Aero Wheels or Electronic Shifting?

turbotommy

dennisn wrote:

TurboTommy wrote:

dennisn wrote:

defride wrote:

Vanity purchase? No chance, the right tool for the job.

I think it is a vanity purchase. Just because you've bought thousands of dollars of tools doesn't mean that you know how to use them. Right tool for the job? Absolutely. Question really is, can you use it? You can spend millions on an F-1 car, but I doubt you can drive it. Of course it's vanity. You want to think you're good enough. And maybe get a few wows from people, but it will be for the bike. Not the way you're able to use it. You'll have to convince yourself that you're this great climber, because no one else will be. Regardless of the bike, you won't be this great climber that you aspire to. More to it than that.

Yes excellent comparison...F1 cars and bike components... I for one never dare put my aero wheels on my bike unless my support team is in attendance.

Much like buying an F1 car will NOT make you a great driver, buying a pro bike will NOT make you a pro rider as the OP hopes it will. Or maybe the OP knows this, as I would think. Therefore the OP hopes to at least look like a pro. That's called vanity.

Uh huh... That's the only possible position. Thanks for clearing that up... I'm sure you're right. The op wants to be a pro. Or maybe he doesn't, right? Great.

dennisn

TurboTommy wrote:

dennisn wrote:

TurboTommy wrote:

dennisn wrote:

defride wrote:

Vanity purchase? No chance, the right tool for the job.

I think it is a vanity purchase. Just because you've bought thousands of dollars of tools doesn't mean that you know how to use them. Right tool for the job? Absolutely. Question really is, can you use it? You can spend millions on an F-1 car, but I doubt you can drive it. Of course it's vanity. You want to think you're good enough. And maybe get a few wows from people, but it will be for the bike. Not the way you're able to use it. You'll have to convince yourself that you're this great climber, because no one else will be. Regardless of the bike, you won't be this great climber that you aspire to. More to it than that.

Yes excellent comparison...F1 cars and bike components... I for one never dare put my aero wheels on my bike unless my support team is in attendance.

Much like buying an F1 car will NOT make you a great driver, buying a pro bike will NOT make you a pro rider as the OP hopes it will. Or maybe the OP knows this, as I would think. Therefore the OP hopes to at least look like a pro. That's called vanity.

Uh huh... That's the only possible position. Thanks for clearing that up... I'm sure you're right. The op wants to be a pro. Or maybe he doesn't, right? Great.

C'mon, we all are vain. We all buy things to make us look better. Fancy car, pro looking bikes, expensive golf stuff, big screen TV, fancy clothes. What's not vain about all that. Or do you have an aversion to the word vain?

iron-clover

If I had to choose (and I will when I eventually get myself a 'nice' road bike) I'd go for electronic shifting myself. But then it would suit my riding style better- charging up and down rolling terrain and wanting to change gears at the most inappropriate times.

I also wouldn't have to worry about re-aligning the gears after long spells of inactivity or after changing wheels/ cassettes.

I should probably also point out I'm not a massive fan of aero wheels. I don't really see the point outside of racing and much prefer lighter wheels/ rims myself, but each to their own.

vinnymarsden

Ok here's my choice ... Aero carbon wheels, because I've already got Di2 and if keeping the wheels I have is the only way to keep my Di2 then they're good wheels anyway !! My theory/motto is buy what YOU want, not what someone else or a magazine/web article makes you think you need !!

StillGoing

People are misusing the word vain. Vain means having or showing an excessively high opinion of one's appearance or ability or worth. Producing no result; useless.

Buying the best because you can afford it is not vanity unless the individual is actually vain. I don't buy a nice car or watch because I think it makes me look good or important. I buy them because I like them. Accusing people of vanity for daring to buy the best they can afford is simple jealousy.

OP; buy the wheels and have the satisfaction of being able to index your gears yourself.

charlie_potatoes

dennisn wrote:

C'mon, we all are vain. We all buy things to make us look better. Fancy car, pro looking bikes, expensive golf stuff, big screen TV, fancy clothes. What's not vain about all that. Or do you have an aversion to the word vain?

