how not to lose weight

racoonbilly

I’ve started to get in to my road cycling and have invested in a Garmin edge 1000, Strava tells me I burn approx 1000 calories every 1.5 hour ride, I know it’s only approximate but I am concerned at how I can replace the calories but in a healthy way.

I am naturally slim and I know people use cycling to lose weight but that is the last thing I want - if anything I would like to gain a few pounds, a friend who is really in to road cycling suggested a protein drink straight after a ride, 2 scoops of SIS protein powder with milk only gives me 200 calories, what can I eat to make up the rest, he eats fig rolls, chocolate etc i'm concerned about taking in too much sugar.

Any help much appreciated

t4tomo

Pork pies, cakes , and bacon sandwiches. All Superfoods.

olake92

Holy cow. You called for the king of eating insane amounts of calories and he has arrived. Bask in the warm glow of my content stomach.

A favourite recipe of mine:

300ml whole milk
30g oats
30g nutella
30g protein powder
a small banana (approx 70g)

Blend it all up and you have a really tasty post ride milkshake of ~700kcal. You can even throw in an extra 30g of peanut butter if you feel crazy.

50g of nuts is a good 300kcal; dark chocolate is close to 200 for a serving; 50g of smoked salmon or a tin of tuna on rye bread with avocado is pretty tasty; a drained tin of chickpeas roasted and spiced; 4 large eggs can be anywhere from 300 to 500kcal.

Man, the list goes on and on!

HOWEVER... if you want to gain weight in the right way, and by right I mean not fat but muscle, you have to either hit the gym or do high intensity riding (above lactate threshold for at least 10' in a session).

So my suggestion is as follows; by all means eat more food, and if you don't mind about gaining primarily fat, do just that. If you want muscle, do a simple beginners gym program (eg 5x5) 3 times a week and eat a moderate calorie surplus of ~500kcal. Keep riding throughout and, while it will impair your hypertrophy slightly, it will minimise any fat gain as well. Obviously, the gym work is simply a supplement to your riding, but it will ensure you gain muscle.

olake92

I thought I'd chuck in a few pages from my bookmarks that give me some inspiration when tuna and rice with soy sauce gets a bit boring*.

Ramen recipes - great as they can often be pre-cooked and kept in a jar/tupperware in the fridge for whenever you fancy

If you're strapped for cash or ok with a repetitive diet

Hate shopping? Get some tips from bodybuilders! Because let's be honest, who likes food shopping?

Healthy meal formulas. A lifesaver.

*Who am I kidding? Rice, tuna, soy sauce and a little hot sauce never gets boring!

gethinceri

olake92 wrote:

I thought I'd chuck in a few pages from my bookmarks that give me some inspiration when tuna and rice with soy sauce gets a bit boring*.

*Who am I kidding? Rice, tuna, soy sauce and a little hot sauce never gets boring!

When I discovered this all my worries disappeared. Top dining, tasty and quick.

slowmart

Racoonbilly wrote:

I’ve started to get in to my road cycling and have invested in a Garmin edge 1000, Strava tells me I burn approx 1000 calories every 1.5 hour ride, I know it’s only approximate but I am concerned at how I can replace the calories but in a healthy way.

I am naturally slim and I know people use cycling to lose weight but that is the last thing I want - if anything I would like to gain a few pounds, a friend who is really in to road cycling suggested a protein drink straight after a ride, 2 scoops of SIS protein powder with milk only gives me 200 calories, what can I eat to make up the rest, he eats fig rolls, chocolate etc i'm concerned about taking in too much sugar.

Any help much appreciated

The code/algorithms used are broadly generic and have little correlation to the real world, even after putting the correct metrics into the Garmin the indicated calorie usage is way over what it is in real terms. Add a heart rate monitor and the calorie expenditure will reduce by half at least and become more relevant and nearer your actual usage, but again it's only generic.

Diet is fundamental to ensure your body recovers in the best way after exercise, as is rest. Dependant upon the intensity, time spent riding and your personal ability to recover all impact your ability in getting stronger, quicker and building endurance.


Without an insight into your riding schedule it's difficult to offer informed advice other than broad brush strokes. Recovery drinks are fine but a balanced diet and understanding what foods your body assimilates best is an interesting journey of discovery. Banana's, jelly babies, malt loaf, fig rolls serve my needs well. As does the occasional gel or carb drink when it's a tough ride.


