SRAM eTap wireless is here
Comments
-
0
-
Do the weight penalties take into account any saving in cables? It's marginal either way.0
-
I'm always wary of GCN reviews, relying as they do so heavily on product placements. Check out everyone using Garmin 520s in this video. And the likes of Garmin 1000s being strapped to bikes even when doing maintenance.0 -
I'm always wary of GCN reviews, relying as they do so heavily on product placements. Check out everyone using Garmin 520s in this video. And the likes of Garmin 1000s being strapped to bikes even when doing maintenance.
i think thats the problem with any review, the advertising revenue is what keeps these magazines etc afloat.
but from what we saw in the spring, there was no delay or slowness in response, it was instant.
i d be more concerned about long term reliabilty and fault finding.0 -
77gm heavier for 2x mechs & shifters, so marginal as you said above.Do the weight penalties take into account any saving in cables? It's marginal either way.0 -
I think everyone has missed the point of what the BR review said, he didn't say there was a delay in shifting he said the speed at which the shift took place was slower than he was used to, ie the actual speed at which the dérailleur moved the chain, I do not interprete that as a delay.
If it takes longer to move the cage to the next cog, the time from the moment you click the lever to the time you are ready to "go" in the new gear will be longer, which will be perceived as a delay.One reservation is the lack of option to change both the front and rear dérailleur at the same time, but this may be possible I just don't see how.
None of these systems seem to have a simple "change up" and "change down" option. For a modern drivetrain, there's 20 or 22 possible gears, so you could have one lever go to the next "faster" gear and one lever go to the next "slower" gear, with the system changing the RD and/or FD as necessary. I can see you'd need to tell the system the size of the chainrings and the cassette cogs, but that would seem even more intuitive than the current "click both to swap the chainring" that they have now.
I haven't worked it out in detail, but it might be one of those ideas that's great in theory, but rubbish in practice. Perhaps you end up with every gear change being a combined front and rear change.
The main problem I can see with their current method of changing the FD is that there's no way it can be extended to support a triple at the front.0 -
Shimano have an "auto change" system on the XTR Di2 system, I'm not sure it has been in much demand though, not least because 1x 11 is so popular. The other aspect is that the system does nt know if you re changing up to sprint over a short hill and so may be better off cross chaining for 10 seconds rather than shifting on the front
Who really would use a triple crank with an electronic system? Plus SRAM are the self proclaimed executioners of the Triple crankWe're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver0 -
The other aspect is that the system does nt know if you re changing up to sprint over a short hill and so may be better off cross chaining for 10 seconds rather than shifting on the front
True. But integration with a power meter and cadence meter would be an interesting idea - fully automatic gearing?Who really would use a triple crank with an electronic system?
Why wouldn't you? I've never understood the modern trend to banish the third chainring. The weight penalty is minimal, and the extra flexibility in terms of total gear range and cadence more than make up for it, I think.0 -
You couldnt "pre shift" then though, plus there are issues around riding style and changing cadence as muscles get tired etc etc. It could work for a flat TT I suppose
On triples, SRAM have a whole load of marketing to read/watch etc. I'm fairly meh about the whole thing but it's been a while since I ve seen a "high performance" bike with a triple on itWe're in danger of confusing passion with incompetence
- @ddraver0 -
One thing that puts me off slightly is having the shifting up/down on each side.
If its one thing i love about having Di2 its that i can be taking a drink in my left hand or reaching for something in my pockets and still have the ability to climb up or down the entire cassette with only my right hand on the shifter.0 -
[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19689166#p19689166]ElectronShepherd[/url] wrote:True. But integration with a power meter and cadence meter would be an interesting idea - fully automatic gearing?
