Assos et al: a breathable, race cut, water resistant jacket?

kayodot

One that can be comfortably worn in autumn, on its own or with just a base layer, and in winter over a jersey as well. Back pockets are essential. If it takes kindly to machine washing, that's also a huge plus. I'm assuming some sort of softshell material is what I'm after. In addition to all of the above, I'm open to any colour as long as it comes in black.

So far I've found:

Rapha Pro Team Jacket
Assos Habu (iJ.haBu.5)
Assos Sturmprinz/Sturmprinz EVO
Parentini Mossa

I tried the Sturmprinz Evo, in a medium it's perfect in the body/arms, but the neck is uncomfortably tight. The large is perfect on the neck, but a little too long in the body and flappy on the lower/upper arms. It also isn't a softshell, although seems to have breathable panels, and from what I've read is very good.

Are there any others, not on the list, that should be under consideration? If anyone has an opinion on any of the above, I'm keen to hear.

edit: I should have added, I don't like the design/branding of the Gabba. Yes, I'm unashamed in my view on form over function.

fenix

What about the Gabba ?

kayodot

Ah, yes. I should have noted that in the OP. I don't like how it looks. Yes, kill me.

robbo2011

Ok, what about the Castelli Alpha Jersey?

Still don't like the looks?

letap73

I have the ASSOS ijhabu - whilst its a well made piece of kit it is not as flexible in use as the Mossa or Alpha(both of which I own). The Mossa is better with rain but runs slightly cooler than the Alpha jersey which runs very warm (the jacket must be unbelievable!). I prefer the Mossa because it fits me perfectly and it works over a wide range of temperatures.

ben-----

Sportful R&D Long Sleeve Wind Jersey

luv2ride

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19692723#p19692723]ben-----[/url] wrote:

Sportful R&D Long Sleeve Wind Jersey

+1. A very versatile bit of kit.

cc78

Sportful Fiandre Light WS Jacket

http://road.cc/content/review/139051-sportful-fiandre-light-ws-jacket

fits all the criteria in the OP

northpole

I'd probably suggest the gabba with nanoflex arm warmers for early autumn and the alpha jacket for winter which is a remarkable piece of kit.

Peter

bendertherobot

Which Rapha pro team? The saintly heavenly normal one? Or the utterly awful softshell Gabba variant?

kayodot

...the pro team jacket?

Thanks for the suggestions so far. All of these seem to be very similar, and not much divides them in terms of the materials used - is that fair? Is is styling/fit that distinguishes them?

kayodot

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19692776#p19692776]cc78[/url] wrote:

Sportful Fiandre Light WS Jacket

http://road.cc/content/review/139051-sportful-fiandre-light-ws-jacket

fits all the criteria in the OP

Does it? My concern with fabrics that have a 'coating' is that they need to be reproofed over time.

Are there any made from Schoeller type fabric that doesn't need reproofing?

bendertherobot

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19692899#p19692899]kayodot[/url] wrote:

...the pro team jacket?

Thanks for the suggestions so far. All of these seem to be very similar, and not much divides them in terms of the materials used - is that fair? Is is styling/fit that distinguishes them?

There are two. The Pro Team Jacket and the Pro Team Softshell Jacket. The latter is like a Gabba. The former is a nice fleece lined winter jacket. Not really a rain jacket.

kayodot

Yes, I know. The pro team jacket... not the pro team softshell jacket...

It's not a rain jacket, but offers some water resistance from what I understand?

bendertherobot

It does. Quite a lot in fact. But it's not a rain jacket. What type of jacket do you want? The Habu is like the Rapha, but the Sturmprinz is an entirely different thing.

Do you want a warm winter jacket? Or a rain jacket?

The Alpha Jacket (and jersey) are pretty much the ideal candidates if you just want a bit of rain protection now and again. Ditto the Rapha.

If you want proper rain protection then have you thought about the Rapha Hardshell?

kayodot

Warm might be stretching it - I run very hot as it is. A jacket that provides some protection from the wet, but is highly breathable and not too insulating. I appreciate waterproofing/breathability is a trade off, but I'm after maximum breathability, and as much water resistance as possible.

The Alpha sounds like it would be too warm. The Habu, I have no idea if it has any water resistance - I would assume the same as/slightly less than the Rapha PTJ?

bendertherobot

Your brief sounds a lot like a Gabba.

Or a Rapha rain jacket.........................

kayodot

Those both have DWR coatings though, that require regular reproofing, right?

thegreatdivide

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19693116#p19693116]kayodot[/url] wrote:

Those both have DWR coatings though, that require regular reproofing, right?

Pretty much all of these types of jerseys/jackets have a DWR coating that will require reapplication.