Stay away from processed food, focus on fruits, veg , fish and chicken and you won't go far wrong.

keef66

+1 on the HRM. On the occasional ride when I've forgotten to put on the HR strap and I CBA to take kit off again, the Garmin tells me I've burned a lot more calories than when it's using the HR info.

I suspect the calculation with the HRM is the more accurate

markhewitt1978

Racoonbilly wrote:

I’ve started to get in to my road cycling and have invested in a Garmin edge 1000, Strava tells me I burn approx 1000 calories every 1.5 hour ride, I know it’s only approximate but I am concerned at how I can replace the calories but in a healthy way.

I am naturally slim and I know people use cycling to lose weight but that is the last thing I want - if anything I would like to gain a few pounds, a friend who is really in to road cycling suggested a protein drink straight after a ride, 2 scoops of SIS protein powder with milk only gives me 200 calories, what can I eat to make up the rest, he eats fig rolls, chocolate etc i'm concerned about taking in too much sugar.

Any help much appreciated

Keeping in mind that this figure is almost certainly wrong. How wrong is open to question!

I'd go with the bacon sandwich option myself.

bobmcstuff

I'll post this again - http://www.dcrainmaker.com/2010/11/how- ... armin.html - DCRainmaker's review of the various Garmin calorie calculation methods.

The newer Garmins (810, 1000 etc) use the Firstbeat 2 algorithm which validates against lab testing to within 10%, which makes it fairly accurate as far as these things go. I use it as an indicator but as with any model it is useful to be aware of its limitations - particularly because there will be errors that are at least as great in however you're working out calories consumed (so you will get compound errors if both are wrong in the same direction).

In relation to what would be nicest after exercise? I would go with olake92's smoothie recipe, except maybe with a shot of vanilla syrup - my favourite is milk, oats, Nesquick, a banana, peanut butter and a shot of vanilla. I had to stop making those though as it wasn't helping with my weight target. I'll often have a Nesquick after a hard workout as it has a 2:1 carbs:protein ratio (w/semi-skimmed milk) which is supposedly about what you are looking for in a recovery drink. It definitely feels like it helps... but mainly I really like Nesquick.

stu-bim

Racoonbilly wrote:

I’ve started to get in to my road cycling and have invested in a Garmin edge 1000, Strava tells me I burn approx 1000 calories every 1.5 hour ride, I know it’s only approximate but I am concerned at how I can replace the calories but in a healthy way.

I am naturally slim and I know people use cycling to lose weight but that is the last thing I want - if anything I would like to gain a few pounds, a friend who is really in to road cycling suggested a protein drink straight after a ride, 2 scoops of SIS protein powder with milk only gives me 200 calories, what can I eat to make up the rest, he eats fig rolls, chocolate etc i'm concerned about taking in too much sugar.

Any help much appreciated

Come eat with me for a week, I am sure you will not lose a pound not matter how much you train

racoonbilly

Thanks for all your comments, really appreciate people making the effort to share knowledge.

I checked my last 25 mile/1.5 hr ride, Strava indicated (used my hrm) 1085 kilo joules (not calories Doohhh!!) google converted this to 259 calories - it sounds quite low for 1.5 hours of effort.

Some interesting food advice, milk/oats/nutella/protein powder/banana sounds great and healthy those of you eating jelly babies/fig rolls/malt loaf etc do you worry about the sugar intake - I am 45 and I try and limit my sugar intake but most cyclists do not seem concerned for post cycle tucker

Any thoughts?, am I worrying about nothing with respect to the sugar?

bobmcstuff

Strava gives you kj data? Strava won't use the hr data anyway, it uses estimated power data - and from what I understand it essentially just convert the kj figure to calories (as in 1000kj of work equals 1000 calories burnt). Not that the estimated power figure is going to be that accurate either. My strava just gives me a calories figure anyway.

See what garmin Connect says - it'll be totally different and also it'll be the hr calculated figure (still wrong but less wrong, probably).

top_bhoy

bobmcstuff wrote:

Strava gives you kj data? Strava won't use the hr data anyway, it uses estimated power data - and from what I understand it essentially just convert the kj figure to calories (as in 1000kj of work equals 1000 calories burnt). Not that the estimated power figure is going to be that accurate either. My strava just gives me a calories figure anyway.

See what garmin Connect says - it'll be totally different and also it'll be the hr calculated figure (still wrong but less wrong, probably).