Being done, only for Di2 at the moment....
http://www.baroncontrols.com/services.html
More recent review here http://lavamagazine.com/proshift/?cbg_tz=-60
Personally I'm not convinced by that as yet, happy to have electronic shifting but I want to be in control of when it shifts. Not even happy with auto in a car TBH!0 -
I'll probably buy this in a year or so. Impressed.Ben
Bikes: Donhou DSS4 Custom | Condor Italia RC | Gios Megalite | Dolan Preffisio | Giant Bowery '76
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ben_h_ppcc/
Flickr: https://www.flickr.com/photos/143173475@N05/0 -
[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19689110#p19689110]ElectronShepherd[/url] wrote:I think everyone has missed the point of what the BR review said, he didn't say there was a delay in shifting he said the speed at which the shift took place was slower than he was used to, ie the actual speed at which the dérailleur moved the chain, I do not interprete that as a delay.
If it takes longer to move the cage to the next cog, the time from the moment you click the lever to the time you are ready to "go" in the new gear will be longer, which will be perceived as a delay.One reservation is the lack of option to change both the front and rear dérailleur at the same time, but this may be possible I just don't see how.
None of these systems seem to have a simple "change up" and "change down" option. For a modern drivetrain, there's 20 or 22 possible gears, so you could have one lever go to the next "faster" gear and one lever go to the next "slower" gear, with the system changing the RD and/or FD as necessary. I can see you'd need to tell the system the size of the chainrings and the cassette cogs, but that would seem even more intuitive than the current "click both to swap the chainring" that they have now.
I haven't worked it out in detail, but it might be one of those ideas that's great in theory, but rubbish in practice. Perhaps you end up with every gear change being a combined front and rear change.
The main problem I can see with their current method of changing the FD is that there's no way it can be extended to support a triple at the front.
I think you're talking about sequential shifting. To me that's a abismal idea, I think there will be a place for it but not for me or many other serious cyclists, to heck with efficiency I want to choose my own gears.One plays football, tennis or golf, one does not play at cycling0 -
WANT !!!!Rule #5 // Harden The Feck Up.
Rule #9 // If you are out riding in bad weather, it means you are a badass. Period.
Rule #12 // The correct number of bikes to own is n+1.
Rule #42 // A bike race shall never be preceded with a swim and/or followed by a run.0 -
I'm always wary of GCN reviews, relying as they do so heavily on product placements. Check out everyone using Garmin 520s in this video. And the likes of Garmin 1000s being strapped to bikes even when doing maintenance.
I'm not saying this is a fact but I'm pretty sure most of their income will come from the adverts that preceded their videos not the odd product placement.One plays football, tennis or golf, one does not play at cycling0 -
The wireless thing is nice, although to be honest, I'm actually more interested to hear about Rotor's new hydrualic group...0
-
I really like the look of it, seems they've done quite a few clever things with the design rather than just rush something wireless to market then do a proper job for v2. It sounds almost believable that they're only expecting firmware updates to fix things rather than redesigning stuff for the foreseeable future. Even the name's clever, much better than iRed that was first touted.
I'm going to seriously consider swapping to it next year but as my bike's only 10sp it's going to need a new rear as well which adds to the cost and I also fancy a new MTB, gah decisions. Hoping Shimano announce something soon due later 2016 so I have a good reason to wait.0 -
I'm looking forward to wireless brakes. Should enable them to do ABS, too.The wireless thing is nice, although to be honest, I'm actually more interested to hear about Rotor's new hydrualic group...0 -
I've no experience of any SRAM product and read these reviews with interest as I'm looking to upgrade the Dura Ace Mech system on my LOOK this winter with Di2 (prices may come down with this coming to market) I'm wondering whether to hold off now and see how this develops!
I love the quality of Dura Ace, can SRAM Red hold a candle to it??LOOK 795 Aerolight Dura ace Di2
LOOK 675 Dura ace mechanical
LOOK 595 105
Cinelli Zydeco0 -
I was going to swop from red to Di2 in January, then heard the rumours aboutSram wireless, and have been waiting in anticipation since. The problem I can see is, we have to wait until next year!
Although BR mentioned individual prices, do you think SRAM will be selling gear kits only from the off?