I've got a PT Jacket that's about to be used for a third winter and I can't sing its praises enough. I wear it with a SS base layer, then as it gets colder a LS base and then when it hits zero and below a base and LS jersey.

gsk82

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19693116#p19693116]kayodot[/url] wrote:

Those both have DWR coatings though, that require regular reproofing, right?

any rain jacket you buy will need specific detergent and probably re-coating from time to time. you are describing the castelli gabba / sportful finadre light wind jersey. i have the sportful and it is very very good

rafletcher

Here's a rank outsider for consideration...

http://isadoreapparel.com/merino-membrane-softshell-jacket

kayodot

Interesting. I will also add the Search and State S1-J to the list.

JC78DSL99

Galibier Mistral foul weather jacket fits the bill. Dont own one yet but plan to get one. Already own the Tourmalet jacket and its excellent - only needed a jersey and base layer to ride all winter.

PTestTeam

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19693116#p19693116]kayodot[/url] wrote:

Those both have DWR coatings though, that require regular reproofing, right?

The Mossa doesn't rely on DWR coatings, so in that sense is easier to live with. Just wash in 30 degrees with a non-bio detergent with no bleaches or softeners and you'll be fine.

Parentini have two new versions of the Mossa for Winter 2015. The 'Pesente' version which is like the original, but uses a slightly thicker material/laminate and will therefore be a little warmer, and the Mossa 2, which is more insulated, has a more relaxed fit, and is aimed at a more 'leisure rider'. The normal Mossa is more of a performance jacket, aimed at cyclists who ride hard and DON't stop on a winter ride. It's warm, thermal properties work when a rider is working hard.

meanredspider

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19694017#p19694017]PTestTeam[/url] wrote:

Just wash in 30 degrees with a non-bio detergent

What is it about a DWR coating that means it is damaged by enzymes but not by detergent?

Having once manufactured bio and non-bio products at P&G, I still have absolutely no idea why so many manufacturers require non-bio products. The only reason that I'm aware of that non-bio products are developed for is because some people are sensitive to enzymes. I've always continued to use bio products with all of my cycling gear and never seen any harmful effects.

I find it particularly strange because many of these garments are subject to far more harsh conditions in USE than the washing conditions proposed by manufacturers: abrasion, sweat, sunlight UV, road grime, salt, temperatures (certainly above 30C) etc etc.

keef66

That's often puzzled me too. I can see how bleaching agents and softeners could compromise technical materials, but the enzymes in biological detergents? I thought they were pretty specific to breaking down proteins, starch etc?

PTestTeam

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19694151#p19694151]meanredspider[/url] wrote:

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19694017#p19694017]PTestTeam[/url] wrote:

Just wash in 30 degrees with a non-bio detergent

What is it about a DWR coating that means it is damaged by enzymes but not by detergent?

Having once manufactured bio and non-bio products at P&G, I still have absolutely no idea why so many manufacturers require non-bio products. The only reason that I'm aware of that non-bio products are developed for is because some people are sensitive to enzymes. I've always continued to use bio products with all of my cycling gear and never seen any harmful effects.

I find it particularly strange because many of these garments are subject to far more harsh conditions in USE than the washing conditions proposed by manufacturers: abrasion, sweat, sunlight UV, road grime, salt, temperatures (certainly above 30C) etc etc.

It's a good question. I'm going to contact Gianpaolo Parentini to ask the reason why. Although I have done a bit of an experiment myself, although not intentional.

I was given the new Parentini Extreme jersey to try out earlier this year in May. I washed it in my usual Bold bio-detergent (that has inbuilt softener). I was then given another of these jerseys in July. This one I started washing 'correctly'.

The two jerseys do look different now. I'll take some photos tonight and post them up.

daniel_b

I have just ordered a Mossa, be interested to see what it is like.

meanredspider

Bold contains (or used to) AP clay - played hell with regular pumps. I hate softeners and they definitely have an effect on "wetting" - I can always tell when a bath towel has been washed in a softener. See if you can get a third jacket and wash it in regular Daz or Ariel.

kayodot

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19694493#p19694493]Daniel B[/url] wrote:

I have just ordered a Mossa, be interested to see what it is like.

I knew I could rely on you!

I've also taken a punt on the Sturmprinz, purely for the fact I've been able to find it at half price and thereby as cheap as some of the other options.

meanredspider

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19694625#p19694625]kayodot[/url] wrote:

[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19694493#p19694493]Daniel B[/url] wrote:

I have just ordered a Mossa, be interested to see what it is like.

I knew I could rely on you!

I've also taken a punt on the Sturmprinz, purely for the fact I've been able to find it at half price and thereby as cheap as some of the other options.

A friend of mine who suffers in the wet swears by the Sturmprinz (so much so that he bought the knickers to go with it - a frightening total bill).