Are you suggesting that 1 Kj = 1 calorie? If so, it isn't because kilojoules to calories isn't a 1:1 translation. There are 4.184 kilojoules in a calorie. Unless I need it to be accurate (and these things rarely are more than approximations anyway) I tend to divide the number of kilojoules by 4 to find the calorie to give a rough estimate.

bobmcstuff

Top_Bhoy wrote:

bobmcstuff wrote:

Strava gives you kj data? Strava won't use the hr data anyway, it uses estimated power data - and from what I understand it essentially just convert the kj figure to calories (as in 1000kj of work equals 1000 calories burnt). Not that the estimated power figure is going to be that accurate either. My strava just gives me a calories figure anyway.

See what garmin Connect says - it'll be totally different and also it'll be the hr calculated figure (still wrong but less wrong, probably).

Are you suggesting that 1 Kj = 1 calorie? If so, it isn't because kilojoules to calories isn't a 1:1 translation. There are 4.184 kilojoules in a calorie. Unless I need it to be accurate (and these things rarely are more than approximations anyway) I tend to divide the number of kilojoules by 4 to find the calorie to give a rough estimate.

No, I am not. I am suggesting that because your body is not that efficient, effectively your body burning 1 calorie roughly equals 1/4 cal or 1 kJ as measured at the pedals. This is a common assumption I have seen suggested for power meter users e.g., http://mccraw.co.uk/powertap-kilojoules-and-calories/

To explain what I mean this is what my Strava looks like for yesterday's ride:



As you can see it's giving 606kj energy output (from Strava's estimated power model, the accuracy of which is debatable) and 676cal in terms of calories. In this case it matches up quite well to the Garmin figures (682), but that pretty much never happens.

All of these methods have various amounts of inaccuracy though...

stevie63

It's because the Body is approx 25% efficient when cycling that you can use the 1kj/1kcal assumption. With regards to the Garmin and Calories you would need to look at what Garmin Connect says not Strava as this uses its own calculation.

bobmcstuff

stevie63 wrote:

It's because the Body is approx 25% efficient when cycling that you can use the 1kj/1kcal assumption. With regards to the Garmin and Calories you would need to look at what Garmin Connect says not Strava as this uses its own calculation.

Exactly (only put much more concisely than I managed )

keef66

Racoonbilly wrote:

Thanks for all your comments, really appreciate people making the effort to share knowledge.

I checked my last 25 mile/1.5 hr ride, Strava indicated (used my hrm) 1085 kilo joules (not calories Doohhh!!) google converted this to 259 calories - it sounds quite low for 1.5 hours of effort.

Some interesting food advice, milk/oats/nutella/protein powder/banana sounds great and healthy those of you eating jelly babies/fig rolls/malt loaf etc do you worry about the sugar intake - I am 45 and I try and limit my sugar intake but most cyclists do not seem concerned for post cycle tucker

Any thoughts?, am I worrying about nothing with respect to the sugar?

I do a gently undulating regular 25 mile loop which also takes me about 1.5 hours, and my Garmin with HRM usually tells me it's 600-800 kcal which I feel is probably in the right area. One day I cba to put the HRM on and it claimed I'd burned 1100 kcal!

Regarding the food; anything up to a couple of hours and I'll only take a bottle of drink. 3-5 hours and I'll take some fig rolls, jelly babies, a banana etc so I can nibble little and often on the bike. An all day ride and I'd get sick of exclusively sweet stuff, and pack up some ham / cheese sandwiches, and if it's cold, a flask of tea for a proper sit down feed stop or two.

Malt loaf and fig rolls contain some fibre and more complex carbs too, so they are not so bad in terms of sudden spikes in blood sugar. Jelly babies are just a lot cheaper / easier than gels; handy if you do need a quick energy burst. I wouldn't go eating pounds of them. I wouldn't eat any of this stuff as a post-ride snack though. In winter that's a pint of sweet tea and a couple of Hobnobs, and in the summer it's banana, honey and peanut butter blended into a glass of milk.

milemuncher1

If I've done a 150+ mile ride, I'll go out in the evening, and eat a dirty great kebab, and a few beers. It stops me wasting away. If my ride's less than 60 miles, and / or not too hilly, I'll just have a normal balanced meal. No need for expensive artificial muck ( energy gels/ protein bars / shakes etc). Energy gels make me gag anyway. If I'm on a 60+ mile ride, I'll take 1, 750 ml bottle of water, with one of the 'zero' drinks tablets in it (unless it's very hot). I might take some fig rolls or jelly babies, to eat if I run low on fuel at the end of a ride, but I'll generally plan a proper food stop, somewhere, on my longer rides.

redvision

Racoonbilly wrote:

I’ve started to get in to my road cycling and have invested in a Garmin edge 1000, Strava tells me I burn approx 1000 calories every 1.5 hour ride, I know it’s only approximate but I am concerned at how I can replace the calories but in a healthy way.