I would be surprised if they did, I would imagine we won't see gear sets for a good few months after it is available.Building:
S-Works Venge, Ultegra DI2, Carbon Clinchers
Race:
Moda Stretto, Force Groupset, American Classic Carbon 58`s
Winter:
Whyte Suffolk, Hydro Disks
Retro:
Tommasini Super Prestige Full Campagnolo C/W Delta`s0 -
I've no experience of any SRAM product and read these reviews with interest as I'm looking to upgrade the Dura Ace Mech system on my LOOK this winter with Di2 (prices may come down with this coming to market) I'm wondering whether to hold off now and see how this develops!
I love the quality of Dura Ace, can SRAM Red hold a candle to it??
I rode SRAM red recently and the quality is definitely up there as is the shift quality but I personally didn't like the double tap at all, I don't get how people think it's a more intuitive way of shifting, wasn't for me at all. Obviously this is a personal thing but I'd urge you to give Red a few rides before you decide if you can.One plays football, tennis or golf, one does not play at cycling0 -
I've no experience of any SRAM product and read these reviews with interest as I'm looking to upgrade the Dura Ace Mech system on my LOOK this winter with Di2 (prices may come down with this coming to market) I'm wondering whether to hold off now and see how this develops!
I love the quality of Dura Ace, can SRAM Red hold a candle to it??
I rode SRAM red recently and the quality is definitely up there as is the shift quality but I personally didn't like the double tap at all, I don't get how people think it's a more intuitive way of shifting, wasn't for me at all. Obviously this is a personal thing but I'd urge you to give Red a few rides before you decide if you can.
Cheers Joe, I intend trying an SRAM system if I can as it does seem a little counter intuitive to me but of course I suppose it's whatever you get use to! The only thing that bothers me then is my other bikes are all Shimano! Can imagine going from one system to another being a headache!LOOK 795 Aerolight Dura ace Di2
LOOK 675 Dura ace mechanical
LOOK 595 105
Cinelli Zydeco0 -
I've no experience of any SRAM product and read these reviews with interest as I'm looking to upgrade the Dura Ace Mech system on my LOOK this winter with Di2 (prices may come down with this coming to market) I'm wondering whether to hold off now and see how this develops!
I love the quality of Dura Ace, can SRAM Red hold a candle to it??
I rode SRAM red recently and the quality is definitely up there as is the shift quality but I personally didn't like the double tap at all, I don't get how people think it's a more intuitive way of shifting, wasn't for me at all. Obviously this is a personal thing but I'd urge you to give Red a few rides before you decide if you can.
Cheers Joe, I intend trying an SRAM system if I can as it does seem a little counter intuitive to me but of course I suppose it's whatever you get use to! The only thing that bothers me then is my other bikes are all Shimano! Can imagine going from one system to another being a headache!
I have SRAM and Shimano, it's no trouble whatsoever switching between the two. The only difference is the brake levers don't move on SRAM, the shifting is the same otherwise but just using one paddle each side with a short and long push.
I personally prefer the SRAM system, the eTap is different again but I see absolutely no issue getting used to that either. I've got Red so would be interested in switching to wireless next year if they just sell the mechs and shifters as a set.0 -
I've no experience of any SRAM product and read these reviews with interest as I'm looking to upgrade the Dura Ace Mech system on my LOOK this winter with Di2 (prices may come down with this coming to market) I'm wondering whether to hold off now and see how this develops!
I love the quality of Dura Ace, can SRAM Red hold a candle to it??
I rode SRAM red recently and the quality is definitely up there as is the shift quality but I personally didn't like the double tap at all, I don't get how people think it's a more intuitive way of shifting, wasn't for me at all. Obviously this is a personal thing but I'd urge you to give Red a few rides before you decide if you can.
Cheers Joe, I intend trying an SRAM system if I can as it does seem a little counter intuitive to me but of course I suppose it's whatever you get use to! The only thing that bothers me then is my other bikes are all Shimano! Can imagine going from one system to another being a headache!
I have SRAM and Shimano, it's no trouble whatsoever switching between the two. The only difference is the brake levers don't move on SRAM, the shifting is the same otherwise but just using one paddle each side with a short and long push.
I personally prefer the SRAM system, the eTap is different again but I see absolutely no issue getting used to that either. I've got Red so would be interested in switching to wireless next year if they just sell the mechs and shifters as a set.