...........I bet you think this thread is about you, don't you?

ugo.santalucia

philthy3 wrote:

People are misusing the word vain. Vain means having or showing an excessively high opinion of one's appearance or ability or worth. Producing no result; useless.

Buying the best because you can afford it is not vanity unless the individual is actually vain. I don't buy a nice car or watch because I think it makes me look good or important. I buy them because I like them. Accusing people of vanity for daring to buy the best they can afford is simple jealousy.

I don't think it's jealousy... I do admit to have a problem with waste... you see growing inequality and people spending money on stuff that is totally pointless... I belong to the 5% wealthiest people in the world, so there is really not much to be jealous about... but this is MY problem

My advice was sound...neither, because both are pointless upgrades.

Ber Nard

ugo.santalucia wrote:

My advice was sound...neither, because both are pointless upgrades.

But the OP isn't upgrading, he is buying a new bike and has a choice of two; one with deep wheels and one with Di2. He's after opinions on which to choose. As has been pointed out, some people are quick to answer a question that hasn't been asked.

ugo.santalucia

Ber Nard wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

My advice was sound...neither, because both are pointless upgrades.

But the OP isn't upgrading, he is buying a new bike and has a choice of two; one with deep wheels and one with Di2. He's after opinions on which to choose. As has been pointed out, some people are quick to answer a question that hasn't been asked.

... and that also is true, but it didn't come across in the original post...

onyourright

It is depressing that every call of restraint of mindless consumerism is met with cries of jealousy. I have seen a pretty terrifying transformation of UK society in the last 15 years or so. Back then, status symbols, although already ubiquitous and openly aspired to by most people, were enjoyed with a tinge of guilt.

Now people buy and display these things with no sense of shame whatsoever. It is their right, they worked hard and earned it, why shouldn’t someone else spend their money however they want, it’s all good, etc. Senseless consumerism as the primary purpose of life has been validated and normalised. It has even become normal to admire rather than mock consumerism in others, e.g. the footballer with a dropped Range Rover.

And since cycling is the new golf, it attracts the worst afflicted consumers of all. As I said, it’s depressing.

ugo.santalucia

OnYourRight wrote:

It is depressing that every call of restraint of mindless consumerism is met with cries of jealousy. I have seen a pretty terrifying transformation of UK society in the last 15 years or so. Back then, status symbols, although already ubiquitous and openly aspired to by most people, were enjoyed with a tinge of guilt.

Now people buy and display these things with no sense of shame whatsoever. It is their right, they worked hard and earned it, why shouldn’t someone else spend their money however they want, it’s all good, etc. Senseless consumerism as the primary purpose of life has been validated and normalised. It has even become normal to admire rather than mock consumerism in others, e.g. the footballer with a dropped Range Rover.

And since cycling is the new golf, it attracts the worst afflicted consumers of all. As I said, it’s depressing.

It is depressing... however, probably OT in this case...

But perfect for the 9K bike thread...

viewtopic.php?f=40042&t=13062683

slowbike

Just ignoring the vanity/jealousy posts ...

Neither will make you faster - ok the aero wheels will help a bit - but in my book it's not down to just that - it's down to desirability to ride.

As it's a new bike - whichever you get will be able to take aero wheels - will both be upgradable to DI2? If not, I'd get the DI2 bike now (assuming the rest of the bike and wheels are good too) and get the aero wheels later. If the DI2 bike has crap wheels then perhaps see if you can upgrade them to something reasonable now.

charlie_potatoes

OnYourRight wrote:

It is depressing that every call of restraint of mindless consumerism is met with cries of jealousy. I have seen a pretty terrifying transformation of UK society in the last 15 years or so. Back then, status symbols, although already ubiquitous and openly aspired to by most people, were enjoyed with a tinge of guilt.

