast option

veronese68

ddraver wrote:

Or is it actually a Fast and stupid fast option

Surely it's all relative. To me they are probably both stupid fast at the moment.

Anonymous

I find two main things:

1) They always leave too late so I am not back in time to keep the missus happy. 8am sharp in winter, 7.30 in summer would be ideal for me. Use the clocks changing as a guide.
2) If you want to join fast/stupid fast, then you make your own way home if you get dropped. If you are up for a social jolly then you can join the social/slower one.

I like cycling because it's exhilarating. Waiting around getting bored/cold is not that, esp this time of year when it's hard to dress for both 'hard riding' and 'waiting around'.

I am not crazy fit and thus usually go for 'fast' and not 'stupidly fast' and by all means am grateful when they wait although its usually junctions where the group is split, so accepted that people can get back on. I get dropped trying to hang onto the stupidly fast group, then I know I am getting some TT practise in for the rest of the ride!

Frustratingly, all the clubs I've spoken to are super friendly and often competitively focussed (which is what I want, but without the actual racing!), but don't ride at convenient times for me.

iPete

coriordan wrote:

Frustratingly, all the clubs I've spoken to are super friendly and often competitively focussed (which is what I want, but without the actual racing!), but don't ride at convenient times for me.

I'm fairly sure you are based in SW London.

Our advertised club runs are a fraction of the actual rides that go out.
We've now got a large group of cat 3 riders who regularly race and run race focused training sessions.

PM me if you want to know more.

edit: oops re-read what you said, you want strong rides but without the racing. The above would still apply, plenty of non-racers attend these training rides and plenty go out at different hours.

oldbazza

Ours has two Saturday rides of 60km called moderates and easy;easy is about 24/25kph,mods 28+ although theses days it can get over 30.It's been a good way to get people to up their speed by starting in the easy and dipping their toe in the mods;both have captains to oversee the pace and words are had with those that take the piss especially in the easy group.

The Sunday ride is just a longer version of the saturday mods ride;of course being out here in the fens speeds can get up a bit with a tailwind and not many climbs although head and crosswinds can be rather brisk.

The saturday rides were bought in as a way of getting newbies* in but was just one group for the first year;easy group was bought in as it was inevitably breaking up with varying speeds.It seems to be working well as many who started in the easy group are now doing tt's,there will always be those though who just want the social aspect of a steady ride.


*Which was me on the first saturday run desperately clinging on on the way back.

ddraver

Something else one of the bigger clubs did was have all the various groups riding the same route so that a rider who had bitten off more than he could chew in the mods in Baz's club could let the group go knowing that there would be a slower group along behind shortly. The slowest group would then go at the pace of the slowest rider

I got caught out a few times when the groups took different paths through the maze of Dutch bike paths but it usually worked fine.

oldbazza

ddraver wrote:

Something else one of the bigger clubs did was have all the various groups riding the same route so that a rider who had bitten off more than he could chew in the mods in Baz's club could let the group go knowing that there would be a slower group along behind shortly. The slowest group would then go at the pace of the slowest rider

I got caught out a few times when the groups took different paths through the maze of Dutch bike paths but it usually worked fine.

Do get a few people 'swap' groups after the cafe stop,done it myself a couple of times.

step83

Club im in doesnt have a big head count, its not been running long to be fair so we just have one group but not set speed. Groups made up of a couple of experienced riders an we tend to try an keep the newer ones mid pack so they are protected an we can give them advise.
We ride from an LBS who have cake an coffees on tap for when we get back. Always make sure we have at least one good climb in the ride, the newer ones are still getting to grips so I usually end up at the back doing a bit of mid ride tuition, we basically run a rule of no ones left behind solely because theres only about a half dozen of us most rides at the moment.

Garry H

ddraver wrote:

Is it genuinely slow though? If you see what I mean...

Or is it actually a Fast and stupid fast option

This one is genuinely slow. The fast and stupid fast option operates on a tuesday evening.

whoof

It depends what kind of club it is but in general I think the way to go is multiple rides. One persons reasonable pace is a killer for someone else and not fast enough for others. It also allows people to dip their toe into faster riding and for people who have had an injury, lay-off or just want to change can try a slower group. It does take more organisation of ride leaders.

I have been in clubs where there has been a single club ride that have been dominated by a few riders who are either very strong or willing to murder themselves on a club ride in January. The result has been a club ride of 4 to 5 riders. Others have then started a slower ride at a different time or place. This worked for a while then the slowest person on the 'regular' ride joins the steadier ride (many people would rather be the fastest person in a slower group than the slowest in a faster group). Eventually everyone goes out on the 'steady' ride and this gets faster and faster and the cycle repeats itself.

JesseD

It’s the age old problem, one ride wont suit everyone, you get those who turn up once a week or when the weathers nice and like to ride at a moderate pace, have a chat and a bit of a social, usually they haven’t trained all winter so don’t have the speed/fitness etc to ride any faster, and why should they if that’s what floats their boat. Then you get the guys who have put in serious miles and effort over the winter as they want to race who turn up and get shouted at all the time for going too fast, its hard to please everyone all the time.

What we have started doing now is setting off on the same route but in 2 groups with the slower group going first and the faster group going 5 mins later, the faster group usually catch the slower after 10 miles, then we ride together for a bit and the faster guys then go off and do loops off the main route, joining back up and chasing on throughout the ride, both groups get a workout with the faster guys doing more hills and a greater distance at speed. We also tend to do 20 odd miles before the club-run as well to get a longer ride in as the slower guys haven’t got the fitness to do the increased distances, we then all ride to the coffee shop together after the final hill, seems to work!