Don't believe the estimates from Strava (or Garmin for that matter).

From my experience the art of not losing weight is by trying to lose weight - every time i try and lose weight i never succeed and usually end up heavier!

I was reading a study earlier this week which claims that there is more and more evidence to support the theory that weight can only be controlled by your diet - pretty obvious i know, but some people assume if they ride a bike or go for a run they can eat anything and everything and will still lose weight :roll:
If you exercise you need to ensure you are consuming at least the extra number of calories you are burning during that exercise - otherwise you may lose weight.

bobmcstuff

redvision wrote:

Racoonbilly wrote:

I’ve started to get in to my road cycling and have invested in a Garmin edge 1000, Strava tells me I burn approx 1000 calories every 1.5 hour ride, I know it’s only approximate but I am concerned at how I can replace the calories but in a healthy way.

Don't believe the estimates from Strava (or Garmin for that matter).

From my experience the art of not losing weight is by trying to lose weight - every time i try and lose weight i never succeed and usually end up heavier!

My experience is exactly opposite to that - religiously calorie counting and aiming for a 1000 calorie deficit every day is extremely effective for me in losing weight (and inputting calorie figures from the Garmin). 1000 cal seems enough to avoid calculation errors in the figures.

I have lost 3.9kg since 5th Jan by doing just that, target is to get back under 70kg by the end of Feb, expect to make that somewhere around 20th Feb. Once I'm there I know I'll maintain that weight without much effort so long as I keep the cycling up.

markhewitt1978

bobmcstuff wrote:

My experience is exactly opposite to that - religiously calorie counting and aiming for a 1000 calorie deficit every day is extremely effective for me in losing weight (and inputting calorie figures from the Garmin). 1000 cal seems enough to avoid calculation errors in the figures.

I have lost 3.9kg since 5th Jan by doing just that, target is to get back under 70kg by the end of Feb, expect to make that somewhere around 20th Feb. Once I'm there I know I'll maintain that weight without much effort so long as I keep the cycling up.

Excellent work! I too am aiming for 70kg, since I'm 85kg now, some way to go.

bobmcstuff

I was 88kg in Jan 2014! Then I started cycling a lot (rather than once a month or whatever) and was 75kg in Dec 2014 without too much difficulty. Then I did a similar effort as now (1000cal daily deficit) and made 69kg at the end of Feb 2015 which I maintained until May just by cycling a lot. Crept back up to 71-72kg over the summer, but then October-November I was away for work pretty much the whole time (hotel food and lack of exercise...) so was back to 75kg after that. Then with just a little more over Christmas and 76.5kg on the 5th of Jan...

So I am planning to get to my target weight again before the start of the cycling season proper, because I am considering entering some races/time trials this year if all goes well.

Alex99

Racoonbilly wrote:

I’ve started to get in to my road cycling and have invested in a Garmin edge 1000, Strava tells me I burn approx 1000 calories every 1.5 hour ride, I know it’s only approximate but I am concerned at how I can replace the calories but in a healthy way.

I am naturally slim and I know people use cycling to lose weight but that is the last thing I want - if anything I would like to gain a few pounds, a friend who is really in to road cycling suggested a protein drink straight after a ride, 2 scoops of SIS protein powder with milk only gives me 200 calories, what can I eat to make up the rest, he eats fig rolls, chocolate etc i'm concerned about taking in too much sugar.

Any help much appreciated

Power meter tell me I put out 600-800 kJ/hr on an endurance ride (riding at about 200-220 W), so burning 600-800 cal/hr if I have normal-ish efficency. I eat 300/hr on the bike. I'll have much more gas in the tank for the end of the ride, and making up the rest after the ride is more doable.

bigmitch41

Myfitnesspal.com is a really good way of monitoring your calorie intake and it sincs with Strava/Endomondo etc to add back exercise calories burned, once set up and you get the hang of logging in your meals its really easy, it has an app that works on your smart phone oh and its free, worked for me..

markhewitt1978

bobmcstuff wrote:

I was 88kg in Jan 2014! Then I started cycling a lot (rather than once a month or whatever) and was 75kg in Dec 2014 without too much difficulty. Then I did a similar effort as now (1000cal daily deficit) and made 69kg at the end of Feb 2015 which I maintained until May just by cycling a lot. Crept back up to 71-72kg over the summer, but then October-November I was away for work pretty much the whole time (hotel food and lack of exercise...) so was back to 75kg after that. Then with just a little more over Christmas and 76.5kg on the 5th of Jan...