Now people buy and display these things with no sense of shame whatsoever. It is their right, they worked hard and earned it, why shouldn’t someone else spend their money however they want, it’s all good, etc. Senseless consumerism as the primary purpose of life has been validated and normalised. It has even become normal to admire rather than mock consumerism in others, e.g. the footballer with a dropped Range Rover.

And since cycling is the new golf, it attracts the worst afflicted consumers of all. As I said, it’s depressing.

What a depressing post.

imposter2.0

Charlie Potatoes wrote:

OnYourRight wrote:

It is depressing that every call of restraint of mindless consumerism is met with cries of jealousy. I have seen a pretty terrifying transformation of UK society in the last 15 years or so. Back then, status symbols, although already ubiquitous and openly aspired to by most people, were enjoyed with a tinge of guilt.

Now people buy and display these things with no sense of shame whatsoever. It is their right, they worked hard and earned it, why shouldn’t someone else spend their money however they want, it’s all good, etc. Senseless consumerism as the primary purpose of life has been validated and normalised. It has even become normal to admire rather than mock consumerism in others, e.g. the footballer with a dropped Range Rover.

And since cycling is the new golf, it attracts the worst afflicted consumers of all. As I said, it’s depressing.

What a depressing post.

Can't argue with it though...

vinnymarsden

Imposter wrote:

Charlie Potatoes wrote:

OnYourRight wrote:

It is depressing that every call of restraint of mindless consumerism is met with cries of jealousy. I have seen a pretty terrifying transformation of UK society in the last 15 years or so. Back then, status symbols, although already ubiquitous and openly aspired to by most people, were enjoyed with a tinge of guilt.

Now people buy and display these things with no sense of shame whatsoever. It is their right, they worked hard and earned it, why shouldn’t someone else spend their money however they want, it’s all good, etc. Senseless consumerism as the primary purpose of life has been validated and normalised. It has even become normal to admire rather than mock consumerism in others, e.g. the footballer with a dropped Range Rover.

And since cycling is the new golf, it attracts the worst afflicted consumers of all. As I said, it’s depressing.

What a depressing post.

Can't argue with it though...

Cant argue!!! What on here…are you telling me thats another forum rule I'm breaking!!! :shock: :shock: :shock:

imposter2.0

ok - you can argue with it (but I'm not going to)

markhewitt1978

Well you can. If someone has worked and earned money and bought a thing. Why for Tim Peakes sake should they be ashamed of it!

ugo.santalucia

Charlie Potatoes wrote:

What a depressing post.

You don't seem to aknowledge the wider implications of what OYR said.

Because Peter Andre was never taken seriously and often ridiculed, he became a very decent bloke in time. While Justin Bieber, because he is taken so seriously by so many, will never get a chance and will always be a revered T-W-A-T
He is just the product of a society that has normalised excesses.

Basically any behaviour is now acceptable, except for three: racism, underage sex and rape

Anonymous

Sexism?

ugo.santalucia

coriordan wrote:

Sexism?

Is it not all part of the same -ism, which collects gender/race/religion/ethnic background?

Discrimination, in simple words

Anonymous

Discriminationism?

Ber Nard

ugo.santalucia wrote:

coriordan wrote:

Sexism?

Is it not all part of the same -ism, which collects gender/race/religion/ethnic background?

Discrimination, in simple words

You're saying racism and sexism are the same thing? What about homophobia? Anyway, WTF has discrimination got to do with buying a bike?

ugo.santalucia

Ber Nard wrote:

ugo.santalucia wrote:

coriordan wrote:

Sexism?

Is it not all part of the same -ism, which collects gender/race/religion/ethnic background?

Discrimination, in simple words

You're saying racism and sexism are the same thing? What about homophobia? Anyway, WTF has discrimination got to do with buying a bike?