Like I said that's obviously a personal thing, for me it was no good, plenty of people get on with it though of course.
I really like the way the etap shifts, obviously I haven't ridden it but in theory I think it would suit me down to the ground.One plays football, tennis or golf, one does not play at cycling0 -
I've no experience of any SRAM product and read these reviews with interest as I'm looking to upgrade the Dura Ace Mech system on my LOOK this winter with Di2 (prices may come down with this coming to market) I'm wondering whether to hold off now and see how this develops!
I love the quality of Dura Ace, can SRAM Red hold a candle to it??
I rode SRAM red recently and the quality is definitely up there as is the shift quality but I personally didn't like the double tap at all, I don't get how people think it's a more intuitive way of shifting, wasn't for me at all. Obviously this is a personal thing but I'd urge you to give Red a few rides before you decide if you can.
Cheers Joe, I intend trying an SRAM system if I can as it does seem a little counter intuitive to me but of course I suppose it's whatever you get use to! The only thing that bothers me then is my other bikes are all Shimano! Can imagine going from one system to another being a headache!
I have SRAM and Shimano, it's no trouble whatsoever switching between the two. The only difference is the brake levers don't move on SRAM, the shifting is the same otherwise but just using one paddle each side with a short and long push.
I personally prefer the SRAM system, the eTap is different again but I see absolutely no issue getting used to that either. I've got Red so would be interested in switching to wireless next year if they just sell the mechs and shifters as a set.
Like I said that's obviously a personal thing, for me it was no good, plenty of people get on with it though of course.
I really like the way the etap shifts, obviously I haven't ridden it but in theory I think it would suit me down to the ground.
I find the systems so similar I don't really understand why people don't get on with one or the other. If I had to be picky and split them I'd say the SRAM shifts down the cassette are quicker and much more positive, but Shimano is slightly easier to drop into a lower gear when climbing as the push on the brake lever is slightly shorter than pushing the SRAM lever across.
As I said though, that's splitting hairs really. Push a brake lever or push a paddle? Makes no difference to me.0 -
From an engineering viewpoint Di2 and the new SRAM system are most impressive though I've never been on a bike ride and thought that I could really do with electronic shifting! I don't think mechanical dura ace can really be beaten. Also reliability of electronic shifting puts me off as if you are 50 miles from home and it stops working you are stuffed or have to single speed it home!0
-
[url=http://www.bikeradar.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=19701966#p19701966]Stanley the 2nd[/url] wrote:From an engineering viewpoint Di2 and the new SRAM system are most impressive though I've never been on a bike ride and thought that I could really do with electronic shifting! I don't think mechanical dura ace can really be beaten. Also reliability of electronic shifting puts me off as if you are 50 miles from home and it stops working you are stuffed or have to single speed it home!
Di2 stuffs any mechanical groupset when it somes to shifting, including Dura Ace. All of your Di2 worries can be answered in the thread linked below:
viewtopic.php?f=40042&t=130070440 -
I've been using my Di2 in paddle shift mode for almost two years. The front buttons do the front mech and the rear buttons do the rear mech. It's a much better system but it does take a couple of rides for it to become second nature.
The point with this is Di2 gives you the choice to set up like this, or in any other permutation, the SRAM system doesn't.
Also, what about 'press and hold', is that programmable? Di2 is... 2 cogs, 3 cogs, continuous transit across the cassette.
The slow shifting thing is a red herring. It will be down to the torque available from the tiny battery and has nothing to do with wear on chains or cassettes. Di2 lets you choose derailluer speed, so if you believe SRAM, you can set your bike up like that.
On Di2, shifting front and rear mechs at the same time (whilst still loaded up) is a wonderful thing. With SRAM, you must change one, then the other.
Faced with buying again today, it would still be Di2 for me.Boardman Elite SLR 9.2S
Boardman FS Pro0 -
Faced with buying today, you'd have no choice
My blog: http://www.roubaixcycling.cc (kit reviews and other musings)
https://twitter.com/roubaixcc
Facebook? No. Just say no.0