So I am planning to get to my target weight again before the start of the cycling season proper, because I am considering entering some races/time trials this year if all goes well.

Excellent work! It's slow progress for sure. Hopefully it'll start working better once the weather eases a little and I can start doing proper long Sunday rides.

Somewhat frustrating for me that because I'm relatively short at 5'6" I have the relatively low power output which goes with that, but on climbs that should be compensated for by the fact I'm light as a result - but I'm not light

AK_jnr

Top_Bhoy wrote:

bobmcstuff wrote:

Strava gives you kj data? Strava won't use the hr data anyway, it uses estimated power data - and from what I understand it essentially just convert the kj figure to calories (as in 1000kj of work equals 1000 calories burnt). Not that the estimated power figure is going to be that accurate either. My strava just gives me a calories figure anyway.

See what garmin Connect says - it'll be totally different and also it'll be the hr calculated figure (still wrong but less wrong, probably).

Are you suggesting that 1 Kj = 1 calorie? If so, it isn't because kilojoules to calories isn't a 1:1 translation. There are 4.184 kilojoules in a calorie. Unless I need it to be accurate (and these things rarely are more than approximations anyway) I tend to divide the number of kilojoules by 4 to find the calorie to give a rough estimate.

You have a right cheek correcting something you know nothing about. 4 to 1 ratio?! Ha.
According to that, on my 3 and a half hour ride I burned 700 calories just now. Oh and I use a PM as well by the way.
You are getting confused with kj to food calories.

keef66

Another statuesque 5'6" here. Xmas 2014 saw me balloon to nearly 72kg, the heaviest I've ever been. 5:2 intermittent fasting got me down to 65kg quite easily, but Xmas 2015 put 2 kg back on. Now I'm trying to get down to 63kg which is where I think I should be for my height and build. Struggling to get in as much cycling as I'd like with the incessant wind and rain, and the ever increasing list of DIY jobs I have to do. The first kilo fell off, but now I'm stuck.

I think the intermittent fasting has made my body more efficient at storing fat whenever it encounters spare calories, so I suspect I'm going to have to be more careful on the eating days too.

Alex99

AK_jnr wrote:

Top_Bhoy wrote:

bobmcstuff wrote:

Strava gives you kj data? Strava won't use the hr data anyway, it uses estimated power data - and from what I understand it essentially just convert the kj figure to calories (as in 1000kj of work equals 1000 calories burnt). Not that the estimated power figure is going to be that accurate either. My strava just gives me a calories figure anyway.

See what garmin Connect says - it'll be totally different and also it'll be the hr calculated figure (still wrong but less wrong, probably).

Are you suggesting that 1 Kj = 1 calorie? If so, it isn't because kilojoules to calories isn't a 1:1 translation. There are 4.184 kilojoules in a calorie. Unless I need it to be accurate (and these things rarely are more than approximations anyway) I tend to divide the number of kilojoules by 4 to find the calorie to give a rough estimate.

You have a right cheek correcting something you know nothing about. 4 to 1 ratio?! Ha.
According to that, on my 3 and a half hour ride I burned 700 calories just now. Oh and I use a PM as well by the way.
You are getting confused with kj to food calories.

Indeed. You see people do the kJ to kcal conversion, but then forget about the efficiency factor. So in practice, kJ measured on the power meter, roughly equals calories burnt by the meatbag on the bike.

markhewitt1978

keef66 wrote:

Now I'm trying to get down to 63kg which is where I think I should be for my height and build.

I recognise that number! Yes, 63kg is where I need to be too. I want to first get down to 70kg but then use that as a maximum limit rather than a target as such.

dennisn

I'm thinking Gelato everyday will keep ya tubby.

keef66

Well, I'm just back after a week off work with proper flu. Convinced I'd have lost loads of weight through not eating much (no appetite and everything tasted vile anyway) I was disappointed to find I'd only shed a pound

Clearly the complete lack of activity had something to do with it. The only exercise I've done for a fortnight is regular bouts of coughing, and occasional use of the remote to see if there's anything less sh1t than Bargain Hunt.

Missing the bike, but still absolutely no desire to throw a leg over it at the moment, and the cold weather would have me coughing myself inside out within 2 minutes