Nothing... but OYR made a good point about the sense of entitlement that our society seems to be affect by... "I earn the money therefore I do what I want with it" which used to be considered an arrogant way of going about, is now fully endorsed by many.
There are forms of extreme behaviour which have become perfectly acceptable... I find it sad and it really is not jealousy... I am not interested in having gold bottles of Champagne or driving a Lamborghini in the Chiswick traffic, really I-AM-NOT

dennisn

markhewitt1978 wrote:

Well you can. If someone has worked and earned money and bought a thing. Why for Tim Peakes sake should they be ashamed of it!

I don't think anyone is saying they should be ashamed. Just calling it what it is. It's a free world (more or less).

Anonymous

I don't think anyone is saying 'I earn the money I do what I want with it' but to an extent, you cannot keep questioning the motives of someone acting in such a way, as it is in fact true, whether the person in question is arrogant about it or not.

Regarding a lambo - with the best will in the world, if you like loud/wacky cars and £500K means nothing to you, why would you not buy one?

If you have modest means and are content, then more the power to you. If you are affluent and like certain things, then why not buy things? The spending of money on material goods or even nice holidays employs people, and the more expensive (generalising hugely here) the more likely it will employ a local, skilled tradesman/expert and possibly with a smaller carbon footprint rather than something mass produced from the Far East. Bespoke Italian sportscars, wines, bikes, even homes, for example.

If money was no object to you, would you just stare at it in the bank? You can't take it with you when you die, and the more you spend, the more someone else earns. Think of it like that.

As for me - I would go aero wheels. Ugo made a good point about obscelecence of electronic tech in another thread somewhere and I agree so would go wheels. I am not a luddite but I can't see how electronic gearing would make me enjoy my riding more than aero wheels do. (Caveat: I own carbon wheels and have never ridden electronic gearing)

JesseD

FFS - Last time I looked this was Bike Radar and the forum was titled Road Buying Advice, this thread has seriously moved off-topic, in fact off-forum.

I personally don't give a shi7 who earns more money than me or who has a better bike than me, if you do then brilliant!

But if someone asks a question about should they buy product A or Product B then that's what this forum is about, not saying your choices are wrong and you are all that's wrong with the world.

Everyone has opinions, the trick is not to ram them unsolicited down everyone's throats, its one step away from knocking on peoples doors with a copy of The Watch Tower!

It will be tubs v clinchers next or shimano v campag v sram

Anonymous

I'd say it's more like a discussion at the pub. Starts off one topic and moves around. Stick around or find someone else to talk to.

ugo.santalucia

coriordan wrote:

If money was no object to you, would you just stare at it in the bank? You can't take it with you when you die, and the more you spend, the more someone else earns. Think of it like that.

I think the key is here. We have passed the point where people buy with the money they have in the bank a few decades ago. Credit was introduced to bridge the gap between pay day and spend day and it became the only way fairly quickly. There is hardly anybody in this country who is not in debt... you can call it a mortgage, a loan, a student loan, a credit card, whatever you like most folks have it. Yet it is ignored so that we can all keep spending money that technically we owe. We are kept together by the asusmption, more of a hope, that our mortgage is an investment, which cannot be true forever.

When you belong to the 5% of the richest people in the world and yet you still owe money, you know society has a fuxxing problem!!

There are benefits to consumerism, but I fear the balance tipped some time ago and we are beginning to experience only the drawbacks, the most obvious is that, since money is always owed by the poor to the rich, it always goes in the same direction, from the poor to the rich.

Boy, we've gone a long way with these aero wheels... they must really make you fly!!

charlie_potatoes

dennisn wrote:

I don't think anyone is saying they should be ashamed.

Yes they are and they should be ashamed of themselves for saying it. Shame on them.

markhewitt1978

dennisn wrote:

markhewitt1978 wrote:

Well you can. If someone has worked and earned money and bought a thing. Why for Tim Peakes sake should they be ashamed of it!

I don't think anyone is saying they should be ashamed. Just calling it what it is. It's a free world (more or less).

You're right not, shame guilt:

Back then, status symbols, although already ubiquitous and openly aspired to by most people, were enjoyed with a tinge of guilt.