But we also do have dedicated midweek fast rides, Tuesdays are race pace intervals and Thursdays are fast hilly rides with 8-9 climbs all done quickly, there are sections that if anyone gets dropped they can miss out a climb and we all meet back up. These rides are advertised a training rides and not social rides so the “club-run” riders don’t turn up, just those who race and those who want to get fatsre and put the effort in.

Sundays are more of a traditional club run, brisk pace, lots of hills, we regroup at the top, nobody gets left behind, Sundays are not that well attended.

drlodge

I'm in 2 clubs and have different experiences in both. The first thing I would find out is how the "club runs" are advertised i.e. are they purely social rides, or is it supposed to be fore "training"? That will give a good clue to the pace and how people might be expected to behave.

The more formal club I belong to has a Sunday club ride which is a social ride, however some people are quite fast and sometimes go off the front. We generally have enough people for 2 or 3 groups e.g. "fast", "medium" and "social" so pick the group that suits. We also have dedicated ride leaders and sweepers who will, er, lead and sweep each group. Its quite well run and well organized but has to be given that we can have 40 odd people turn up. There are additional runs on a Saturday and mid week for faster training rides and chaingangs, these are more informal.

The other club is purely social and the number 1 priority is to enjoy the ride. I am more leaning towards this club (especially as it has a high female component so less testosterone) but the times don't always suit - main club run is on a Saturday and I generally get out on Sundays.

Smithster

Our club originally had two runs out on a Sunday, but now has three. We put in a middle group as the club grew, to act as a half way house as the gulf between the two rides was just getting to big for people to transition easily.

So we now have a social ride (really slow) and around 30 miles
An Intermediate ride - a bit quickers and around 50 miles
And the club ride - The fast guys!

All groups have a no drop policy on a Sunday, but we expect a rider to be responsible that they have chosen the right group or they are asked to consider whether they should drop down a group. This works quite well.

Doing the club routes I do try to mix the type of terrain up too, so people can stick their toe in the water of a ride above their normal group over friendlier terrain.

We have a ride out on a Wednesday evening too, which is a fast loop of a local circuit where it is understood you will get dropped but can get picked up again. People really enjoy that and it brought on lot's of riders last year.

We may introduce a Saturday morning chain gang soon too as needs demand as some of the guys have now started racing crits and TT's.

Cafe stops are mandatory on a Sunday on every ride!

davebradswmb

The number of people who turn up for our club rides is very variable. For instance today there were just 5 of us, so we all rode together with quite a gap between the strongest and weakest riders. The problem we have is when a lot turn up, say 30 and we'll make the decision to have 3 groups. Maybe 4 or 5 will volunteer for the fast group, the same again or even less for the slow group leaving the middle group unmanageably large.

Camcycle1974

We have three rides of varying speed in our club. The riding is more important than the cafe so most routes are sub 50 miles with no stop. A longer rides with a cafe stop happens once a month. Good balance for me. Groups tend to be 15-16mph 17-18 and 19-20.

drlodge

Camcycle1974 wrote:

We have three rides of varying speed in our club. The riding is more important than the cafe so most routes are sub 50 miles with no stop. A longer rides with a cafe stop happens once a month. Good balance for me. Groups tend to be 15-16mph 17-18 and 19-20.

The whole point of a Sunday club ride is the cake stop. :P

Camcycle1974

drlodge wrote:

Camcycle1974 wrote:

We have three rides of varying speed in our club. The riding is more important than the cafe so most routes are sub 50 miles with no stop. A longer rides with a cafe stop happens once a month. Good balance for me. Groups tend to be 15-16mph 17-18 and 19-20.

The whole point of a Sunday club ride is the cake stop. :P

Agreed but we have a slightly masochistic ride leader who doesn't believe in stops. A cafe ride has to be at least 70 miles to justify the cake

markhewitt1978

coriordan wrote:

1) They always leave too late so I am not back in time to keep the missus happy. 8am sharp in winter, 7.30 in summer would be ideal for me. Use the clocks changing as a guide.

Yes; and this is the reason I might only do a handful of club rides per year at best. For both groups the official meeting time is 9am, but they don't actually leave until 9.20am.

Whereas this time of year I'm wanting to be out at 8am and like yourself in the height of summer it's more like 7/7.30am. Then it's more than enough time to get in 5 hours riding and still be back home for lunch with the family and down the park with the kids in the afternoon. Whereas the club run doesn't usually get back to base until about 2pm/3pm.

Not unusual at all for me to be doing a ride and have reached my 'destination' and be well into the homeward leg before the club run even sets out.

whoof

markhewitt1978 wrote:

coriordan wrote:

1) They always leave too late so I am not back in time to keep the missus happy. 8am sharp in winter, 7.30 in summer would be ideal for me. Use the clocks changing as a guide.

Yes; and this is the reason I might only do a handful of club rides per year at best. For both groups the official meeting time is 9am, but they don't actually leave until 9.20am.

Whereas this time of year I'm wanting to be out at 8am and like yourself in the height of summer it's more like 7/7.30am. Then it's more than enough time to get in 5 hours riding and still be back home for lunch with the family and down the park with the kids in the afternoon. Whereas the club run doesn't usually get back to base until about 2pm/3pm.

Not unusual at all for me to be doing a ride and have reached my 'destination' and be well into the homeward leg before the club run even sets out.

I'm the opposite. It's the weekend I don't want to be getting up at the same time I would during the week to go to work. I used to be in a club who met at 10 am that was ideal.